Official: Why did(n't) you get a Logos subscription?
Comments
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I really encourage you to look more into what subscriptions actually mean. You are not going to lose anything if you never subscribe, and your software will continue to upgrade. You can even continue to buy books like you always have.
If you subscribe for two years straight, you get to forever keep the features You subscribed to two years ago. if You pay for a two year subscription, nothing really ever changes for you.0 -
charlie said:
I really encourage you to look more into what subscriptions actually mean. You are not going to lose anything if you never subscribe, and your software will continue to upgrade. You can even continue to buy books like you always have.
If you subscribe for two years straight, you get to forever keep the features You subscribed to two years ago. if You pay for a two year subscription, nothing really ever changes for you.[Y]
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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charlie said:
If you subscribe for two years straight, you get to forever keep the features You subscribed to two years ago. if You pay for a two year subscription, nothing really ever changes for you.
That would be "some" features - not all features are kept - so it is not the same and has changed. Also, as of now - until we hear different from Logos - only L10 Feature Owners of qualified levels receive the LFL after 2 years - not everyone.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Frank Sauer said:charlie said:
If you subscribe for two years straight, you get to forever keep the features You subscribed to two years ago. if You pay for a two year subscription, nothing really ever changes for you.
That would be "some" features - not all features are kept - so it is not the same and has changed. Also, as of now - until we hear different from Logos - only L10 Feature Owners of qualified levels receive the LFL after 2 years - not everyone.
And not all of the features that can be kept are known right now.
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I subscribed right away. It is more cost effective than buying the features each time Logos came out with new ones.
The new Bible study tool was a big draw for me, but it needs to draw from more resources and have optional question formats.
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If I remember correctly, they said you keep everything that is not cloud-based. I don't think a list has been given, but I believe most things would fall under not cloud-based.
The majority of functions do not use the cloud. That is mostly the AI functions.
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There are lists out there - they were reposted again recently in response to someone asking
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Like a Christmas hamper? I am not too concerned about the contents. I own my formerly purchased contents, but the features keep moving further and further away. Now I need to pay for the features that were once part of the product. Secondly, with this new AI addition, it's based on a credit basis (which was not revealed, until now), means that certain searches count against your usage. I am not an AI fan (in bible software), but why would people be limited to use it, if it is part of the subscription. I noticed that a basic search (now includes AI), and these gets deducted from your AI credit base.
I am not sure, why the subscription is needed if you are still buying books and still need to buy features. Should the one not replace the other. If the subscription is to provide better, greater or more service, then provide the service. I am still needing to buy books, features, and courses. The subscription did not make the Logos experience better. There was nothing better in the hamper. It just cost more.
I live in Africa dude. I can't afford to pay $10 a month on something that does not provide any more resources than what I already own. So no. It's not about the Christmas hamper. To many of us regular poor pastors in third world countries, the only way to get access to resources is through logos, but the market is built for the US audience. I will be cancelling the subscription because it's just too expensive, maybe not for the regular American, but where I live $10 is a lot of money.
Nothing personal.
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QUESTION ONE: "Have you subscribed to the new version of Logos?"
ANSWER ONE：No, I have not, and I am undecided whether I'll get it in the future, but probably not.
QUESTIONS TWO: What's the primary reason for your decision?
ANSWER TWO: ………….One of the main perks of subscribing is the ability to purchase a new Logos library, but since there isn't an Original Language Library (or any other library I am interested in) among the 2025 Libraries, subscribing doesn't seem very compelling to me. Also, in the past, I enjoyed using the feature crossgrade and then the feature upgrade path, but now thos paths have been taken away and replaced with a subscription-based model, and I find that rather disappointing. I think it should have been possible to offer both a subscription model for features that are dependent on the web and a traditional model for features that are not web-dependent and that do not need to be updated often. I guess I also have a bit of subscription fatigue.
Grace and Peace,
Brian
חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי
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Per my original post, I was on the fence about subscribing… and taking the long view, I still am. But I decided to give the 30-Day free trial subscription a go.
