Greater Damnation

MarCya

I know that there are some really intelligent and biblically educated men and women on here so I am coming to you for help.

There are three verses in the New Testament about greater damnation, which I don't understand.  Since it is in there three times I am sure it must be very important, yet it's hard for me to believe that there is greater damnation for some than others... I'd never heard this before.

If you know the answers to my questions can you please provide me with scripture of context so that it will make sense to me?  I SO appreciate your help.

Matt 23:14 - Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows’ houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

Mark 12:40 - Which devour widows’ houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation

Luke 20:47 - Which devour widows’ houses, and for a shew make long prayers: the same shall receive greater damnation

My First Question: Is there actually greater Damnation for some than others?  How can that be?  Or do these verses mean something else and I am just not understanding it?

Secondly, how do I use Logos 4 to find these kinds of answers for myself?  I have the library study addition and cannot afford to buy the bigger sets.

Last question for you is this, Is there a better or more appropriate place online to ask these types of questions?  I hate to admit it, but my pastor is young and not the best source for finding answers.  I want only God's honest truth about everything, not just man's opinions.  (I don't mean that to sound snarky either - I am just seeking truth)  I am hungry for God's truths but not well educated or good at finding answers by myself.

Thank you ALL so much for any help you can provide!

 

MJ. Smith

MarCya said:

Last question for you is this, Is there a better or more appropriate place online to ask these types of questions?

Welcome to the Logos forums.  On these forums, we can assist you on how to use Logos but we stay away from theology and Scriptural interpretation. Or at least we are supposed to - see the forum guidelines. The link for them is on the upper right of the forum home page.

There are other site that do engage in theological discussions but given the theological bent I assume from your posting, I fear I don't know them.

I'd begin by doing a search on "greater damnation" and greater NEAR damnation. That should give you an idea of other searches that might help. You might also do a Bible search on those particular verses.

Kevin Becker

MarCya, also you might want to run a passage guide on these verses you've cited. the commentaries in your library will probably give you some interpretive options and suggestions for further reading

Todd Phillips

MJ. Smith said:

I'd begin by doing a search on "greater
damnation" and greater NEAR damnation.

or "greater
condemnation" (to use the language used in modern translations).

MarCya said:

My First Question: Is there actually greater Damnation for some than others?  How can that be?  Or do these verses mean something else and I am just not understanding it?

Considering the testimony of the Word in these verses, perhaps an alternate approach is to question your own presuppositions--you should ask yourself why you would think that it cannot be? 

See James 3:1 for a related passage.

MarCya said:

Secondly, how do I use Logos 4 to find these kinds of answers for myself?  I have the library study addition and cannot afford to buy the bigger sets.

In addition to searches, I'd also check out some commentaries to get theological reflection on the verses. I'm not sure what you mean by "library study edition", but if you mean "Bible Study Library", then your most detailed commentaries are:

The Bible Knowledge Commentary,
Commentary on the Bible, by Matthew Henry,
Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible, by Jamieson,
Fausset, and Brown

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/140518#Comment_140518

Todd Phillips said:

See James 3:1 for a related passage.

Welcome, MarCya,

I want to affirm Todd's counsel. If Scribes & Pharisees opened themselves to a greater condemnation, it's because they presumed to teach (James 3:1) what they weren't willing to practice, with the result that they ended up shutting others out of the Kingdom (Matthew 23:13, another verse I'd commend to you). Lastly, regarding those who deter others from entering the kingdom, see Mt 18:6 = Mk 9:42 = Luke 17:2, another verse headed in the same direction.

Todd Phillips said:

check out some commentaries to get theological reflection on the verses

I also want to affirm Todd's counsel in checking out commentaries in your collection. An easy way to do that would be to go to your home page, key in any of the scriptures, & then dive into the Word.

God bless!

Ted Hans

From a Logos resource[:)].

20:47 who devoura widows’ houses and for-pretenseb they-pray lengthy (prayers). These will-receive greater condemnation.

LEXICON—
c. κρίμα (LN 56.30) (BAGD 4.b. p. 450): ‘condemnation’ [BAGD, LN], ‘punishment’ [BAGD]. This means a ‘judicial verdict’ and mostly refers to the sentence of condemnation, yet it may include the subsequent punishment itself [BAGD]. The clause ‘they will receive greater condemnation’ [BECNT, WBC; NASB] is also translated ‘they will receive the greater condemnation’ [NRSV], ‘these will receive a greater punishment’ [HCSB, NCV], ‘such men will receive a heavier sentence’ [NTC], ‘they will receive more abundant punishment’ [Arn], ‘they will receive a more severe punishment’ [NET], ‘they will incur the severest condemnation’ [AB], ‘their punishment will be the greater’ [NLT], ‘their punishment will be all the worse’ [TEV], ‘the sentence they receive will be all the more severe’ [REB], ‘these teachers will be punished most of all’ [CEV], ‘the same shall receive greater damnation’ [KJV], ‘these shall take more abundant judgment’ [Lns], ‘the scribes will receive the most severe punishment’ [GW], ‘such men will be punished most severely’ [NIV]. See this word at 23:40.

QUESTION—What is involved in their condemnation and what is being compared?
God will condemn them [AB, Arn]. This refers to the final eschatological judgment [AB, Lns]. All wrongdoing will be punished, but especially that which is cloaked in religious devotion [Arn]. God will punish them more severely than he would otherwise [TG]. God will punish them more severely than others who had not done so [TH, WBC]. God will punish them more severely than other Jews who did not claim greater piety and did not enjoy as many spiritual privileges as they do [NIC]. Those who are leaders of a religious community and use their position for personal profit will receive heavy punishment because God’s punishment is given in proportion to their knowledge and guilt [Su].
Blight, R. C. (2008). An Exegetical Summary of Luke 12-24 (2nd ed.) (359–361). Dallas, TX: SIL International.

The punishment for these scribes would be especially severe because as teachers they were responsible for shaping the faith of the people. But they saddled people with petty rules while they, themselves, lived greedily and deceitfully. Their behavior gave a pretense of piety, while they oppressed and misled the very people they were supposed to lead. Jesus solemnly announced, “Their punishment will be the greater.” These words certainly must have affected the disciple James, for he later wrote, “Not many of you should become teachers … for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness” (James 3:1 NRSV).
Barton, B. B., Veerman, D., Taylor, L. C., & Osborne, G. R. (1997). Luke. Life application Bible commentary (468). Wheaton, Ill.: Tyndale House Publishers.

 

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/140532#Comment_140532

On this thread we need to be extra careful not to slip into theological interpretation rather than the use of Logos.

It was for this reason that I carefully omitted a reference to a great source: Dante's Inferno [;)]