Alpha Mac- NOT INSTALLING

Manuel, yes in Alpha testing even not being able to install is a good thing. We use the same OS, but often installations find conflicts with specifics settings or programs. When you get a crash, it may help find a bug that prevents future crashes for others.

The best way to help is let it crash, write a report and attach your log files. This is the only way to get it fixed.

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/3311.aspx

Manuel Brambila

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30359#Comment_30359

Wow... just spent 260 dollars.

Dr. Steven Berry

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30385#Comment_30385

Manuel, I too am unable to get past the "Logging in..." screen.

Forget trying to get Logos to help with this, or any problem. I have sent emails and have spent quite a long time on the telephone with Logos tech support about this and other issues, but their tech support on the Mac is non existant. I was told to post my issues on the Mac blog and see if any other end user had any ideas.

I understand that this is an alpha product, and that end user blogs can be helpful, but I can think of no other software company that EXPECTS other end users to do their job for them. This is totally unacceptable.

My Logos 4 problems aren't limited to the Mac version either. After upgrading my PC, NONE of the "new" books show up in the Library Tab. When the Logos tech support person remote connected to my computer to see if they could fix the problem... they couldn't.

The tech support person was able to determine that the books are in fact installed, but that there currently is no way through the Library Tab for me to access them.

I was given a "bug report number #49668" and was told that if or when they come up with a fix they woud contact me by email.

I'll be holding my breath.

I have been a Logos user for over twenty years, and have spent thousands of dollars with them, but this latest experience with them has left such a bad taste in my mouth that, unless things change drastically, I will never buy another Logos product.

Pastor Steven Berry Ph.D.

Calvary Chapel of Clovis

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/33931#Comment_33931

I have been a Logos user for over twenty years, and have spent thousands of dollars with them, but this latest experience with them has left such a bad taste in my mouth that, unless things change drastically, I will never buy another Logos product.

Any clue as to what "Alpha" means?

Mike Aldrich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/33931#Comment_33931

I understand that this is an alpha product, and that end user blogs can be helpful, but I can think of no other software company that EXPECTS other end users to do their job for them. This is totally unacceptable.

Dr. Barry, with all due respect, I think you're being harsh! I don't think you understand what Alpha and Beta means. The Mac version is by definition unfinished software. I have done so much reading and flipping through the logos website, that I can't quote you exactly where, but Logos identifies it as such with clear warnings. And MANY MANY companies do this. I could name several, but I'll go with the biggest...ever heard of Microsoft?

I participated in the alpha / beta testing of Windows 7. The early releases were ABYSMAL!! And yes, there were no official support channels. The user community figured out what we could, and yes, we ended up "doing their job" sometimes, but in many cases we just had to wait for the next update. Despite almost 2 years of development on the Vista service pack (Windows 7), websites and blogs are full of people having problems.

You just have to ask yourself, as frustrating as the bugs may be, is it worth having the new features as they become available?? In my case it's a little different, all things being equal, I like watching a product evolve, and given perspective it can be fun.

Now I KNOW it frustrating!!!! I suspect it may be a resource issue on my old MacBook, but I'm experiencing the same issue on my Mac. But in the grand scheme of God's creation is it really that important? In my post college days, when I was single, and first started making "good" money, I lived on the "bleeding edge". I bought the latest and greatest tech "toys" and software I could afford. And I spent many sleepless nights angry that they didn't write code as well as I could, and why didn't they test their products better? I finally came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth it!!! Now with a different attitude, I enjoy testing when I can do it, but the computer is only a tool. Great when it works, but there are other ways of getting the job done when it doesn't.

I have yet to see an official public release of ANY software, that didn't have some issues. THE WORST TIME EVER to work in tech support is the days and weeks following a major product release/upgrade. I have spoken with logos tech support on a couple of occasions this week, and found them to be holding up well under the circumstances! Some techs are better than others, but they work with more irate customers than understanding ones. And some questions don't have easy answers.

There are people reporting these problems, and working with Logos. This too shall pass!! I hope you will judge logos and 4.x in the coming months, not based on what happens during "hell week", but how they address issues when the dust settles. The problems will go away quicker than you think.

Blessings!

MWA

Dr. Steven Berry

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34330#Comment_34330

Mike808, in my earlier email I wrote "I understand that this is an alpha product", so yes, I do understand what "alpha and beta" software is.

Not that it will make any differance to all the Logos "evangelists", but my Ph.D. is in Aerospace Engineering and I have both coded software and have beta tested software since probably before you were out of diapers. So, please... stop with the condescending remarks.

