Theology/Denomination Tags
Comments
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abondservant said:
John Dominic Crossan - wiki lists him as Roman Catholic (though he's no longer a priest). He's also tied to the Jesus Seminar and their quest for the historical jesus. Which may be a good collection to make as well.
Frederic Farrar - Anglican - kind of surprised he wasn't listed. You have to click the links for the churches he pastored to see he was/is Anglican.
Also - can you add OR MyTag:(short name for the group/theology in question IE MyTag:Anglican to the Anglican Collection) to the collections?
If anyone has a link to a suitably long and reliable list of those connected with The Jesus Seminar, then I would happily add this.
The MyTag suggestion seems sensible and may well satisfy Lynden as well. What do others think?
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Lynden Williams said:
Denomination: Seventh-day Adventist
Author:("Anderson, Bruce", "Lewis, Karen Ann", "Bacchiocchi, Samuel", "Land, Gary", "Knott, Ronald Allan", "Paulien, Jon", "Sahlin, Monte", "General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists", "Holbrook, Frank B.", "Colon, Jac", "Advent Source", "Day, Dan", "Weber, Martin", "Tucker, Mike", "Walter, Elden", "Colon, Jac", "Batchelor, Doug", "Chea, Alvin", "Chalice, Leander", "Papaioannou, Kim", "swenson, Terry", "Turner, Lawrence A.", "Mitchell, Larry A.", "Himes, Joshua V.", "Frazee, W.D.", "Tucker, Gayle", "Andrews University", "Brand, Leonard", "Davidson, Richard M.", "Dederen, Raoul", "Doukhan, Jacques B.", "Fayard, Carlos", "Gane, Roy", "Gugliotto, Lee J.", "Gulley, Norman R.", "Harding IV, George T.", "Hasel, Gerhard", "Hernandez, Barbara Couden", "Horn, Siegfried H.", "Knight, George R.", "LaRondelle, Hans K.", "Miller, Nicholas M.", "Neufeld, Don F.", "Nichol, Francis D.", "Rasell, Marc", "Rice, Richard", "Richards, W. Larry", "Smith, Uriah", "Stefanovic, Ranko", "Swanson, H. Peter", "White, Ellen G.") OR Publisher:("Adventsource", "Simple Church Global Network", "Andrews University Press", "Ellen G. White Estate", "Review and Herald", "Seventh-day Adventist") OR Subject:(“ellen white writings”) OR MyTag:(“sdaencyc”, “sdaatlas”)
Updated May 29, 2014
I've tried to include all of the SDA authors included on this and subsequent posts. It meant adding a lot of new authors. I'd prefer not to add Subject to these collections, though we could add "OR MyTag:("Seventh-Day Adventist") if others think this would be helpful (see previous post). If you were able to post the relevant authors and/or publishers here that are included only by adding "OR Subject:(“ellen white writings”) OR MyTag:(“sdaencyc”, “sdaatlas”)", then that would be helpful. I know Logos is not always consistent with the way it publishes this information.
The alternative would be for you to create a Collection called "Lynden's SDA" with Subject:(“ellen white writings”) OR MyTag:(“sdaencyc”, “sdaatlas”), and add the collection "Denom. Stream: Seventh-day Adventist". This would then automatically update and "Lynden's SDA" would include everything you wanted. Please let me know what you're thinking. Thanks for all the work you've put into this.
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Randy W. Sims said:
Thanks for posting your rule to this thread, Lynden. It looks like the additions you made for SDA are as listed out below. (It's probably a bit easier for Andrew if we just list the additions as a list rather than posting the entire rule, if possible.)
...
Currently, the generated rules don't contain Subject or MyTag filters. Is this something that would be useful to a lot of collections or just limited use?
Really helpful, Randy. Thanks! It may be worth adding MyTag filters (see my response to abondservant above). I'm happy to wait until others comment on this first though.
