CEO Bill McCarthy on Launch Perks
Comments
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Jerry Bush said:
Any update on the bug, Mark?
On Monday, I was told, "Hopefully this week, but maybe next week."
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Frank Sauer said:
Also, any update on the Bi-Annual option?
Rather than a bi-annual option, it's more likely you'll be able to purchase multiple years upfront if you wish. So it would be an annual subscription, but you could choose to pay for two (or more?) years from the outset. Our subscription engine doesn't support that at the moment, so it's not it's something we'd need to build, but we might be able to add support for that before launch.
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Frank Sauer said:
Is a "Features Only" Option being considered? (To continue the historical options of "No Library" Subscriptions and the ability to purchase just the Feature Set)
I think that's unlikely because (1) we want to simplify our product lines to make it easier for people to find the right package, and (2) many features require specific books, and more features will require other books in the future, and (3) if we know all subscribers have got particular books, that makes documentation and training easier.
I know there's a strong feeling here that people don't want to pay for books twice, and I get that. But, as I've said before, we're assuming that most L10 owners will own most of the features and most of the books in the subscription, and that's why they're discounted so heavily.
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danwdoo said:
Just to clarify, I am a long time Logos Connect subscriber with a renewal date at the end of August. Should I take this to mean I should go ahead and subscribe to a Logos subscription anytime between now and that renewal date or should I continue waiting as we were previously told to do?
By all means, subscribe if you want to, but if you do, then either:
- You'll need to pay for both subscriptions, or
- If you cancel your Connect subscription, you'll lose the perks associated with that subscription (and the library, if there was one).
If you don't mind losing the perks, or you're happy to pay for both, then you're OK to cancel.
To get all the features that were in Connect, you'd need Logos Max. If you don't need the advanced original language features, you can go with Pro.
Make sure you get the new subscription before you cancel the old one because otherwise, you won't get the discount.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Is a "Features Only" Option being considered? (To continue the historical options of "No Library" Subscriptions and the ability to purchase just the Feature Set)
I think that's unlikely because (1) we want to simplify our product lines to make it easier for people to find the right package, and (2) many features require specific books, and more features will require other books in the future, and (3) if we know all subscribers have got particular books, that makes documentation and training easier.
I know there's a strong feeling here that people don't want to pay for books twice, and I get that. But, as I've said before, we're assuming that most L10 owners will own most of the features and most of the books in the subscription, and that's why they're discounted so heavily.
I understand that some Features require books, datasets, etc - that's why the Feature Set purchases included just those required to utilize the Features, rather than additional unneeded resources. That was the reason I was asking if that would be an option going forward.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Also, any update on the Bi-Annual option?
Rather than a bi-annual option, it's more likely you'll be able to purchase multiple years upfront if you wish. So it would be an annual subscription, but you could choose to pay for two (or more?) years from the outset. Our subscription engine doesn't support that at the moment, so it's not it's something we'd need to build, but we might be able to add support for that before launch.
So purchasing two annual subscriptions would be the "workaround" to Perpetual Licenses, rather than the previously floated Bi-Annual idea?
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Frank Sauer said:Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Also, any update on the Bi-Annual option?
Rather than a bi-annual option, it's more likely you'll be able to purchase multiple years upfront if you wish. So it would be an annual subscription, but you could choose to pay for two (or more?) years from the outset. Our subscription engine doesn't support that at the moment, so it's not it's something we'd need to build, but we might be able to add support for that before launch.
So purchasing two annual subscriptions would be the "workaround" to Perpetual Licenses, rather than the previously floated Bi-Annual idea?
Another question that may be good to have the answer to before launch.....
Two years earns Perpetual License to the Non-AI Features..... Since there is currently no difference in Pro and Max or even when there is a known difference how would the following work?
User purchases the Annual Pro Subscription today, a year from today there are added Max Features that now interest the user so the user subscribes to the Annual Max option - thus having two years to qualify for the Perpetual License (Assumption that it would only be for the Pro Level Features and a Third Annual Subscription to Max would unlock the Perpetual to Max Features)
Would that be correct? Or would there be an option to pay the difference between Pro and Max for the first year to not be required for a third year to earn the Max Features?
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Frank Sauer said:Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Also, any update on the Bi-Annual option?
Rather than a bi-annual option, it's more likely you'll be able to purchase multiple years upfront if you wish. So it would be an annual subscription, but you could choose to pay for two (or more?) years from the outset. Our subscription engine doesn't support that at the moment, so it's not it's something we'd need to build, but we might be able to add support for that before launch.
