Android text to speech
Can anyone tell me if it’s reliable and pleasant enough to listen to logos books via text to speech/ voice ov er or similar on android? I’m thinking of getting an android phone. My iphones battery just isn’t good enough so im thinking of a moto g7 power.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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John Goodman said:
Can anyone tell me if it’s reliable and pleasant enough to listen to logos books via text to speech/ voice ov er or similar on android? I’m thinking of getting an android phone. My iphones battery just isn’t good enough so im thinking of a moto g7 power.
If there is a way in the Android app to do that, I haven't found it yet. I've read about something like that being available on Amazon Fire and IOS devices but even that is not from within the Logos app but rather from the operating system.
I hope I'm wrong.
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John Goodman said:
Can anyone tell me if it’s reliable and pleasant enough to listen to logos books via text to speech/ voice ov er or similar on android? I’m thinking of getting an android phone. My iphones battery just isn’t good enough so im thinking of a moto g7 power.
So, the answer is that it is not yet completed on Andriod devices: https://logosmobile.uservoice.com/forums/190765-logos-mobile-apps/suggestions/3671914-enable-read-aloud-or-text-to-speech-like-in-the-de But, I WOULD LOOOOVE LOVE LOVE to see this happen. Definitely on my top 5 request list.
However, I need to test some more. But, was getting it to somewhat work on my andriod phone in the web app. https://app.logos.com/ So, we can hope that that might work......
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The UserVoice petition was last updated back in 2014, which is half a decade ago at the time of writing this reply. Concluding from this silence, I think it is safe to assume that nothing more is going to happen anytime soon.
So a more relevant question is whether there are any workarounds.
I have been unsuccessful in getting the system TTS to work with Logos. It reads GUI elements and the page number, but that is all. I have not tried any third party screen readers, but I suspect they will fail as well.
A different approach might be to export book sections from the desktop app, and make the screen reader use the resulting document. I have not tried this yet, but I might. I do not know what the export limit is, but I have sometimes printed out entire chapters in order to read them from paper. It might be worth the attempt. Also, perhaps one can find a screen reader that can bee tweaked to read bible references correctly.
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John Goodman said:
My iphones battery just isn’t good enough
Which specific iPhone? Did you get a new one already?
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I've gone for a moto one vision... coping without read aloud on my phone for now. But I miss it. Reading other posts, I think faithlife kind of regrets the existence of the feature and feel it prevents sales of audiobooks. Personally I don't understand this, I spend a lot on audiobooks but they don't have much of a selection so I go elsewhere. For me this is an accessibility feature and it is a huge disappointment that faithlife are not willing to make it happen. Particularly given the number of niche texts that would become available to people who struggle with vision, dyslexia and other problems. None of which will ever be recorded as audiobooks.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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John Goodman said:
...this is an accessibility feature and it is a huge disappointment that faithlife are not willing to make it happen. Particularly given the number of niche texts that would become available to people who struggle with vision, dyslexia and other problems. None of which will ever be recorded as audiobooks.
I don't know FaithLife's reasons for not yet having implemented Android text to speech (technical challenges? cost? legal issues?) but I agree that it would be great to have it. It would be wonderful to listen to my Logos books while out driving or walking or weeding the garden.
Your points, John, about accessibility for the visually impaired and making available texts not rendered as audio books are compelling.
I've added my 3 votes and hopefully other forum users who see this thread will consider adding theirs.
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John Goodman said:
Reading other posts, I think faithlife kind of regrets the existence of the feature and feel it prevents sales of audiobooks.
Please share the "other posts" you've read and explain your reasoning. I've never read any posts that imply what you've said.
John Goodman said:For me this is an accessibility feature and it is a huge disappointment that faithlife are not willing to make it happen.
How do you know that "faithlife are not willing to make it happen"
Faithlife responded to you regarding this issue many years ago: https://community.logos.com/forums/p/41565/528418.aspx#528418 . Nothing has changed since then.
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T-Bone said:
Please share the "other posts" you've read and explain your reasoning. I've never read any posts that imply what you've said.
I don't have time to search the forums for you - the summary of what faithlife has said as I understand it is:
Read aloud on ios was not intentional but a nice benefit of ios design. They actually removed it at one point and it was only through asking on this forum that it was reinstated.
It is seen as a competitor to being able to sell audio books.
They have not stated any intention to implement it on Android.
The explanation on the thread you mentioned is a bit daft. The android speech api is very simple... they could easily do this if they want to.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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John Goodman said:
The explanation on the thread you mentioned is a bit daft.