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Edwin Sully PAYET said:
Author:("Adams, W. Milton", “Anderson, Bruce”, “Andrews University”, “Bacchiocchi, Samuele”, “Batchelor, Doug”, “Brand, Leonard”, “Brown, Robert H.”, “Case, Steve”, “Chalice, Leander”, “Chea, Alvin”, “Coffin, Harold”, “Colon, Jac”, “Davidson, Richard M.”, “Day, Dan”, “Dederen, Raoul”, “Dickerson, Brenda”, “Doukhan, Jacques B.”, “du Preez, Ron”, “Dudley, Roger L.”, “Edson, Hiram”, "Evans, Mary J.", “Fayard, Carlos”, "Flowers, Ron", “Ford, Mark”, “Frazee, W.D.”, “Gane, Roy E.”, “General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists”, “Gugliotto, Lee J.”, “Gulley, Norman R.”, “Harding IV, George T.”, “Hasel, Gerhard”, “Hernandez, Barbara Couden”, “Himes, Joshua V.”, “Horn, Siegfried H.”, “Holbrook, Frank B.”, “Knight, George R.”, “Knott, Ronald Allan”, “Land, Gary”, “LaRondelle, Hans K.”, “Lewis, Karen Ann”, “Miller, Nicholas M.”, “Mitchel, Larry A.”, “Neufeld, Don F.”, “Nichol, Francis D.”, “Papaioannou, Kim”, "Paulien, Jon", "Penner, Todd C.", “Rasell, Marc”, “Rice, Richard”, “Richards, W. Larry”, “Roth, Ariel A.”, “Sahlin, Monte”, “Shea, William H.”, “Smith, Uriah”, “Stefanovic, Ranko”, “Swanson, H. Peter”, “Swenson, Terry”, “Tucker, Gayle”, “Tucker, Mike”, “Turner, Lawrence A.”, “Walter, Elden”, “Weber, Martin”, “White, Ellen G.”, “Geoscience Research Institute”) OR Publisher:(“Andrews University Press”, “AdventSource”, “Adventist Today”, “Biblical Perspectives”, “Center for Creative Ministry”, “Ellen G. White Estate”, “First Impressions”, “Jon Paulien”, “Pacific Press”, “Review and Herald”, “Simple Church Global Network”, “Seventh-day Adventist”) OR Subject:(“ellen white writings”) OR MyTag:(“sdaencyc”, “sdaatlas”, “sda”) OR adventist OR Seventh-day
This is really helpful, Edwin. I think I've included all the authors and publishers you suggested. See the previous posts for comments on the Subject and MyTag parts. If you were able to list the relevant authors and publishers for the resources that are excluded by not adding these lines, then I would be most grateful.
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abondservant said:
I have spent a good deal of time tagging most of my library - The inclusion of tags in rules would be helpful to me.
ALSO Kevin DeYoung is changing denominations to PCA
This seems a little premature, given the info provided on the linked page, but I've made the change. Thanks for the info and link. Let me know if I haven't included any of the other suggestions you've made here.
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fgh said:
This project has been noticed by BAR: http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/archaeology-today/cultural-heritage/digital-humanities/?mqsc=E3773539&utm_source=WhatCountsEmail&utm_medium=BHD+Week%20in%20Review%20Newsletter&utm_campaign=E4B531 (halfway down).
Great spot, fgh. I'd have missed this otherwise. Many thanks for posting.
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abondservant said:
Thanks for the update - also I noticed there is a new collection for Assemblies of God made just five days ago.
Not sure what this was about. I don't think it was anything to do with me...
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MJ. Smith said:
I was starting to see what new purchases had done to my unclassified list. Somehow my collections are not updating automatically - an issue I'll look into later. But I noticed that Catholics still look odd to me> I'm missing something in how you are looking at things. What I expected:
Denom. Stream: Catholic
Denominations: Latin, Syro-Malabar, Melkite, Maronite etc.
Subgroup: OFM, OP, SJ ...
This would match what I thought was the Anglican structure:
Denom. Stream: Anglican
Denominations: Church of England, Church of Ireland . . .
Subgroup: OFM (the most common Anglican order)
or the similar Lutheran structure:
Denom. Stream: Lutheran
Denominations: ELCA, WELS, LCMS ...
Subgroup: Franciscans, Holy Trinity, Order of Mary (sample Lutheran orders)
What am I missing?
Sorry it's taken so long to get back here, MJ. Please let me know if there's an issue with updating.
You're right about the most logical way to display these streams and subgroups. The current list is trying to force everything into just two categories, for the sake of the spreadsheet. I started breaking Latin Catholics into subgroups as it was such a large group and I hadn't bargained on the subgroups affecting so many pre-Reformation authors. It could be quite a bit of work to change now, especially if the Logos Rules worksheet was to cater for subgroups, which would require more work for Randy. What do others think? Would it be worth it?
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MJ. Smith said:
Trying to build a mind map of the relationships embedded in the collections and found a problem requiring duplication of data. My intent in suggesting the 2 categories:
- Pre-schism
- Post-schism. pre-reformation
was to allow the pre-schism group to be included in both the Catholic and Orthodox streams (and certain Protestant groups that claim them as well) and for post-schism, pre-reformation to be included in Catholic and certain Protestant groups e.g. Anglicans but not to be included in Orthodox.
That doesn't appear to be the intent of the current structure. It could be supported by duplicate entries - often 3 to include the religious order in the current structure. If that is the intent, I need to work my way through which require multiple entries if I am to correctly edit the table.
See previous post, and let me know if this isn't covered by possibly adding a third column 'subgroup' to the spreadsheet.
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MJ. Smith said:
Another interesting puzzle. (Yes, I'm going through in great details seeing if I'd be willing to help with the updates.)
Under "Anglican" is the Church of South India. From Wikipedia:
"The Church of South India (CSI) is the successor of the Church of England in India after Indian Independence. It came into being by a union of Anglican and Protestant churches in South India. It combined the South India United Church (union of the Congregationalists and the Presbyterians); the then 14 Anglican Dioceses of South India and one in Sri Lanka; and the South Indian District of the Methodist church With a membership of over four million, it is India's second largest Christian church after the Catholic Church in India. CSI is one of four united churches in the Anglican Communion."
