Logos Is Too Expensive
Comments
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George Somsel said:
The Message is a relatively decent, if somewhat offbeat, translation which therefore isn't for everyone. Users have a right to say "I prefer this translation" or "I prefer that translation", but, when they aren't qualified to judge the quality of the work, they shouldn't attempt to judge its correctness or lack thereof.
So people should only express an opinion if they know what they are talking about? That's a novel concept [:D][:D][:D]
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David Carter said:
So people should only express an opinion if they know what they are talking about? That's a novel concept
This forum would die of starvation. [:D]
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Jack Caviness said:George Somsel said:
I get tired of people who claim that the KJV is the only bible
It Isn't? Can't I use it to correct errors in the Greek & Hebrew?
(Actually had a visitor from a local church tell me that one)After reading what some of them post, I almost believe they feel that way. [:(]
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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[:O] The last thing I want is for Logos to censor out all the heretical error. My Logos library would shrink dramatically.DMB said:Oh great. There's an error in the second edition of the 'Heretics of the Early Church'. I wish Logos wouldn't release these without better care.
Did not the Lord of the harvest instruct the laborers not to try and glean out the tares until harvest lest some of the wheat be lost? Maybe some books we call "tares" right now are really "good seed" that we do not recognize yet! Let the Spirit and the Word censor for us.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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OK, Matthew. You haven't lost your touch.
I had to go and check Logos.com to see if indeed they had such a resource ('Heresies of the Early Church' ). So I fell for my own joke.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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DMB said:
OK, Matthew. You haven't lost your touch.
I had to go and check Logos.com to see if indeed they had such a resource ('Heresies of the Early Church' ). So I fell for my own joke.
Serves you right. I only knew I didn't have it and didn't check.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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I so agree that is is both affordable, and the best Bible Software I have ever encountered. There offer so much and give free books monthly. I totally agree with Richard!
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As I said before generally Logos is no more expensive on modern works than other software companies. I accept that one may say many of the public domain items are over priced since production costs are covered in community pricing. But no one is forcing anyone to buy anything.. Most of us seem very happy with Logos. It is not the cheapest, but it without a doubt has the widest array of books out there. It may seem a little bulky and buggy. But it is a fine piece of software, and I am glad I own it.
-Dan
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Super Tramp said:
Did not the Lord of the harvest instruct the laborers not to try and glean out the tares until harvest lest some of the wheat be lost?
[Y][:D] (I'll try to remember to use that the next time someone is upset about Logos publishing Catholic books.)
DMB said:I had to go and check Logos.com to see if indeed they had such a resource ('Heresies of the Early Church' ).
I've suggested Saints and Sinners in the Early Church. Will that do? [:P]
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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I agree. This prices are ridiculous. I just tried to purchase Believers Bible Commentary to add to my package. Logos wants 40 bucks for it. I can get the hard copy for 22.00 or the Kindle version for 21.00. While I would love to have this resource on the Logos platform, how do you justify charging almost double the price of any other format?
Also the huge differance in price from the Leaders package to the Scholars was prohibitive for me. I understand the need to turn a profit, but Logos really goes over the top with it.
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David thompson said:
I just tried to purchase Believers Bible Commentary to add to my package. Logos wants 40 bucks for it. I can get the hard copy for 22.00 or the Kindle version for 21.00.
I believe that is included in the Jeremiah Lifeworks Library (version 1, not version 2). Logos charges about $50 for it, but there may be older copies floating around.
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Sogol said:David thompson said:
I just tried to purchase Believers Bible Commentary to add to my package. Logos wants 40 bucks for it. I can get the hard copy for 22.00 or the Kindle version for 21.00.
I believe that is included in the Jeremiah Lifeworks Library (version 1, not version 2). Logos charges about $50 for it, but there may be older copies floating around.
I purchased the Jeremiah Lifeworks Library last week for $49.99 and it does include the Believer's Bible Commentary. Most often, a much better deal can be experienced through buying bundles or libraries. What I have been doing is to 1st see if the book that I am interested in is included in some bundle, then I look at the bundle and determine the number of other books that I am likely to purchase and either purchase the bundle right away or save it in a wish list for later purchase. In the case of the Jeremiah bundle, I was looking for Vine's Dictionary ($17), but found a number of other books included that I was interested in, so I waited a week or so rather than buy the Vine's Dictionary. Often times, it is not necessary to have a book immediately. :-)
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Erwin Stull, Sr. said:
I purchased the Jeremiah Lifeworks Library last week for $49.99 and it does include the Believer's Bible Commentary.
It looks like I got my Believer's Bible Commentary through the eBible Expanded Edition. I believe it is also included in the Thomas Nelson Bible Study Library, but I'm not 100% sure.
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Sogol said:
It looks like I got my Believer's Bible Commentary through the eBible Expanded Edition. I believe it is also included in the Thomas Nelson Bible Study Library, but I'm not 100% sure.