Indeed. It was several years ago, but I still remember it for its epic silliness.
macOS (Logos Pro - Beta) | Android 13 (Logos Stable)
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John Goodman said:I don't have time to search the forums for you - the summary of what faithlife has said as I understand it is:
I didn't ask you to search the forums for me; I already know such posts don't exist and that your understanding is false. I'm not trying to be negative but am just being truthful.
John Goodman said:Read aloud on ios was not intentional but a nice benefit of ios design.
True.
John Goodman said:They actually removed it at one point and it was only through asking on this forum that it was reinstated.
This is false. VoiceOver support was unintentionally dropped (not intentionally removed) as a result of an updated display implementation and that bug was fixed.
John Goodman said:It is seen as a competitor to being able to sell audio books.
Again, I've seen no proof that Faithlife has stated this and you've offered none.
John Goodman said:They have not stated any intention to implement it on Android.
True.
John Goodman said:The explanation on the thread you mentioned is a bit daft. The android speech api is very simple... they could easily do this if they want to.
Are you another armchair developer? Faithlife is hiring: https://faithlife.com/jobs/AndroidSoftwareDeveloper .
Basically you seem to be implying that Faithlife developers either lied to you in that thread or are just plain stupid. I expect you know nothing about the Android implementation of the Faithlife Mobile apps or how difficult it may be to implement android.speech.tts into the multiple coding languages that comprise different parts of the Android Mobile app.
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John, I know you just purchased an Android phone, but iOS has a system-wide speak screen function as an accessibility feature. I use it almost every day to read Logos resources when I work out at the gym. They have voices you can download in many English dialects. If you are within your return window and would consider an iPhone, it could do what you want.
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Robert M. Warren said:John Goodman said:
The explanation on the thread you mentioned is a bit daft.
Indeed. It was several years ago, but I still remember it for its epic silliness.
Those who know nothing about the underlying structure of the Faithlife Android Mobile apps somehow have the most arrogant confidence in their absolute ignorance. Reminds me of a manager I once had.
Years ago I remember reading your posts about Faithlife purposely programming a "kill-switch" (your words) to prevent customers from installing old unsupported versions of the Faithlife Android Mobile apps. "... the fix is in because a programmed kill-switch will sabotage the installation."https://community.logos.com/forums/p/154881/939383.aspx#939383
https://community.logos.com/forums/p/156266/943388.aspx#943388
Then, you extended your "kill-switch" conspiracy theory to the iOS apps:
https://community.logos.com/forums/p/165434/969484.aspx#969484
There never was a programmed kill-switch to sabotage any installation - it's simply called "dropping support".
Robert, why doesn't Microsoft support Windows 3.1, Windows 95, Windows XP, or Windows 7? Is that a Microsoft "Kill-Switch"? Or, could it be that it's a money losing proposition.?
Why doesn't Samsung support Android 4.4, 5.0, 5.1, 6.0, 7.0, etc? A Samsung "Kill-Switch"? Or, could it be that not enough customers are using those Android versions to make it profitable to support them?
Faithlife's standard is to drop support for platforms that lose money for the company. Every company wants to stay in business. The first mandate of any business is to stay in business. If (for example) supporting a platform used by 2% of customers ends up costing 6% of the support budget, that is bad for business. This is remedial economics and should be understood by anyone who budgets their money.Faithlife doesn't have a money tree that Jesus renews every day with $100 dollar bills like manna from heaven, just in case you didn't know that already. It seems really daft of me to have to mention that but it's no less silly than your assumption that Faithlife could easily implement text to speech in the Faithlife Android mobile apps.
Or, maybe you think Faithlife already solved the Android Mobile app text-to-speech issue years ago but is purposely holding it back to punish customers. John might agree with that false premise.
As I mentioned to John, Faithlife is hiring and I recommend you sign up for an interview. Do it up, get hired and fix all the things that Faithlife is too dumb to fix!
Good luck.0 -
Whoa! Looks like somebody's got a bad case of the Moondays! You're clearly emotionally invested somehow, so keep the cheese; just let me out of the trap. If I'm wrong, don't send it in to Guinness, just forgive me or sue me. I am however, flattered you've kept a dossier on me.
macOS (Logos Pro - Beta) | Android 13 (Logos Stable)
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Your Ad hominem is showing.Robert M. Warren said:Whoa! Looks like somebody's got a bad case of the Moondays! You're clearly emotionally invested somehow, so keep the cheese; just let me out of the trap. If I'm wrong, don't send it in to Guinness, just forgive me or sue me. I am however, flattered you've kept a dossier on me.