I'm not at all a fan of the "subscription only" model, nor did I see any new features that got me excited during the free trial. But as I considered my relationship with Faithlife (what it has been and what I hope it can continue to be) I decided to give them the benefit of the doubt, and stick with them for the next 24 months via a two-year subscription. I'm "hoping" that during that time, they might figure out a path to a dual-use model, allowing for either purchase or subscription, OR find a way to offer everyone (including new customers) the ability to have the equivalent of a LFL if they stay subscribed for 24 consecutive months.At the end of my two-year subscription, I'll re-evaluate whether to continue subscribing. Two major considerations will be if Faithlife continues to offer L10 owners LFLs with every 24 months of subscription, as well as which features are included in the LFLs.
Transitions are rarely easy, but in the end, if no direct purchase options are provided, I hope Faithlife finds some way to offer subscribe-to-own plans, similar to the old rent-to-own models.
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Yes (no. 1) - I was already subscribing through FL connect (no library), and my church was paying for my subscription to the Pastoral Premier Cloud. So I was already comfortable in a subscription mode. It made sense to me when I paid to purchase one of the older upgrades (Logos 8 to 9 perhaps, I forget) and the cost of a couple of years of subscription was about the same as purchasing. So I chose the FL Connect and was happy with it. Then the Pastoral Premier Cloud subscription was set to go away, and so the shift to Logos Max basically replaces both those previous subscriptions.
I just have to be careful when purchasing a resource that I don't already have access to it through the subscription. Logos does a good job not charging me for a resource I own when I purchase a package. The same is not true for rentals. They will charge me for stuff I already have "temporary access to." When I buy a package, it is tedious to go through the resources and make sure everything will be new to me.
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I've subscribed but have no intention of renewing. The AI search is nice, but I find myself able to find relevant results just fine without it. Most of the sermon features with AI tend to be shallow or so generic to be useless.
As an L10 Full Feature owner there is very little that even the highest subscription offers. I already have a product that works just fine for me.
In addition, I was also put off by the sermon builder for Android being lumped into the subscription features when L10 owners already have full access to it on iPad. It's given the whole system a bit of stink to me and I don't intend to spend $200 to get it in a fallback license. Certain features (such as instant dark-mode or the dynamic-toolbar) seem more like bug fixes or software updates than features. Keeping those behind a paywall has given me a nickle-and-dime impression of how business will be run, and I'm not too interested in keeping up with all of that.
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I am a subscriber and I think it is the best way for the company to run its business and it is good for most of us to be reassured that the mutual benefit will continue.
Blessings in Christ.
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I am a subscriber and I think it is the best way for the company to run its business and it is good for most of us to be reassured that the mutual benefit will continue.
Blessings in Christ.
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Nickel and diming … that was my impression on Mark's logic for L10'ers vs free trial. His argument was an accountant, instead of a marketer. As I understand it, they're heavily departmentalized.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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I was a very reluctant 1.
I did the free trial (L10 FF owner), and at first I canceled it because I wasn't really impressed. But when they offered the free books/courses and 5% discount, I decided to keep it, at least for a bit (I was still in my free trial period). I see now that L10 FF owners would not get a free trial... if that had been the case when I subscribed, I would most likely not be a subscriber.
From the beginning, everything seemed to be overpromised and underdelivered.
The Live Launch was extremely underwhelming. Not only was it not "live" (it was completely pre-recorded), but if you had already been a subscriber or had been active here on the forums, there was nothing new. Even more… they made it seem like you needed to watch it live, and there'd be lots of giveaways. But they had already pre-selected all the winners beforehand because they were announcing them during the launch, and they had a notice that all the winners had given permission to use their names… which means these were all pre-selected. So what in the world was the point of having a "Live" launch when nothing about it was live and all the info in it had already been announced?
The free book for November was very underwhelming. I wouldn't have expected a super awesome book each time, but one would have thought for the very first month it might be something very nice. You only get one chance to make a first impression.
