Undo
If you accidently delete a file like a Note File or Passage File can you get it back, surely there is a way? Logos 4 gives you no warning message so it is easy to delete a file accidently. I have started a "my own study bible notes file" and a "my own cross-reference note file" on the entire bible text and I would hate to accidently delete one of them it would be impossible to completely recreate them. I seen post on the forums of how to undo text in a note file but nothing on getting a deleted file back, maybe I missed it.
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If you accidentally delete something and catch it before closing Logos 4 try hitting the Ctrl and Z buttons together.
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Kevin Becker said:
If you hit a ctrl+z immediately it might work, but not always.
I just deleted a passage list file I didn't care about, and CTRL+Z didn't work for me.
MacBook Pro (2019), ThinkPad E540
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Todd Phillips said:Kevin Becker said:
If you hit a ctrl+z immediately it might work, but not always.
I just deleted a passage list file I didn't care about, and CTRL+Z didn't work for me.
Cntl-z also does not work with note files.
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tom collinge said:
Cntl-z also does not work with note files.
I am in no way doubting you, but maybe something has changed? I remember that several updates ago I accidentally deleted some notes and was able to recover them. I noticed my mistake right away and applied it immediately.
I know that an "Undo" button has been asked for many times.
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Rick Hypes said:tom collinge said:
Cntl-z also does not work with note files.
I am in no way doubting you, but maybe something has changed? I remember that several updates ago I accidentally deleted some notes and was able to recover them. I noticed my mistake right away and applied it immediately.
I know that an "Undo" button has been asked for many times.
Ctrl+Z worked for deleted Notes in both 4.2 and 4.2a beta. You have to be quick though, before the sync starts - a matter of seconds.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Thanks guys, but Ctrl + Z does not work. The possibility of deleting one of these Note Files accidently and not being able to get it back with it still linked to the bible text is very alarming! There has to be a way to back them up or something, they are syncing back at Logos. Does anyone know where the files are stored on your computer? I have Vista operating system.
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The notes are kept in C:\Users\<Username>\AppData\Local\Logos4\Documents\<random>\Documents\Notes
but they are in a database file, one cannot back up an individual note file.
Prov. 15:23
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Rick Hypes said:tom collinge said:
Cntl-z also does not work with note files.
I am in no way doubting you, but maybe something has changed? I remember that several updates ago I accidentally deleted some notes and was able to recover them. I noticed my mistake right away and applied it immediately.
I know that an "Undo" button has been asked for many times.
It does work for notes in a note file, but it does not work for me for a note file.
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Thanks Kevin, could I not have my back up software to back up this complete database file every time it changes and then if I ever accidently deleted a note file with in this database I could swap out the whole database file with the backed up one? I guess I can assume the individual notes would still be attached to the bible text after the swap.
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tom collinge said:
It does work for notes in a note file, but it does not work for me for a note file.
Got it. Thanks!
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Dave Hooton said:
Ctrl+Z worked for deleted Notes in both 4.2 and 4.2a beta. You have to be quick though, before the sync starts - a matter of seconds.
I just tested this - created a Note, closed it out so it was saved, waited until it sync'd, then opened up File and deleted it - IMMEDIATELY pressing Ctrl-Z. In fact I hit it several times, before Sync started. It did nothing. 4.2a beta 4.
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Dominick Sela said:
created a Note, closed it out so it was saved,
The time that I had to use Ctrl + Z the note was from a previous day's work and had already been saved (it was probably about a two month old note). When I deleted it, I immediately knew my mistake and used Ctrl + Z without closing my note file.
This was quite some time ago as I mentioned and don't really have the guts to tempt my success and try it again. [:)]
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Richard Poe said:
Thanks Kevin, could I not have my back up software to back up this complete database file every time it changes and then if I ever accidently deleted a note file with in this database I could swap out the whole database file with the backed up one? I guess I can assume the individual notes would still be attached to the bible text after the swap.
I don't know enough about the data structure to really answer this. It's possible that this would work. However, it's also possible that Logos would read the time stamp on the database and delete the file again since the "newer version" is on Logos' servers. Perhaps after restoring the database you could disconnect from the internet and make an edit to the note file inside Logos to give it a newer date than the deleted version on the server. This is all conjecture on my part though.
You might want to play around with the process so you will know how Logos will behave.
Prov. 15:23
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Kevin Becker said:
You might want to play around with the process so you will know how Logos will behave.
It is as good an answer as you can get! Notes are related to other documents via the Documents index in \Logos4\Documents\{random user id}\Documents, so my preference is always to backup the whole \Logos4\Documents\ folder! In a real emergency this can be very useful, but you should backup daily to minimise the impact of sync'ing with the Logos server!