I really do find it disappointing when people become "cultic" and defend, to the death, poorly written software or make unnecessary excuses for inept tech support.

Being a Christian doesn't mean that we are to happily and readily accept mediocrity in others or give them a free pass just because they claim to be Christians or because they are "doing it" for the ministry.

If Logos was writting free or open source programs then I would be the first to join in, climb onto the band wagon and sing their praises. However, this is not the case. They are charging money for their software. As such, if they are going to sell it... it is not too much to ask that at least it work, and that they offer tech support for their product when it doesn't.

Have a great day.

Pastor Steven Berry Ph.D.

Calvary Chapel of Clovis

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34363#Comment_34363

Mike808, in my earlier email I wrote "I understand that this is an alpha product", so yes, I do understand what "alpha and beta" software is.

Not that it will make any differance to all the Logos "evangelists", but my Ph.D. is in Aerospace Engineering and I have both coded software and have beta tested software since probably before you were out of diapers. So, please... stop with the condescending remarks.

I really do find it disappointing when people become "cultic" and defend, to the death, poorly written software or make unnecessary excuses for inept tech support.

Being a Christian doesn't mean that we are to happily and readily accept mediocrity in others or give them a free pass just because they claim to be Christians or because they are "doing it" for the ministry.

If Logos was writting free or open source programs then I would be the first to join in, climb onto the band wagon and sing their praises. However, this is not the case. They are charging money for their software. As such, if they are going to sell it... it is not too much to ask that at least it work, and that they offer tech support for their product when it doesn't.

Have a great day.

Pastor Steven Berry Ph.D.

Calvary Chapel of Clovis

Before exploding on someone who is trying to help you, perhaps you should have read the information on the Logos website that plainly stated the limitations of the Alpha release. If you know about Alpha and Beta, they you should have expected problems. It was also plainly stated that support for the Mac version would be supplied through Mac Beta forum.

Age does not give you license to be rude! You blasted Mike808 for being young. I am older than you, and I find your entire attitude to be unacceptable.

Jack

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34363#Comment_34363

Mike808, in my earlier email I wrote "I understand that this is an alpha product", so yes, I do understand what "alpha and beta" software is.

Evidently not.

Dr. Steven Berry

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34491#Comment_34491

Jack,

You wrote: "Before exploding on someone who is trying to help you, perhaps you should have read the information on the Logos website that plainly stated the limitations of the Alpha release."

First, I did not "explode on" or "blast" anyone. That being said, I did read the information on the website, but you obviously did not read what I initially wrote. My Mac issues are only one aspect of the problems I have with Logos 4 software.

You also state that Mike808 was trying to help... excuse me, but could you please point me to anything in Mike808's reply that provided anything that I could have followed that would provided a solution to any of my software issues? Any helpful suggestion? No.

Repeating that it is an alpha release is of no help to anyone. Saying you should have read this or that, serves no purpose.

You then wrote: "If you know about Alpha and Beta, they you should have expected problems. It was also plainly stated that support for the Mac version would be supplied through Mac Beta forum."

My point on this issue seems to have been totally lost on you. As I said before, the software manufacturer shouldn't rely on the end user to provide the tech support for a product. The end user may, and is encouraged to, detail any issues or problems they are having with their product, but it is the manufacturer's responsibility to provide the actual tech support to the end user. The fact that an end user may stumble onto a present work around does Logos or the end user no real service as that very work around may in fact cause additional program instability in future releases.

Like Mike808, I too was a beta tester for Windows 7 as well as for many other Microsoft programs over the years. However, not once has Microsoft ever asked the end user to provide tech support to other end users. Microsoft , like many other software manufacturers, have user forums, but strangely enough... they also have "real" tech support.

Lastly you said: "Age does not give you license to be rude! You blasted Mike808 for being young. I am older than you, and I find your entire attitude to be unacceptable."

I don't know how you could possibly know that you are older, but I will accept at face value your statement. Being that you are older than me, I'm happy for you. Congratulations, God has truly blessed you. None the less, knowing that you are older, or that you do not like my attitude, or my complaints of Logos software and lack of tech support has not provided me with any solutions to my software issues.

Your email has proven my point better that I ever could have hoped. End user forums, while useful for some things, are simply not manufacturer's tech support. Now, if anyone has any solutions... instead of irrelevant lip flapping... I'm all ears.

Thanks

Jerry W. David

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30294#Comment_30294

I tried to enable logging - and the instructions given under "enable logging" tell you to go to Library/Applications Support/Logos4/Logos.

Interestingly enough I do not have the LOGOS4 folder under Applications support. Could this be why this program is shutting down all the time on me?