So purchasing two annual subscriptions would be the "workaround" to Perpetual Licenses, rather than the previously floated Bi-Annual idea?
I suggested something similar here, where Logos could provide the two year subscription option, which would guarantee the fallback license without the user having to worry about it, and they could just call it an upgrade (though of course it's technically a 2 years pre-paid subscription).
I understand that there would be some pricing to deal with, but ultimately it would guarantee customers get the fallback license and clear up some customers' confusion.
Concerning the pricing, if a pre-paid one year subscription gets you 2 months off, then a two year would get 4 months off, so the discount would be built in to an extent.
Disclaimer: I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication. If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:danwdoo said:
Just to clarify, I am a long time Logos Connect subscriber with a renewal date at the end of August. Should I take this to mean I should go ahead and subscribe to a Logos subscription anytime between now and that renewal date or should I continue waiting as we were previously told to do?
By all means, subscribe if you want to, but if you do, then either:
- You'll need to pay for both subscriptions, or
- If you cancel your Connect subscription, you'll lose the perks associated with that subscription (and the library, if there was one).
If you don't mind losing the perks, or you're happy to pay for both, then you're OK to cancel.
To get all the features that were in Connect, you'd need Logos Max. If you don't need the advanced original language features, you can go with Pro.
Make sure you get the new subscription before you cancel the old one because otherwise, you won't get the discount.
Is a conversion program still in the works? I have connect until Feb 25 and would rather not have two subscriptions
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Mattillo said:
Is a conversion program still in the works? I have connect until Feb 25 and would rather not have two subscriptions
Mine expires in November this year, so I am watching this space as well.
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Frank Sauer said:
Another question that may be good to have the answer to before launch.....
Yes. Let's say you subscribe to Logos Pro for one year, and then upgrade to Logos Max.
After two years, you'll be eligible for a Logos Pro fallback license. After a further year, that would get upgraded to a Logos Max fallback license.
I doubt that there would be an option to pay the difference, but we're two years away from that being an issue, so I can't be dogmatic. I appreciate that puts L10 full-feature set owners wanting to get the most value from the fallback license in something of a quandary. Do you pay for Logos Max from day one, even though there's not much difference between that and Logos Pro right now, in the hope that it will snag you a better fallback license in two years' time?
No one can answer that question because no one knows (not even me!) exactly what might go into Logos Max over the next two years.
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Frank Sauer said:
So purchasing two annual subscriptions would be the "workaround" to Perpetual Licenses, rather than the previously floated Bi-Annual idea?
I'd describe it as pre-paying for two years of an annual subscription, but yes.
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Mattillo said:
Is a conversion program still in the works? I have connect until Feb 25 and would rather not have two subscriptions
It is, and it will be in place before launch.
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Mark,
It would be appreciated if we can have more info by "launch day" so we can make an informed decision. I want all of the language features possible and that is what Max is supposed to offer. Since the current subscription I made doesn't count anyway, I want to make it official on launch day and lock in to a specific track. Hopefully those of us who already did a yearly subscription to Max will see some value before then. Thank you for the updates.
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If I own l10 starter and have logos pro, does this qualify for the fallback license, does it include books also.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Another question that may be good to have the answer to before launch.....
Yes. Let's say you subscribe to Logos Pro for one year, and then upgrade to Logos Max.
After two years, you'll be eligible for a Logos Pro fallback license. After a further year, that would get upgraded to a Logos Max fallback license.
I doubt that there would be an option to pay the difference, but we're two years away from that being an issue, so I can't be dogmatic. I appreciate that puts L10 full-feature set owners wanting to get the most value from the fallback license in something of a quandary. Do you pay for Logos Max from day one, even though there's not much difference between that and Logos Pro right now, in the hope that it will snag you a better fallback license in two years' time?
No one can answer that question because no one knows (not even me!) exactly what might go into Logos Max over the next two years.
Thanks for clarifying that, hopefully it can be added to a FAQ, as it may come up consistently.
I also appreciate your honesty in that last statement that I have bolded and underlined....
It is a primary reason that many of us have been pushing for and will continue to push for Logos to reconsider keeping the traditional option of purchase available.
Many would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Mattillo said:
Is a conversion program still in the works? I have connect until Feb 25 and would rather not have two subscriptions
It is, and it will be in place before launch.
As my connect subscription expires at the end of August, and I hope there will be a discount in converting, I hope this will be before then.