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Thanks Dave, I think I'm going to start doing just that. I have Memeo AutoBackup Premium it is a real time backup it is constantly backing up. I don't quite understand way you said "backup daily to minimise the impact of sync'ing with the Logos server", did you mean at least daily? I don't see how more than once a day would impact the syncing. The Logos sever would be impacted if I had to restore my backup file, would it? Also would I have a problem, as Kevin stated, due to the time stamp on the database?
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Richard Poe said:
Thanks Dave, I think I'm going to start doing just that. I have Memeo AutoBackup Premium it is a real time backup it is constantly backing up. I don't quite understand way you said "backup daily to minimise the impact of sync'ing with the Logos server", did you mean at least daily? I don't see how more than once a day would impact the syncing. The Logos sever would be impacted if I had to restore my backup file, would it? Also would I have a problem, as Kevin stated, due to the time stamp on the database?
Richard,
FYI... L4 doesn't always play well with other programs. I have had to turn of my backup/syncing software so that I could update L4.
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Dave Hooton said:Kevin Becker said:
You might want to play around with the process so you will know how Logos will behave.
It is as good an answer as you can get! Notes are related to other documents via the Documents index in \Logos4\Documents\{random user id}\Documents, so my preference is always to backup the whole \Logos4\Documents\ folder! In a real emergency this can be very useful, but you should backup daily to minimise the impact of sync'ing with the Logos server!
Dave, do you have any experience in restoring up a notes file with a working copy of Logos4?
I ask because the way these documents work in Logos, I'm not sure it could be successfully done. All the note files are stored within a single file on the HD, which is indexed in another file. These then are echoed on the Logos server. I wonder what happens if only one of those 4 files (or are there more?) are changed on the HD. Then, if other changes were made after the date of the backup/restore file, which file would 'win' the syncing function.
I'm not asking to challenge your understanding. I'm asking because I'm curious about how this would actually work, and even if it could work.
Help links: WIKI; Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)
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I thank everyone for your helpful input on this matter; it has raised some interesting question. I have sent an email to Logos Customer Service concerning this backup issue, maybe they can help. I also ask if they could incorporate a pop-up warning message in the software when "Delete" is clicked. It is so easy to quickly scroll down the right-click menu and accidentally click "Delete"!
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Richard DeRuiter said:
Dave, do you have any experience in restoring up a notes file with a working copy of Logos4?
Yes, but it has not been sufficiently old as to create a sync issue with the server. Nor does the amount of Notes constitute a significant degree of risk!
Richard DeRuiter said:I ask because the way these documents work in Logos, I'm not sure it could be successfully done. All the note files are stored within a single file on the HD, which is indexed in another file. These then are echoed on the Logos server. I wonder what happens if only one of those 4 files (or are there more?) are changed on the HD. Then, if other changes were made after the date of the backup/restore file, which file would 'win' the syncing function.
It is known that the latest date of change is recognised by the server eg. after working off-line for several days/weeks the server will pick up the changes when you go online. Restoring a month old backup will not restore all documents to one month ago because there is no way to also roll-back the Logos server! In most respects you wouldn't expect that either ie. you are grateful that you recovered from an emergency and now you want the documents brought up to date! If users want to mitigate other scenarios (as per this thread) then they have to experiment for themselves, but at least know that it is not as simple as restoring a single database and likely create a bigger issue than the original!
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Richard Poe said:
I don't quite understand way you said "backup daily to minimise the impact of sync'ing with the Logos server", did you mean at least daily? I don't see how more than once a day would impact the syncing.
I meant that to indicate the extra syncing that would be required when you restore an older backup. Backup as often as you like but be aware that real-time backup can cause a crash due to an access conflict with L4!
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave Hooton said:Richard DeRuiter said:
Dave, do you have any experience in restoring up a notes file with a working copy of Logos4?
Yes, but it has not been sufficiently old as to create a sync issue with the server. Nor does the amount of Notes constitute a significant degree of risk!
Richard DeRuiter said:I ask because the way these documents work in Logos, I'm not sure it could be successfully done. All the note files are stored within a single file on the HD, which is indexed in another file. These then are echoed on the Logos server. I wonder what happens if only one of those 4 files (or are there more?) are changed on the HD. Then, if other changes were made after the date of the backup/restore file, which file would 'win' the syncing function.
It is known that the latest date of change is recognised by the server eg. after working off-line for several days/weeks the server will pick up the changes when you go online. Restoring a month old backup will not restore all documents to one month ago because there is no way to also roll-back the Logos server! In most respects you wouldn't expect that either ie. you are grateful that you recovered from an emergency and now you want the documents brought up to date! If users want to mitigate other scenarios (as per this thread) then they have to experiment for themselves, but at least know that it is not as simple as restoring a single database and likely create a bigger issue than the original!