Yes, I just checked. It's included in 2 Logos Nelson Bundles (Nelson Bible Reference Bundle and Nelson 501 Book Unlock). I have the Bible Reference Bundle in my wish list primarily for WBC. I guess when I finally get the reference bundle, I'll have a few duplicates. I don't see the 2 packages that you listed on the Logos site.
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I must admit, the discussion is between QV and Logos pricing is interesting. I actually own both products, I've had QV since mid 1980's from Parsons and have updated it every 5 years or so - even when FindEx bought them out in 1999 and now with WordSearch taking over. I have the new Wordsearch Quickverse 10 ($19.00 upgrade with 20 books) and the last Quickverse 2011 Platinum - I have approximately 850 books in my collection.
I've owned Logos since 2005/06 and purchase the Scholars library with 369 books - I love the interface on Logos the best - it's much better than Quickverse 2011 - but the new QV 10 upgrade for $19.00 with 20 free books from Wordsearch is pretty much on par with Logos - they are even at this point. In terms of costs - it's not even close, I have spent 50% less on the QV over the years than what I've spent on Logos - example, I just purchased last week both The Pulpit Commentary and The Biblical Illustrator (complete volumes on both of them) for $70.00 from Quickverse while Logos has Pulpit for $170.00 & Biblical (Acts only) for $49.00. That's the facts - I have 350 more examples of actual purchases to prove my point. Yes, the Quickverse was on a special sale - but regular price for Pulpit's 23 volumes is $80.00 every day - not $170. Look it up if you doubt me. I have less money into QV with 780 books than I have in Logos at 369 books. yes, I have some of the best commentaries sets available in my QV collection - I compare every purchase between both options - people must be blind if they think Logos is on par for price. Here's the great thing about Logos in the past - they use to have the BEST user interface which helped justify their high price to those that could afford it, & rationalize it because they had the money to purchase it.......those days are gone - Wordsearch has closed that gap significantly and they have much lower sale/regular prices. This economy is in ruin and the thought of people purchasing books on payment plans means they don't have the cash and are going into debt........really?
Here's a bonus as well, I own 8 computers in my house (empty nest with just my wife) and Quickverse 2011 let's me load the program & all the books on each computer without any worry about license issues........as I can only be on one computer at a time anyways. Good luck doing that with Logos (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). To each his own preference, but not to each his own facts - on the whole for the average laymen & Pastor, Logos is much more expensive to own and build over time than the dozens of free or paid resources available in the software marketplace today. That's my perspective and experience for the past 25 years of actual ownership.
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Sean Myers said:
I have less money into QV with 780 books than I have in Logos at 369 books. yes, I have some of the best commentaries sets available in my QV collection - I compare every purchase between both options - people must be blind if they think Logos is on par for price.
I've got news for you. If you think the Pulpit Commentaries and Biblical Illustrator are "some of the best commentaries available", you don't know much about commentaries. That's OK since one's books should meet his personal needs, but they aren't the best—by a long shot. We've heard complaints about the price of Logos' resources continually from someone. The only answer that can be given is "If something else suits your needs better, go for it."
BTW: Yes, you can put Logos on all 500 of your computers which you or your wife use (if you should happen to have as many as Bartholomew Cubbins had hats).
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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When it comes to real commentaries I have Hermeneia (most of them), Continental (all of them), ICC (one vol: 2 Cor vol 1 chapters 1-7), Believer's Church Bible Commentary (one vol: Prv) in Logos. Then I have some printed commentaries too which I think are good but some of them are a bit old and therefore unknown but the authors are good. All of them may not be the best, but I've tried to avoid doublets and put a lot of effort for a not formally trained person at this stage many years before I'll prepare sermons and at least 2 years before I'll have a level of Greek knowledge that I'll be able to use a bit.
I don't have any other software. I got discounts on almost everything I bought (ICC and BCBC were among the exceptions). But I'm very poor so the reason is not that I would think that they are not worth paying for. This fall, as I didn't hurry to apply study-aid-money from the state, I took a payment plan - but it's manageable: $45 for 3 months.
My logic for investing in Logos is:
- that I wouldn't get this much to choose from if I would have chosen a different software and I'm somewhat picky with what to read so that's a point,
- that I want to be able to choose between installing on Windows or MacOS because I think that no-one can predict decades into the future which hardware is the wisest choice (interestingly Microsoft Word is cheaper for MacOS than for Windows, I haven't bought it yet but I guess I'll have to so that I'll be able to use PBB again),
- and that I rather invest as somewhat young because that hinders me from buying other stupid things in life - I'm not as wise yet as I will be when I'm a bit older. I know I used to do stupid choices, actually not that long before I became Christian again (I had an atheist period in my life, used to be Christian as youth and child).
To invest in Logos is generally cheaper than printed matter because it's more secure. I got fooled on a purchase of the end-of-2011 Oxford Encyclopedia of the Books of the Bible - the parcel newer arrive. I should have been more clever and suspicious when it "cost only" ~£170.