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Frank Sauer said:
Would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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Justin Gatlin said:Frank Sauer said:
Would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
This is exactly what I plan to do. I am not paying for 2 years of subscription without knowing what I am going to get (as I am not, at this point, interested in AI features).
I believe in a Win-Win-Win God.
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1Cor10 31 said:Justin Gatlin said:Frank Sauer said:
Would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
This is exactly what I plan to do. I am not paying for 2 years of subscription without knowing what I am going to get (as I am not, at this point, interested in AI features).
In fact, I may have to wait for 3 or 4 or 5 years depending on where Logos wants to focus its energy till I see sufficient features for me to find it worthwhile to pay 2 years of subscription.
I believe in a Win-Win-Win God.
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1Cor10 31 said:
1Cor10 31">
Justin Gatlin said:Frank Sauer said:Would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
This is exactly what I plan to do. I am not paying for 2 years of subscription without knowing what I am going to get (as I am not, at this point, interested in AI features).
In fact, I may have to wait for 3 or 4 or 5 years depending on where Logos wants to focus its energy till I see sufficient features for me to find it worthwhile to pay 2 years of subscription.
I have considered what you both are mentioning... Then the concern that comes to mind is what type of cost increase the Full Feature Set owners face if we don't buy in from the start...
I do hope things work for Logos in the near term with this, but I have to be honest, the subscription model already had me concerned as a customer.... But responses like the one that leads the Bible Software Program about not having any idea of what will be in Logos Max and including the poor handling of the entire process, as well as web search launch failures, requests not consistently acknowledged and some of the bugs/errors that have been in the forums for long periods.... I find myself wondering if I care to invest any further....
I truly want to feel different, I push as hard as I do on these issues because I want to see Logos succeed and provide what customers actually desire.... But...
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Frank Sauer said:
1Cor10 31">
1Cor10 31">
Justin Gatlin said:Frank Sauer said:Would rather wait for a launch, KNOW what they are paying for and own the purchase - rather than paying for the unknown, that may or may not be worth the price paid...
It would be nice to know that Logos respects that point of concern, from many longtime faithful customers enough to honor their desire for a true purchase option. As a company, telling your customer base this is our path forward, here's the cost, BUT we don't know what you'll get for it.... Well, not a good look.
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
This is exactly what I plan to do. I am not paying for 2 years of subscription without knowing what I am going to get (as I am not, at this point, interested in AI features).
In fact, I may have to wait for 3 or 4 or 5 years depending on where Logos wants to focus its energy till I see sufficient features for me to find it worthwhile to pay 2 years of subscription.
I have considered what you both are mentioning... Then the concern that comes to mind is what type of cost increase the Full Feature Set owners face if we don't buy in from the start...
Whether I start buying in from the start or from month 1 or month 2 or... the price is the same, they say. Then why dive in at the start. Sit out a few months to see what features are introduced.
Let's say I choose to sit out 3 years of subscription before I see enough new features to decide it is worth subscribing. As an L10 owner, if I then subscribe for 2 years, I will get, as part of permanent license, all the features released over the last 3 years that I waited + features released over the 2 years that I subscribe . Thus, I will get 5 years of features for paying 2 years of subscription. The longer I wait, the greater the value (all else equal). Why would Logos give incentive for people to wait? The only solution as far I can see is dynamic pricing.
I believe in a Win-Win-Win God.
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I think there's 2 problems inherent in a Logos subscription model. No, maybe 3.
- The above, pig-in-a-poke problem. Not a problem for those wanting the latest, or otherwise funded (schools?)
- The broadness of the customer base. Improved sermons (pastors) vs maybe academic writing support. Whose pig gets fed? My 'pig' hasn't eaten for years.
- Finally, 'need'. Subscriptions are very easy to say yes! And very easy to walk. Alternatively, paid features, you own the pig, lovable or not.
From a corporate POV, the bouncy problem then becomes perk-management ... constant tweaking. Give today, take tomorrow.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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I just stumbled on to this video as I do not read the forums very often. I am somewhat concerned where this is going but will have to see what happens. I do hope some of this is documented somewhere in an email or a separate Logos webpage and people are advised of the changes. After all we get bombarded almost daily by email with promotions surely something can be advised formally.
Colin
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Justin Gatlin said:
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
One flaw with this approach is that I can't guarantee that the discounts offered to L10 customers will still be available to new subscribers in two years' time. (We'll give plenty of notice if we do withdraw them from new subscribers.)
But another way to look at it is like this.