I expected you weren't able to respond with facts. Have a nice day.!
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T-Bone a sock puppet?! 15 posts and you've been around for years eh.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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T-Bone said:
Your Ad hominem is showing.
I expected you weren't able to respond with facts. Have a nice day.!
For the record, I don't even like hominy, you can ask my wife.
What I found 'silly' about the post linked above is the stated difficulty with extracting surface text. While I certainly don't know how to do it, someone at FL certainly does, since it appears on the Android screen and Read Aloud reads aloud the surface text on Desktop. It appears that both platforms use the same resource file (same name, apparently the same file size).
Regarding the 'kill-switch':
Daniel Di Bartolo said:you will still be able to use Logos. However, it's unsupported, which means that if you delete it off of your device, you won't be able to get it back.
'You won't be able to get it back' either means a guy named Guido will come to your door and stop the re-installation on the reset phone, or there is some online mechanism that rejects the APK or prevents log in to the reinstalled app. If you don't like the term 'kill-switch', you can call it a kumquat; it is what it is.
macOS (Logos Pro - Beta) | Android 13 (Logos Stable)
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Robert M. Warren said:Daniel Di Bartolo said:
you will still be able to use Logos. However, it's unsupported, which means that if you delete it off of your device, you won't be able to get it back.
'You won't be able to get it back' either means a guy named Guido will come to your door and stop the re-installation on the reset phone, or there is some online mechanism that rejects the APK or prevents log in to the reinstalled app.
Or that the average customer who knows of no other methods of downloading apps than by getting them from the default app store won't be able to get that version of the app back because it will no longer be possible to download it from the app store.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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Robert M. Warren said:
What I found 'silly' about the post linked above is the stated difficulty with extracting surface text. While I certainly don't know how to do it, someone at FL certainly does, since it appears on the Android screen and Read Aloud reads aloud the surface text on Desktop. It appears that both platforms use the same resource file (same name, apparently the same file size).
Okay, so you've decided Faithlife is lying to you about Text to Speech on Android since "someone at FL certainly does [know how to do it].?" Interesting. Could it be that the Windows, macOS, Android and iOS implementations are all radically different? Could it be that you don't have enough information to determine a valid conclusion?
Robert M. Warren said:'You won't be able to get it back' either means a guy named Guido will come to your door and stop the re-installation on the reset phone, or there is some online mechanism that rejects the APK or prevents log in to the reinstalled app.
This is absolutely false! There are multiple ways to "get it back" - it's just that you won't be able to install old unsupported versions from the Google Play Store. (The Apple Store allows one to do this but Google Play doesn't.)
Recommendations:
1. Before January 1, 2020 install the latest supported app(s) and version(s) and save the APK's somewhere. If you ever need to perform a factory reset on your device you can sideload those APK's and they will run just as before.
Faithlife *will not* prevent you from installing, signing in or running the apps unless there is some unforeseen circumstance (like the TLS 1.2 security issue that happened over the last year that affected Android and Windows but not iOS).2. You can download and install older Faithlife Mobile app APK's from any of the many third-party APK stores.
3. You can call Faithlife Customer support and they may be able to work with on a case-by-case basis to "get back" older unsupported versions of the Android Mobile app APK's.
Robert M. Warren said:If you don't like the term 'kill-switch', you can call it a kumquat; it is what it is.
I'm sure we can agree that words and definitions matter, otherwise why would we bother using Logos Bible Software?
The standard definition of "kill switch" when related to software means (for example) that on January 1, 2020 Faithlife will permanently disable any currently installed Faithlife Mobile apps on Android 5.1 (or below) from running, starting, etc. In other words those apps will be inoperable even if you install them again (from a backup or another store) because Faithlife will remotely kill them like an emergency shutoff switch at the gas station. Faithlife doesn't do that, has never done that and never will do that.0 -
John Goodman said:
T-Bone a sock puppet?! 15 posts and you've been around for years eh.
Nah, just a former Faithlife employee on the Mobile team. Yes, I've been around for nearly 8 years and have tried to help you many times in the past. Unfortunately I've only got 4,264 posts since I stopped posting in mid-2017. Could have been over 7,000 by now but the number of posts matters less than the content of them (to me, anyway). And no, I don't get paid for posting anything here.