Just decided yesterday that I'll try to become an engineer - lot's of studies to do first before I get admitted to the college because I have focused mostly on humanistic subjects and practical work instead of science. I'm not gonna indulge buying a lot of books when I make money - instead I want to be able to prepare sermons without getting paid and drive pedicabs - bicycling has been my lifestyle for quite some time. I'm looking for friends from the U.K. and Helsinki to discuss the Bible with!
I don't see any major problems with Logos, for me personally. It works fast (I have SSD), it has capability, customer service has been good. I have just some wishes, such as these:
Jerusalem Bible or 1975 Bible In Orderhttp://community.logos.com/forums/p/55576/403442.aspx#403442
If Logos doesn't listen to me - then fine I'll just keep carrying both the laptop and the necessary printed Bibles and do more and more physical exercise and buy better bags so that I'll stop complaining about the weight.Disclosure!
trulyergonomic.com
48G AMD octacore V9.2 Acc 120 -
They do have a payment plan. Very simple. $5 interest per month. I pay about $100 a month and have been doing so since I got Logos. I keep buying new sets and will likely be paying logos $100 a month for the rest of my life. this doesn't count individual books I purchase from Vyrso.
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I do agree with previous posts about public domain stuff. I think Logos should discount these works far more, especially since there usually isn't that much tagging involved.
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I just don't see the issue with Logos pricing. I just saved a huge amount of money buying 2 volumes for $300 from Logos. Now granted they were somewhat more than the $125 Asherah volume, but probably the more expensive volumes took minutes longer to tag, etc.
Now in all fairness, the outside price for the 2 volumes was far higher and untagged. Cogitating on this, and noticing Logos seems to be having trouble lasso'ing publishers at good prices these days, I suspect the high priced public domain volumes are 'bridge' revenue streams, as Logos tries to convert to a subscription revenue base (similar to JBL etc).
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Forgive me I may be wrong here, but my understanding is that the software is "free" right? Meaning that the content sales support software development. So more goes into the "cost" of a resource than one might think.
On the other hand, the argument that such prices are "un-Christian" is dubious at best. Those who argue this are so completely misunderstanding both Christianity and the world and how it works, I don't even know where to start. Moreover, there is something extremely manipulative about that posture that really smacks of the unsavory. Sorry, not singling anyone out, but someone had to say this.
“To love means loving the unlovable. To forgive means pardoning the unpardonable. Faith means believing the unbelievable. Hope means hoping when everything seems hopeless.” ~Chesterton
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Nice Skirt !
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My sartorial splendor never ceases to bestow wonder upon passers-by.
“To love means loving the unlovable. To forgive means pardoning the unpardonable. Faith means believing the unbelievable. Hope means hoping when everything seems hopeless.” ~Chesterton
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George Somsel said:
If you think the Pulpit Commentaries and Biblical Illustrator are "some of the best commentaries available", you don't know much about commentaries. That's OK since one's books should meet his personal needs, but they aren't the best—by a long shot. We've heard complaints about the price of Logos' resources continually from someone. The only answer that can be given is "If something else suits your needs better, go for it."
Mostly, I agree with George. About commentaries and especially about, "If something else suits your needs better, go for it."
We all want everything as cheaply as possible. Overall, I believe Logos is by far the best value for me. But I do buy many books in Kindle or other format because they are cheaper than Logos. (Sometimes, like C. S. Lewis' works, the books aren't available in Logos.) It depends on the type of book and how I will use it. Commentaries and reference works are usually worth paying the premium to have them intergrated with Logos to me. Many other books are not worth the difference in price to me. So if something else suits your needs, go for it.
But there is no need to slander Logos, a great company with great products and great value.
"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley0 -
Schezic said:
Nice Skirt !
If I'm not mistaken, that "skirt" is the skirt of a long coat of the style worn in Dickens' day (in keeping with the use of the screen name "Mr. McCawber").
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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John Harrigan said:
I do agree with previous posts about public domain stuff. I think Logos should discount these works far more, especially since there usually isn't that much tagging involved.
If the book is public domain, and there is not much tagging involved, why not just make the Logos version yourself as a personal book? Then it costs nothing. Everybody is happy.
"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley0 -
Michael Childs said:
If the book is public domain, and there is not much tagging involved, why not just make the Logos version yourself as a personal book? Then it costs nothing. Everybody is happy.
Because they usually come in pdf, which is difficult to convert.
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John Harrigan said:Michael Childs said:
If the book is public domain, and there is not much tagging involved, why not just make the Logos version yourself as a personal book? Then it costs nothing. Everybody is happy.
Because they usually come in pdf, which is difficult to convert.
http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/convert-pdf-converter.html
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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George Somsel said:
most public domains are scanned not created from from docs, so even adobe conversion is mediocre at best.
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