If I'd offered you the chance to buy Logos 10 and told you that I'd also throw Logos 11 in for free when that was released, you'd probably have bitten my hand off – even if you didn't know what would be in "Logos 11". But that's pretty much what a two-year subscription will get you today.
If you're an L10 owner and you pay for a two-year subscription, you're locking in the offline features that we've built over the last two years – that's what we'd normally call "Logos 11". But on top of that, you will also get all the additional offline features that we'll build over the next two years. That's what we'd normally call "Logos 12".
Your license isn't just about acquiring what we will build but also about acquiring what we have built. Because we're issuing the fallback license in about two years' time, the first time you acquire that license, you're getting four years' worth of features, not just two.
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I'm glad for the fallback license. So why don't you incentivise those of us willing to subscribe and lock in for a year now, so we can start the clock ticking toward the two year mark while providing the early revenue that you are looking for? The subscription site is already advertising the fallback license.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
Is a "Features Only" Option being considered? (To continue the historical options of "No Library" Subscriptions and the ability to purchase just the Feature Set)
I think that's unlikely because (1) we want to simplify our product lines to make it easier for people to find the right package, and (2) many features require specific books, and more features will require other books in the future, and (3) if we know all subscribers have got particular books, that makes documentation and training easier.
I know there's a strong feeling here that people don't want to pay for books twice, and I get that. But, as I've said before, we're assuming that most L10 owners will own most of the features and most of the books in the subscription, and that's why they're discounted so heavily.
I'm fine with the current discounted pricing, and I understand that this topic is not a priority. That said, I believe this area will eventually require more attention. Customers will never be comfortable double paying for books. Eventually pressure from paying customers will force a more thorough response. When that response comes, however, it's likely that prices will be higher anyway. So I'll just enjoy the discounted pricing for as long as it lasts.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:
After two years, you'll be eligible for a Logos Pro fallback license. After a further year, that would get upgraded to a Logos Max fallback license.
I doubt that there would be an option to pay the difference, but we're two years away from that being an issue, so I can't be dogmatic. I appreciate that puts L10 full-feature set owners wanting to get the most value from the fallback license in something of a quandary. Do you pay for Logos Max from day one, even though there's not much difference between that and Logos Pro right now, in the hope that it will snag you a better fallback license in two years' time?
No one can answer that question because no one knows (not even me!) exactly what might go into Logos Max over the next two years.
Mark, when do you start counting for 2 year fallback license for those who are subscribed? Is it now, with pre-release Logos Pro/Max versions, or from the Fall?
"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Justin Gatlin said:
You could do this by just skipping this cycle, waiting to see what is released in two years, and then pre-paying for two years. Then you will know exactly what you are getting for a specific purchase price with the knowledge that you will also get additional perks for the life of your subscription. Just pretend they are skipping Logos 11 and in two more years act the way you always have.
One flaw with this approach is that I can't guarantee that the discounts offered to L10 customers will still be available to new subscribers in two years' time. (We'll give plenty of notice if we do withdraw them from new subscribers.)
But another way to look at it is like this.
If I'd offered you the chance to buy Logos 10 and told you that I'd also throw Logos 11 in for free when that was released, you'd probably have bitten my hand off – even if you didn't know what would be in "Logos 11". But that's pretty much what a two-year subscription will get you today.
If you're an L10 owner and you pay for a two-year subscription, you're locking in the offline features that we've built over the last two years – that's what we'd normally call "Logos 11". But on top of that, you will also get all the additional offline features that we'll build over the next two years. That's what we'd normally call "Logos 12".
Your license isn't just about acquiring what we will build but also about acquiring what we have built. Because we're issuing the fallback license in about two years' time, the first time you acquire that license, you're getting four years' worth of features, not just two.
As for the Features built the past two years - a clear listing of Features and which are included in the Fallback and which are not would assist some of the question/doubt in value.... Scouring the forums for tidbits of vague information vs having the Subscription Table being clear and precise would be beneficial
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Frank Sauer said:
As for the Features built the past two years - a clear listing of Features and which are included in the Fallback and which are not would assist some of the question/doubt in value.... Scouring the forums for tidbits of vague information vs having the Subscription Table being clear and precise would be beneficial
Another good point. I think some of my confusion earlier from Ceo Bill, and now Mark:
- Logos 10 can mean Logos 10 Full Feature, or features developed during Logos 10 (aka Logos 11, which would actually be Logos 11 Full Feature). Neither are apparently (but could be) equivalent to Verbum 10, or its associated equivalences AFAIK.
