Study Assistant responded with NO citations

Andrew Loney

I asked Study assistant:

how do i understand the proverb: A friend loves at all times, and a brother is born for adversity.

The response fits my personal understanding, but gave zero ~~references~~ citations.

I began the session directly from the menu bar selecting Study Assistant and starting a new conversation

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Dave Hooton

Smart Bible Search for: find "A friend loves at all times, and a brother is born for adversity". provides the passage and a reasonable synopsis.

Study Assistant will provide it with a follow-up of what Proverb?

Andrew Loney

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1393523#Comment_1393523

I should clarify; I know the bible reference for this proverb. My concern is the AI synopsis di not provide ANY references for the response it gave explaining how one might understand this proverb. That is unacceptable use of AI. I'm not looking for alternative tools (I am quite capable of figuring that out). I am communicating what I think is a failure in Study Assistant

Chris G. Hutchings

https://community.logos.com/discussion/255896/study-assistant-responded-with-no-references

SA will provide references if you select “All Books” for your search. If you have no books containing that topic, searching “My Books” will not yield references. See attached screenshot of results from All Books

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1393528#Comment_1393528

The books referenced will usually provide the passage(s) being used with a specific bible query. I did get a related passage when I rephrased the query as: how do i understand "A friend loves at all times, and a brother is born for adversity" in "My Books".

I would rather be flexible with different approaches to a query than be too concerned about apparent deficiencies. It could be a "failure" if the developers agree, but your/my initial result was not "unacceptable".

Don Awalt

I think there is something wrong with this @Mark Barnes- I did the same question of SA that @Andrew Loney did, as you can see first time is "My Books", second time is "All Books". I think this refutes @Chris G. Hutchings theory about not having the resources in my library, as all 4 cited books in "All Books" response, I have! It's formulating the "My books" response in some other way, or maybe it's a bug that it is not adding the citations to the response?

Friend love proverb

> how do i understand the proverb: A friend loves at all times, and a brother is born for adversity.

This proverb contrasts two kinds of relational commitment, each suited to different circumstances.

The first part—“A friend loves at all times”—describes the consistency of genuine friendship. A true friend doesn’t condition their affection on convenience or favorable circumstances. Their love remains steady whether things are going well or poorly, whether you’re useful to them or not. This speaks to the reliability and constancy that distinguishes authentic friendship from transactional relationships.

The second part—“a brother is born for adversity”—doesn’t mean a brother only matters when trouble strikes. Rather, it highlights the particular strength of familial bonds in hardship. A brother is inherently positioned to stand with you when adversity comes, precisely because the bond is involuntary and unconditional. You don’t choose your siblings; that unchosen connection carries a special obligation and capacity to endure difficulty together.

The proverb’s genius lies in its pairing. It’s saying: yes, friendship offers constant love—that’s its defining characteristic. But when real crisis hits, there’s something about the bond of family that’s uniquely suited to bearing that weight. A brother is born for it—it’s almost his natural calling within the relationship structure.

This doesn’t diminish friendship or elevate family above it. Rather, it acknowledges that different relationships have different strengths. Friends excel at steady, chosen companionship; family excels at standing firm when everything falls apart. The wise person cultivates both kinds of love and recognizes what each is designed to provide. In practice, this means not expecting friendship to always function like family loyalty, and appreciating that familial bonds carry a particular resilience through hardship.

> how do i understand the proverb: A friend loves at all times, and a brother is born for adversity.

The proverb presents two complementary portraits of relational faithfulness, each revealing something distinct about how loyalty operates in different contexts.

A true friend demonstrates constancy regardless of circumstances—loving equally during both prosperity and hardship, whereas many abandon companions once their fortunes change[1]. This first line emphasizes consistency as the defining mark of genuine friendship. The friend’s love isn’t contingent on what you can offer or whether you remain entertaining or useful.

The second line suggests that a brother exists for a specific purpose: to sympathize with his sibling in distress, to relieve and support him[1]. This doesn’t mean family only matters during crisis, but rather that a friend worthy of the name is equipped for difficult times, which is significant because the path toward Christ always leads through hardship[2].

The proverb admits two interpretations worth considering. One reading treats friend and brother as distinct relationships, suggesting that blood relations are generally more reliable in distress than other companions[3]. The alternative interpretation views them as describing the same person—a true friend who becomes like a brother precisely through his faithfulness during adversity[3]. This second reading is particularly powerful: it suggests that friendship becomes familial through the test of hardship.

The practical implication is sobering. You often cannot know whether someone qualifies as a true friend until bad weather arrives—and by then it may be too late[2]. The wise choice is to cultivate friendships with those you can rely on in need, grounded ultimately in shared love of God, since friendships lacking this foundation are liable to change and decay[4]. Real friendship demands that you show yourself faithful before expecting faithfulness in return.

[1] John Gill, An Exposition of the Old Testament, The Baptist Commentary Series (London: Mathews and Leigh, 1810), 4:452.
[2] Dan Phillips, God’s Wisdom in Proverbs: Hearing God’s Voice in Scripture (Woodlands, TX: Kress Biblical Resources, 2011), 170–171.
[3] J. K. Burr, W. Hunter, and A. B. Hyde, Job, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Solomon’s Song, ed. D. D. Whedon, Commentary on the Old Testament (New York; Cincinnati: Eaton & Mains; Jennings & Graham, 1909), 6:406.
[4] Chr. Ridley Pearson, Counsels of the Wise King; Or, Proverbs of Solomon Applied to Daily Life (London: W. Skeffington & Son, 1880), 156.

Andrew Loney

Thank you @Don Awalt,

You did a much more complete job of explaining the situation then I. At the time I needed to keep focus on my original task. As you intimated, @Mark Barnes (Logos) has stated multiple time that Logos is very focused on responsible use of AI and that AI should provide citations; indicating whether they are owned, in the cloud (but owned) or not owned. If I'm understanding @Mark Barnes (Logos) correctly, then in this respect , I believe my experience is "unacceptable" (it reveals a bug)

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1393564#Comment_1393564

I'm sorry as I misunderstood your use of "references" for "citations". I agree that there should be citations.

Andrew Loney

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1393571#Comment_1393571

Thank you Dave, My mistake using the wrong term. I don't know if I can edit the title of this thread but will try. [Success! Looks like I had 3 hours before edits lock]