The courses were originally promised as "You get access to Mobile Ed courses best for the kind of study you do in Logos" - but in reality it almost seems they were randomly chosen. One would have thought that the course geared toward small group leaders would have been given to the subscription marketed as "Great for small group leaders & in-depth study" and the course on pastoral counseling would have fit well with the subscription marketed as "Perfect for pastors & sermon prep" but instead both of those were given for the subscription marketed as "Ideal for language study & research". It just seemed like no thought was put into this.
I subscribed to Max, but so far as I can tell there is no difference at all between Pro and Max other than a couple more courses and some more temporary books. Personally, I have very little interest whatsoever in "renting" books.
I am trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. I have been a Logos user for 20+ years. I have spent more than I care to admit on books. I do want Logos to succeed. But so far everything has been very underwhelming.
Will I keep subscribing? Not sure. I don't really feel that I'm getting my money's worth.
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Sounds like you should switch to Pro for the time being, until Max has something that would interest you. As a Logos 10 owner, the only things you would lose as far as I recall are some rented books and three of the mobile courses that would be reserved for Max.
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Except that I paid for the whole year, in order to lock in the savings, so I'm kinda stuck.
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Yeah that Android Sermon Feature Parity being locked behind the paywall for customers that own it on all other platforms is getting close to the top of my frustration. The only "Feature Parity" that was charged for that was mentioned to me was for the original Mac Engine crossgrade for around $60 - which if I recall correctly was still lacking a number of features that the Windows version had - I don't recall any of the features added to bring the Mac engine up to date being locked behind an upgrade or subscription….
Us Android users are stuck with the iOS version - so we will be forced to buy an iPad or pay for two years of a subscription just for us to have Feature Parity for a Feature we already own….. (Notice we still have not heard any public response on this situation - the response I received was via personal communication)
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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I'm looking at my post and trying to figure out why me emoji didn't work.
👍️
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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- I am a subscriber. I use Logos daily and it is really a key tool that sustains my spiritual life in giving me access to the Bible anywhere, anytime. I would be willing to subscribe even for no other reason than this one. 10$ a month is a no brainer for me to sustain my spritual life and share what I discover in our small groups.
That being said, as a L10FF the LFL was the key driver for me that made my 2 years investment more valuable. As I know I will keep the latest Logos experience after those 2 years of subscription. I like to own my version of Logos, and if I no longer had that option I would really feel I miss something.
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(I picked 1.) – I suppose in general I'm a pretty laid-back kind of person and if that's the way we're heading: let's go. I'm on for the ride.
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I'm totally fine with negative posts, as I know that it is impossible to make everyone happy. It's those that seem to make uninformed posts (that's the best word I could come up with). And, I'm not subscribing to this thread, I was just reading through it…like I did again just now.
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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#1 I am a current subscriber and have been for several years during the "Logos Now" days until present. Why? I have used Logos daily since 2008 and I consider the annual subscription a small price to pay to help Logos remain competitive in todays world by moving to subscription.
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I don't worry about tomorrow, because nobody knows what tomorrow or the future will bring. I will try to contribute as best I can to the survival of the company, which has played a great role in my study of the Word of God. As Christians, we have to do our part in prayer and trust that God will help the company and each one of us.
Blessings in Christ.
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Guess what? A lot of people were and still are uninformed about the new Logos subscription plan! I, for one, actually did not know anything about it until recently, and I haven't had time to read all the threads and posts that have been written about it to know what others have already said about the subscription plan, whether good or bad. I think there are a lot more people out there that are even more ignorant than I am about the whole thing, and for those people, this may be very confusing and shocking.
So, please if I or others are writing uninformed post know that this it is probably because we are uniformed not because we want to be annoying to you.
חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי
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Jonathan I wasn't aware that reading all of the different threads/posts about subscription was required before posting answers or questions here.
Anyway, if it looks like people have not read all of the subscription threads; it probably is because people have not. I know I have not because I simply because do not have that kind of time on my hands and assume there are others out there just like me.
חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי
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Yes, I am a current subscriber. I have always bought, at minimum, the feature upgrades. The subscription for me just made sense as I not only get all new features, I get discounts on the site even if my academic discount expires, and I get a kickback at the end of the year. Add to that 12 extra free books a year as well as courses throughout the year, the price is extremely reasonable and the product is of great value to me.
I honestly did not think I would use the AI features that much. However, I love the summarization of articles to help me quickly pinpoint what I do or do not want to dig into.
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I haven't even read all of the threads about the subscriptions, but many of the answers are found on the Logos subscription page on their site, which isn't even a fraction of the length of the threads.
And…in the future, I will try to read all of the threads first. 😂
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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On one of my posts, I put in a thumbs-up emoji. When I looked at it again, I saw this:
👍️ But I see it working fine now, I think. (Watch it disappear when I hit post….
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
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Yes, I'm a current subscriber.
Honestly, it was outside factors that influenced my decision the most.
- I had been homeschooling my children full-time, but they graduated recently, and I now have a full-time teaching job outside the home. That new income means the cost of the subscription is no longer insurmountable.
- I was anti-subscription, as a rule, toward all of life, as of this past year. But, when I started teaching outside the home, I found that the very best, most excellent digital lesson-planning software required a subscription. Then I found that the very best, most excellent digital smart board software required a subscription. Then I found that the very best, most excellent science/math video instruction required a subscription. Then I found that the very best, most excellent individualized-for-each-student math-fact-practice software required a subscription. Then I found that software that could simply and effectively force my outlook work account to play nice with my google home account required a subscription. By the time I realized Logos was changing to a subscription plan, my response , while disappointed, was, "Naturally, the very best, most excellent Bible software is also going to require a subscription - how can it keep up in a changing market if it doesn't?"
I was an early subscriber. I am constantly newly impressed at all I can do with Logos. I would never be able to do what I do without out it - or, at least, not unless I spent weeks to do without the software what I'm able to do in hours with the software. I am also consistently impressed with how Logos team members interact with users. I plan to continue to subscribe as long for as long as I am able to.
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Why? First, because software subscriptions are a scummy business model that I refuse to support. I don't care if "that's how the industry is going," scum is scum.
Second, I have zero interest in the new "features." I'm a Professional Computer Nerd, and AI is an overhyped boondoggle that should never be trusted. Requiring a subscription for an unreliable product is the height of stupidity.
Second, because I was given some money for Christmas to upgrade to the next-level library (which I'd requested), only to find when I went to do it that it requires a subscription. No-way-absolutely-not. I will either hold that money for a super-good sale on the specific items I was interested in from that package, or just not buy anything.
I refuse to support a corrupt business model. If you can't make an ethically-funded product, then the product needs to die and make room in the market for a better one replace it.
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Well, that's pretty clear. Scummy, overhyped, unreliable, stupid, corrupt, and then …. die. How's that! I think I got it.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Have you subscribed to the new version of Logos?5. No, and I plan not to get itWhat's the primary reason for your decision?
- I do not like where computers in general are going. Faithlife is making choices in context of an entire country that is committing suicide. I am fairly certain that Faithlife is making the best and maybe the only choices possible to stay alive. I am not complaining, just explaining why I have not subscribed.
- I refuse to use Windows on my main computer anymore, and I cannot afford to consistently invest in and maintain Apple products. I use primarily Linux and a little Android on older low-powered devices which are not well supported by Faithlife. I am currently downloading and installing the new Ou Dedetai installer, and if that works well enough, I might start using Logos/Verbum more often again, for now.
- I abhor most transitions to AI models. The intended way that AI works is guaranteed to NOT give me the search results and conclusions that I am looking for. Advertising the use of AI has become a deterrent, not an encouragement for me to invest in new products.
- I am beginning to invest more heavily in hardcopy books again. Mostly older moldy wrecked books as that is all that I can afford right now, but at least they are mine, and when I get up in the morning, they have not been rewritten or broken. Books do not need the internet and don't even need electricity. Hardcopy books feel like one of the few safe things left lately.
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