- I can't remember a single offline Logos 10 feature (meaning, developed during Logos 10). Maybe a bunch of sermon and factbook stuff.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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scooter said:
Perhaps, when L said 'Logos 10,' they meant less-than-Full Feature L10 in the forums, as discussions of the new paradigm ensued.
Quite true, though yesterday it was said you could lock in your Logos 10 with the subscription. Meaning else lose your Logos 10. But's before translation.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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DMB said:scooter said:
Perhaps, when L said 'Logos 10,' they meant less-than-Full Feature L10 in the forums, as discussions of the new paradigm ensued.
Quite true, though yesterday it was said you could lock in your Logos 10 with the subscription. Meaning else lose your Logos 10. But's before translation.
'The simple things you see are all complicated.' : Pete Townshend [1965]
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DMB said:
- I can't remember a single offline Logos 10 feature (meaning, developed during Logos 10). Maybe a bunch of sermon and factbook stuff.
Well, I think the instant Dark/Light mode is offline - the Sermon and Factbook arena still needs clarity (surprise) as to is any of that is not AI or whatever Logos is considering a cloud feature that will not be included in Fallback Licenses....
I realize that the argument will be that this is still Early Access and we will know more come Fall - BUT the fact is this - we are dealing with a company that is selling a product that either can't or refuse to answer simple questions in a timely manner..... The questions being asked should have already had answers and been included in the details on the Subscription pages....
What is included and not in a Fallback license shouldn't be a question we have to wait for an answer on....
What Features we are gaining (in addition to whether we get to keep them after two years) should have been part of the "Release" and Early Access order pages... We should not be hearing that we can find it in the thousands of scattered, vague remarks in the Forums and worse yet see the company project leader telling us even he doesn't know what we will be paying for over that course of time,,,,,
If you're currently selling the product, "Early Access" or not you should have answers to simple questions, especially if you are not going to clearly post it when offering the product for purchase....
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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www.logos.com/early-access">
A Legacy Fallback License allows you to keep offline features when you cancel your subscription after 24 consecutive months. Instead of falling back to a free or previous version of Logos, you'll keep core features from your subscription tier that don't rely on the cloud or AI.
What if I cancel subscription after 24 months, but then later decide to restart it? Two more years then locks me in to the *newer* features again? (is it a one-time offer, or will it be in effect as an ongoing thing?)
Logos 10 full owners are being offered a discount to start now. Is this discount permanent or temporary? If I do not subscribe now, does the offer go away at some point? If I do subscribe (say for 2 years) then cancel; then later want to re-subscribe, do i then pay full price? Or do I still get the discount?
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John said:
What if I cancel subscription after 24 months, but then later decide to restart it? Two more years then locks me in to the *newer* features again? (is it a one-time offer, or will it be in effect as an ongoing thing?)
Logos 10 full owners are being offered a discount to start now. Is this discount permanent or temporary? If I do not subscribe now, does the offer go away at some point? If I do subscribe (say for 2 years) then cancel; then later want to re-subscribe, do i then pay full price? Or do I still get the discount?
The 'new' fallback perk is a real beauty. I'm surprised Logosians had to beg, with FL already spending months planning. It's an FL dream-come-true.
- While those 24 months are ticking, each new month increases the customer's loss ... if they cancel. Think, think!
- If indeed they cancel, the clock re-starts. Two more years?! Oh my!
- And per Mark, those discounts aren't perminent. Kind of like low mortgage rates.
- Plus ... funds-challenged folks are most at risk. Drop out a month, and sorry! But Bob formerly noted, losses are associated with low spenders.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Wild Eagle said:
Mark, when do you start counting for 2 year fallback license for those who are subscribed? Is it now, with pre-release Logos Pro/Max versions, or from the Fall?
From an earlier post.
Mark Barnes (Logos) said:The qualifying period starts when you begin your subscription or free trial. That said, the Legacy Fallback Licence won't be available until October 2026. After 24 consecutive months, you'll be eligible to receive the Legacy Fallback License associated with your subscription tier, but you might not actually receive it until October 2026. (Your eligibility won't be impacted if you cancel after 24 months but before October.)
For example: if you subscribed to Logos Pro (early access) via a 30-day free trial on June 1, 2024, after renewing on May 1, 2026 (your 24th consecutive month), you will receive the license in October 2026 as soon as it is available.0 -
Frank Sauer said:
As for the Features built the past two years - a clear listing of Features and which are included in the Fallback and which are not would assist some of the question/doubt in value.... Scouring the forums for tidbits of vague information vs having the Subscription Table being clear and precise would be beneficial
Most of the features we've built so far during the Early Access period have been AI-focused. Insights, Help Center, and the Factbook improvements are the exceptions to that and are very likely to be included in the fallback license. But there will be several other important improvements delivered at or before launch that are not AI-features. Once these are released, or at least in beta, I'll try and put a list together of things that are likely to be included in fallback.
