Is Verbum Ordinariate the Anglican version of Verbum?
Is Verbum Ordinariate the Anglican version of Verbum?
What exactly is Ordinariate?
Comments
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Kathleen Marie said:
Is Verbum Ordinariate the Anglican version of Verbum?
No, it is resources for Catholics using the Anglican rite i.e. their missal is in the Sarum Missal/Book of Common Prayer tradition.
Ordinariate is a term describing the governance of these groups.
Wikipedia said:"Personal ordinariate" is the term used for each of the three existing ordinariates in the decree that established them: the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham, the Personal Ordinariate of the Chair of Saint Peter and the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of the Southern Cross. It is also the collective name given to all three in the official yearbook of the Holy See and is a name the ordinariates themselves use.
"Ordinariates for former Anglicans" is a term sometimes used by the ordinariates themselves, by news sources (but not official documents) of the Holy See and episcopal conferences. This terminology, however, does not mean that an ordinariate's membership exclusively comprises former Anglicans. The head of the North American ordinariate has said that "ordinariates for former Anglicans must be a bridge to Christian unity and a force for true ecumenism" and the members must "build and rebuild our relationships with confreres who have stayed behind in the Anglican Church".
"Anglican ordinariates" is often used by newspapers, such as the Church of England Newspaper and the Canadian Catholic Register. It is also often used by communities belonging to the ordinariates. The name does not imply that the members of an ordinariate are still Anglicans. While those who have been Anglicans "bring with them, into the full communion of the Catholic Church in all its diversity and richness of liturgical rites and traditions, aspects of their own Anglican patrimony and culture which are consonant with the Catholic Faith", they are "Catholics of the Latin Rite, within the full communion of the Catholic Church ... no longer part of any other communion".
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:Kathleen Marie said:
Is Verbum Ordinariate the Anglican version of Verbum?
No, it is resources for Catholics using the Anglican rite i.e. their missal is in the Sarum Missal/Book of Common Prayer tradition.
I think I know what was tripping me up, now. The Catholic definition of Catholic is different than the modern Protestant definition of Catholic.
Thanks!
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Kathleen Marie said:
I think I know what was tripping me up, now. The Catholic definition of Catholic is different than the modern Protestant definition of Catholic.
Catholics and Protestants use catholic (small c) in the same sense. Catholics and Protestants often disagree on the meaning of Catholic with a big C - to Catholics it means all the rites Eastern and Western that recognize the Bishop of Rome as the earthly, organizational head of the Church. Most Protestants only know of the "Roman rite" and therefore think Catholic means "Roman" Catholic - a term that has no real meaning. It is my observation based on these forums that the knowledge of American Protestants (excluding the Middle Way Anglicans and Lutherans) are poorly informed on the historical/current Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox Churches despite the fact that both of them flourished before the Western Church did.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:
No, it is resources for Catholics using the Anglican rite i.e. their missal is in the Sarum Missal/Book of Common Prayer tradition.
Actually, not quite. The liturgy used by the Personal Ordinariates established originally for former Anglicans is not a "rite", and it is definitely not an Anglican rite (Wikipedia notwithstanding). The Ordinariates' divine liturgy (or Mass), which uses Divine Worship: The Missal is the Novus Ordo with modifications derived from the Anglican liturgical tradition, and it is governed by the General Instruction of the Roman Missal except when and where otherwise indicated.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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MJ. Smith said:Kathleen Marie said:
I think I know what was tripping me up, now. The Catholic definition of Catholic is different than the modern Protestant definition of Catholic.
Catholics and Protestants use catholic (small c) in the same sense. Catholics and Protestants often disagree on the meaning of Catholic with a big C - to Catholics it means all the rites Eastern and Western that recognize the Bishop of Rome as the earthly, organizational head of the Church. Most Protestants only know of the "Roman rite" and therefore think Catholic means "Roman" Catholic - a term that has no real meaning. It is my observation based on these forums that the knowledge of American Protestants (excluding the Middle Way Anglicans and Lutherans) are poorly informed on the historical/current Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox Churches despite the fact that both of them flourished before the Western Church did.
Thank you! I did a little research on what you posted, and I have filled in some more gaps and corrected some misinformation that I have absorbed over the years.
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SineNomine said:MJ. Smith said:
No, it is resources for Catholics using the Anglican rite i.e. their missal is in the Sarum Missal/Book of Common Prayer tradition.
Actually, not quite. The liturgy used by the Personal Ordinariates established originally for former Anglicans is not a "rite", and it is definitely not an Anglican rite (Wikipedia notwithstanding). The Ordinariates' divine liturgy (or Mass), which uses Divine Worship: The Missal is the Novus Ordo with modifications derived from the Anglican liturgical tradition, and it is governed by the General Instruction of the Roman Missal except when and where otherwise indicated.
Thank you for this link. It is clearer than what I read yesterday about the missal. It seems that some people are not happy with some quality of the missal and want to retain their BCP's for daily prayer, but a lot of the details of what was discussed and the unwritten background of what was being discussed went over my head. And the page devoted to the sale of the missal did not fill in my gaps, that your link did. Thanks!
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SineNomine said:MJ. Smith said:
No, it is resources for Catholics using the Anglican rite i.e. their missal is in the Sarum Missal/Book of Common Prayer tradition.
Actually, not quite. The liturgy used by the Personal Ordinariates established originally for former Anglicans is not a "rite", and it is definitely not an Anglican rite (Wikipedia notwithstanding). The Ordinariates' divine liturgy (or Mass), which uses Divine Worship: The Missal is the Novus Ordo with modifications derived from the Anglican liturgical tradition, and it is governed by the General Instruction of the Roman Missal except when and where otherwise indicated.
You are correct; I over simplified.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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I returned all the Logos Anglican stuff. For several reasons. I'm just going to stick with the Verbum resources built for Verbum and demonstrated in the videos.
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