If I'm reading you right, you can restore a note file from a backup. Which would mean restoring all the note files to the state they were when the backup was created (correct?).
You also imply that this may work best with Logos off-line. For example, let's say I accidentally delete a note file and I want to restore it. My best bet is to immediately set "Use Internet" to "No," exit Logos, restore the note file (and the documentInfo.db, and documents.* files in the Logos4/Documents/[random string]/Documents/ folder?), reopen Logos, make any change in any note file (to ensure the date is set to the most current time/date possible), set "Use Internet" to "Yes" and restart Logos.
Or is there a simpler way to do this; did I add an extra step?
If there is a way to do this, without breaking Logos, maybe we should put it in the Wiki.
Help links: WIKI; Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)
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Richard Poe said:
I also ask if they could incorporate a pop-up warning message in the software when "Delete" is clicked.
That's one option... but which other mainstream, commercial piece of software that encourages users to use the product to study, produce notes, etc. do you know of that has zero, reliable, undo support? And which modern operating system do you know of that doesn't have a "trash can" for deleted files so that you can easily say "Oh, I didn't mean to delete that..." and restore an accidentally deleted file? None that I can think of... apart from Logos, that is. Which is ironic (or sad or any number of other adjectives depending on your perspective) in a product that is designed to store the results of hours of labor, reading, study, reflection and meditation, etc -- all of which can be lost with a single bad delete... irretrievably. And suggesting that I back up a database with some 3rd party backup tool is really lame indeed.
Just my 2c worth. And for what it's worth, all of my notes are stored in MS Word documents, arranged by topic, etc... files that I can backup, version (with Git), delete and later restore from trash, etc.
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Stuart Robertson said:
but which other mainstream, commercial piece of software that encourages users to use the product to study, produce notes, etc. do you know of that has zero, reliable, undo support?
Stuart Robertson said:all of my notes are stored in MS Word documents, arranged by topic, etc... files that I can backup
Stuart Robertson said:delete and later restore from trash, etc.
[:)]
...and yes, I know about the "back" arrow and "Cntrl-Z", BUT they are just NOT the same as a good "undo" IMHO
Regards, SteveF
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My preference would be that it work more like the trash can and restore at the note level rather than at the file level. And, of course, it needs to work for all user created data. This gives me a longer window to change my mind.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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tom collinge said:MJ. Smith said:
My preference would be that it work more like the trash can and restore at the note level rather than at the file level. And, of course, it needs to work for all user created data. This gives me a longer window to change my mind.
[Y][Y]
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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Stuart Robertson said:
Just my 2c worth. And for what it's worth, all of my notes are stored in MS Word documents, arranged by topic, etc... files that I can backup, version (with Git), delete and later restore from trash, etc.
Same here... I haven't trusted notes for any important data since L2.0.
Grace & Peace,
Bill
MSI GF63 8RD, I-7 8850H, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, NVIDIA GTX 1050Max
iPhone 12 Pro Max 512Gb
iPad 9th Gen iOS 15.6, 256GB0 -
MJ. Smith said:
My preference would be that it work more like the trash can and restore at the note level rather than at the file level. And, of course, it needs to work for all user created data. This gives me a longer window to change my mind.
[Y]
Grace & Peace,
Bill
MSI GF63 8RD, I-7 8850H, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, NVIDIA GTX 1050Max
iPhone 12 Pro Max 512Gb
iPad 9th Gen iOS 15.6, 256GB0 -
BillS said:Stuart Robertson said:
Just my 2c worth. And for what it's worth, all of my notes are stored in MS Word documents, arranged by topic, etc... files that I can backup, version (with Git), delete and later restore from trash, etc.
Same here... I haven't trusted notes for any important data since L2.0.
Agreed. That's why I use OneNote for any longer notes. I am trying to use notes in Logos (especially those connected to the Bible references) but the reasons expressed in this thread are a big discouragement to do that.
Bohuslav
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Richard DeRuiter said:
If I'm reading you right, you can restore a note file from a backup. Which would mean restoring all the note files to the state they were when the backup was created (correct?).
I've recommended only to regularly backup the \Documents folder and restore the same to have a chance of recovering lost/corrupted documents, incl. Notes.
Richard DeRuiter said:If there is a way to do this, without breaking Logos, maybe we should put it in the Wiki.
I only know the restore won't break L4, but there are too many variables to document a recovery procedure. Logos really need to provide a working Undo function (trash can, etc.) that doesn't require us to react within seconds!
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave Hooton said:
Logos really need to provide a working Undo function (trash can, etc.) that doesn't require us to react within seconds!
[Y]
Bohuslav
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