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John said:
Logos 10 full owners are being offered a discount to start now. Is this discount permanent or temporary? If I do not subscribe now, does the offer go away at some point? If I do subscribe (say for 2 years) then cancel; then later want to re-subscribe, do i then pay full price? Or do I still get the discount?
Some of that is still TBD, but the likelihood is that the discount offer will go away at some point, but people who have already got on the discount path will stay on that path. But, to be clear, (1) we haven't set a date when that offer will go away, (2) it is not imminent, and (3) we'll give LOTS of notice if it should be going away.
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Thank you for clarifying!
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:
but people who have already got on the discount path will stay on that path.
Could you elaborate? Is this for Logos Pro subscribers, Logos 10 + Full Features owners or Logos Connect subscribers?
Blessings in Christ.
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Tes said:Mark Barnes (Logos) said:
but people who have already got on the discount path will stay on that path.
Could you elaborat it? Is is the for Logos pro subscribers,Logos 10 + Full features owners or Logos connect subscribers?
I'm wondering about this as well.
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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Tes said:
Could you elaborate? Is this for Logos Pro subscribers, Logos 10 + Full Features owners or Logos Connect subscribers?
If you own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set you will qualify for the discount on Logos Premium/Pro/Max. Most Connect subscribers qualify, too. It's possible we may withdraw that discount in the future, but we will give plenty of notice if we intend to do that.
If you accept that discount, you could stay on that discounted track even if the discount is no longer available to new subscribers.
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Frank Sauer said:
As for the Features built the past two years - a clear listing of Features and which are included in the Fallback and which are not would assist some of the question/doubt in value.... Scouring the forums for tidbits of vague information vs having the Subscription Table being clear and precise would be beneficial
Most of the features we've built so far during the Early Access period have been AI-focused. Insights, Help Center, and the Factbook improvements are the exceptions to that and are very likely to be included in the fallback license. But there will be several other important improvements delivered at or before launch that are not AI-features. Once these are released, or at least in beta, I'll try and put a list together of things that are likely to be included in fallback.
That would be greatly appreciated and very helpful to the entire customer base - Thanks Mark
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Mark Barnes (Logos) said:Tes said:
Could you elaborate? Is this for Logos Pro subscribers, Logos 10 + Full Features owners or Logos Connect subscribers?
If you own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set you will qualify for the discount on Logos Premium/Pro/Max. Most Connect subscribers qualify, too. It's possible we may withdraw that discount in the future, but we will give plenty of notice if we intend to do that.
If you accept that discount, you could stay on that discounted track even if the discount is no longer available to new subscribers.
One more question: Could you mention the price of the discounts for each? For example with Full features and logos subscrieber
Blessings in Christ.
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Tes said:
Could you mention the price of the discounts for each? For example with Full features
See https://community.logos.com/forums/p/223567/1304050.aspx#1304050 for all those eligible for discount.
Premium $69.99/yr vs $149.99
Pro $99.99/yr vs $249.99
Max $129.99/yr vs $349.99
Monthly is 10% of yearly.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave Hooton said:Tes said:
Could you mention the price of the discounts for each? For example with Full features
See https://community.logos.com/forums/p/223567/1304050.aspx#1304050 for all those eligible for discount.
Premium $69.99/yr vs $149.99
Pro $99.99/yr vs $249.99
Max $129.99/yr vs $349.99
Monthly is 10% of yearly.
Great! Thank you Dave. Does this mean that we will have to wait until the fall of the year for the release of the features that will be distinguished for each of the tiers?
Blessings in Christ.
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Tes said:
Great! Thank you Dave. Does this mean that we will have to wait until the fall of the year for the release of the features that will be distinguished for each of the tiers?
Yes. Wait until Fall for a definitive list, including features that are eligible for Legacy Fallback after 2 years.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave Hooton said:Tes said:
Great! Thank you Dave. Does this mean that we will have to wait until the fall of the year for the release of the features that will be distinguished for each of the tiers?
Yes. Wait until Fall for a definitive list, including features that are eligible for Legacy Fallback after 2 years.
Thank you Dave. I will wait.
Blessings in Christ.
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