Here's an old post that explains why VoiceOver support broke on iOS as a result of implementing iOS scrolling view, and you were on the thread: https://community.logos.com/forums/t/97152.aspx . As I mentioned in this thread "VoiceOver support was unintentionally dropped (not intentionally removed) as a result of an updated display implementation and that bug was fixed."Just trying to correct misinformation whenever I see it since there is a lot of it out there.
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Robert M. Warren said:
rejects the APK or prevents log in to the reinstalled app.
That summarizes my two experiences trying to side-load old Logos Android APKs.
'Kill-swith' in my reply in the older thread meant what the context clearly states: a prevention of installation of the old APK.
T-Bone said:3. You can call Faithlife Customer support and they may be able to work with on a case-by-case basis to "get back"
'You can call Customer Service and they might help you get it back' is not the same as, and in fact is totally opposite to, 'you won't be able to get it back' or 'no support'.
macOS (Logos Pro - Beta) | Android 13 (Logos Stable)
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T-Bone, glad you aren't a sock puppet;) but my statement was not false... perhaps not quite accurate enough but voiceover support was removed by faithlife and yes it was linked to an update. It definitely took some careful persuasion that this was a regression and the impact of audiobook sales was brought up by faithlife. I think it is a real disappointment that accessibility features get conflated with audio books. I make extensive use of both.
The problem is, I can see just how close to wonderful Logos is for accessibility and how it opens up a world of possibility for certain people. I do believe it is low hanging fruit that could be a tremendous blessing to many folks and I can't be sure but I expect would win some extra sales that would be worth it compared to the development outlay.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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Robert M. Warren said:Robert M. Warren said:
rejects the APK or prevents log in to the reinstalled app.
That summarizes my two experiences trying to side-load old Logos Android APKs.
'Kill-swith' in my reply in the older thread meant what the context clearly states: a prevention of installation of the old APK.
T-Bone said:3. You can call Faithlife Customer support and they may be able to work with on a case-by-case basis to "get back"
'You can call Customer Service and they might help you get it back' is not the same as, and in fact is totally opposite to, 'you won't be able to get it back' or 'no support'.
- "Kill switch" doesn't mean what you think it does.
- Side loading apk's isn't supported (and never was). I was just trying to help you.
- How valuable is your time in dollars per hour?
- Would it be more profitable for you to keep complaining about things that you can't change, or just purchase a new device?0 -
T-Bone said:
Would it be more profitable for you to keep complaining about things that you can't change, or just purchase a new device?
No, my mission in life to to provide catharsis opportunities for exers who finally have a chance to unload on the dumb ol' users.
macOS (Logos Pro - Beta) | Android 13 (Logos Stable)
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John Goodman said:
but my statement was not false... perhaps not quite accurate enough but voiceover support was removed by faithlife and yes it was linked to an update.
Actually, your statement was false. It seems you don't know much about how things work.
VoiceOver support was never "removed" by Faithlife. A new display implementation (Scrolling View) was coded and VoiceOver support wasn't immediately supported in Scrolling View.
VoiceOver support was never "removed" from the existing default Paging View implementation and VoiceOver support still worked as expected while using Paging View.When Scrolling View became the default display setting it turned out that VoiceOver didn't work - not because it was "removed" from Scrolling VIew but because some new development work was needed to make VoiceOver work in Scrolling View.
In short, VoiceOver support wasn't "removed" from Scrolling View because the code wasn't written yet. One can't "remove" non-existing code.
No, it didn't. It wasn't a regression because the code to implement VoiceOver while in Scrolling View didn't exist yet.John Goodman said:It definitely took some careful persuasion that this was a regression
When and where was this brought up by Faithlife? Links, emails, etc? I don't believe you and I need some proof.John Goodman said:the impact of audiobook sales was brought up by faithlife.
Your dreams are simply not grounded in reality and Accessibility is anything but low hanging fruit. Sorry, just telling you the truth.John Goodman said:The problem is, I can see just how close to wonderful Logos is for accessibility and how it opens up a world of possibility for certain people. I do believe it is low hanging fruit that could be a tremendous blessing to many folks and I can't be sure but I expect would win some extra sales that would be worth it compared to the development outlay.
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John Goodman said:
but my statement was not false... perhaps not quite accurate enough but voiceover support was removed by faithlife and yes it was linked to an update.
Actually, your statement was false.
VoiceOver support was never "removed" by Faithlife. A new display implementation (Scrolling View) was coded and VoiceOver support wasn't immediately supported in Scrolling View.
VoiceOver support was never "removed" from the existing default Paging View implementation and VoiceOver support still worked as expected while using Paging View.
When Scrolling View became the default display setting it turned out that VoiceOver didn't work - not because it was "removed" from Scrolling View but because some new development work was needed to make VoiceOver work in Scrolling View.
In short, VoiceOver support wasn't "removed" from Scrolling View because the code wasn't written yet. One can't "remove" non-existing code.
John Goodman said:It definitely took some careful persuasion that this was a regression
No, it didn't. It wasn't a regression because the code to implement VoiceOver while in Scrolling View didn't exist yet.
John Goodman said:the impact of audiobook sales was brought up by faithlife.
When and where was this brought up by Faithlife? Links, emails, etc?
John Goodman said:The problem is, I can see just how close to wonderful Logos is for accessibility and how it opens up a world of possibility for certain people. I do believe it is low hanging fruit that could be a tremendous blessing to many folks and I can't be sure but I expect would win some extra sales that would be worth it compared to the development outlay.
Accessibility is anything but low hanging fruit. Sorry, just telling you the truth.
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Okay. If it's more profitable for you to keep complaining about things that you can't change, good luck.Robert M. Warren said:T-Bone said:Would it be more profitable for you to keep complaining about things that you can't change, or just purchase a new device?
No, my mission in life to to provide catharsis opportunities for exers who finally have a chance to unload on the dumb ol' users.
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T-Bone said:
Nah, just a former Faithlife employee on the Mobile team. Yes, I've been around for nearly 8 years and have tried to help you many times in the past. Unfortunately I've only got 4,264 posts since I stopped posting in mid-2017. Could have been over 7,000 by now but the number of posts matters less than the content of them (to me, anyway). And no, I don't get paid for posting anything here.
Thanks for clarifying who you are. You have been very helpful in the past, but your "T-Bone" persona hasn't nearly been quite as helpful. It isn't a good look for you or FL. Getting clarification from a former employee could be very helpful in the forums. I encourage you to stick around.
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T-Bone can you not appreciate that I'm simply advocating for a feature and you are being quite antagonistic. Do you really want to keep asserting that faithlife, as a company that has such an incredible track record and feature set for books, can't manage to pipe the text to the android speech api? Are you trying to help their PR? It's just crazy.
I totally accept that it isn't currently a priority. I'm advocating for it. Advocacy has worked on other occasions. See our success with wine on linux. I appreciate that faithlife is a company that listens with a leader who listens. Why not entertain yourself with a good book instead?
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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John Goodman said:T-Bone can you not appreciate that I'm simply advocating for a feature
Yes, I can appreciate it.
John Goodman said:and you are being quite antagonistic.
No, I'm simply being realistic.
John Goodman said:Do you really want to keep asserting that faithlife, as a company that has such an incredible track record and feature set for books, can't manage to pipe the text to the android speech api? Are you trying to help their PR? It's just crazy.
No, what I want doesn't matter and I'm simply stating the facts. You seem to think this is a simple thing (and it's silly or "daft" that this hasn't yet been implemented)!. You've implied that Faithlife developers are either liars or stupid and I reject your implications.
John Goodman said:I totally accept that it isn't currently a priority. I'm advocating for it. Advocacy has worked on other occasions.
Yes, please keep advocating for it.John Goodman said:Advocacy has worked on other occasions. See our success with wine on linux.
Faithlife has nothing to do with wine or linux.0 -
Read the linux thread... you'll understand. I'm saying the explanation was daft. The devs are obviously quite skilled.
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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John Goodman said:
Read the linux thread... you'll understand.
I’ve read the Linux thread. For nearly a decade a small number of users begged Faithlife to create Logos for Linux but it was simply wasn’t (and still isn’t) a financially viable solution. Eventually Wine got better and users found a workaround by running the Windows version of Logos - that’s great! But Faithlife had nothing to do with it.
John Goodman said:I'm saying the explanation was daft. The devs are obviously quite skilled.
The explanation was given by a developer, in fact one of the smartest Android developers I’ve every worked with. Drew and I shared an office at that time. At this point I expect an extremely detailed 50 page treatise on the matter still wouldn’t convince you anything. So, believe whatever you want.
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Thanks, Benjamin!
Are you referring to @Voice Aloud Reader by Hyperionics Technology? https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hyperionics.avar&hl=en&gl=US
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Yes that's the one. Not very intuitive but works great once you've played around with it for a bit. Such a time saver for me!
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