Do United Churches need their own category as they represent a theological mix rather than belonging to any single thread?
Thanks for the attention to detail, MJ. I'm running out of time and will answer your other questions later.
My understanding (having spoken to a leader within the CSI) is that it is now Anglican, so that's how it has been labelled. The label Uniting has been in use on the Colleges and Universities worksheet for some time. It applies to churches that have united but have not joined the Anglican Communion.
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Welcome back Andrew!
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You may want to add "Do the collections automatically update" to your faq
Welcome back brother.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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MJ. Smith said:
The structure of the Congregational entries confuses me.
In the case of the Evangelical Free Church of America, if I recall correctly the EFCA merged with the Congregational Church. In the case of the United Church of Christ, the Congregational Church merged into the UCC. The two entries have opposite relationships. However, there is a larger question - what relationship is being shown by the denominational stream - history of theology or church ecumenical history?
There's no doubt it gets messy at times with merges and splits. The relationship generally represents ecumenical history, but if a church has moved away from its roots, then it may be better represented in a different way. I accept its a little subjective in places, which is one reason I invite feedback, In the case of the UCC, it seems that Congregational best defines them. Although Evangelical churches merged into the UCC, it may be best described as Mainline now. Its denominational stream could be Reformed, but Congregational seems a better fit.
Regarding the EFCA, I'm not sure it merged with the Congregational Church. This doesn't seem to be represented on its website (http://www.efca.org/explore/who-we-are). They seem to be happy with the Evangelical label, and that seems to best represent them as a church. When I first started this, polity seemed to be more important, so I would have labelled EFCA Congregational. Now Evangelical seems a better fit. I'd especially welcome feedback from someone within the EFCA.
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MJ. Smith said:
What is the thinking for making Arminianism a denomination rather than a theological stance? And if a person gives a parachurch as their denomination, is it really a parachurch anymore?
That may be the result of a glitch in the code at the time you wrote. I made a change to the data, which affected how the code ran and it temporarily showed Theologies as Denominations in some cases. Only Grotius and Arminius are currently labelled under Arminian. This seemed to be what best defined them at the time, but I'm open to other suggestions.
Regarding parachurches, this label only applies to the Christian and Missionary Alliance, which grew into a denomination but was originally a parachurch organisation. When I first labelled it, I was focusing on its early history. Maybe I should change it to Evangelical, which probably better represents where it sits as a denomination today.
More generally, I'm aware a review of the categories is overdue. They morphed quite a bit when the project first began. I think most of them are right, but a few could still be tweaked.
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C&MA is in it self a denomination - though I don't think they would mind being lumped in with others under evangelical. I attended a C&MA 4 year school that proudly declared themselves non-denominational and evangelical. Most of my professors bore out this interdenominationalism in that I had Southern Baptist (not SBC convention is something we do once a year
), Presbyterian, C&MA, a Mennonite and a oneness pentecostal math teacher (they wouldn't let her teach theology which burned her biscuits).
They are Arminian in their theology; and likely could be left as simply C&MA (as opposed to parachurch). I have maybe 20 or 30 titles I think?L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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All of the groups at https://faithlife.com/logos-library-theology-denomination-tags/documents have just been updated. This reflects the changes in the spreadsheet: 7853.Denominations and Theology 01 July 2014.zip
It includes 1686 new authors. 651 more authors have been categorised and 1334 countries, 612 Years of Birth and 1372 Years of Death have been added, all of which is now recorded on the Notes worksheet.
The Christian and Missionary Alliance is now Evangelical, rather than Parachurch.
The reference guide is here: 5367.Theology and Denomination Tag Reference.doc
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abondservant said:
You may want to add "Do the collections automatically update" to your faq
Welcome back brother.Thanks for the suggestion. If I'm honest, I've never been overly sure about the updates. When I look at https://faithlife.com/logos-library-theology-denomination-tags/documents after making changes in Logos, it says that the document was changed x minutes ago, but when I look under Manage Your Documents, it says that my groups do not have the latest update, so I then click publish update on each one (which is tedious for this many collections). I assume that they then update automatically for everyone, but I didn't want to document it without checking. Does it definitely update automatically? Do I really have to click on each one, then click publish update? When I know the answers, I'll add it to the reference guide.
A belated thanks for the "Welcome Back". [:)]
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What a labor of love! Thanks so much Andrew.
From my perspective as long as you update your copy of the document the changes are automatically applied to each collection.
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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Not to nit pick but the southern baptist denomination is simply: Southern Baptist. Convention is an activity our denomination participates in, so it would be like calling catholics "catholic massers" or something like that.
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Also - adding "Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary","Golden Gate Baptist","Midwestern Baptist" to both the baptist, and southern baptist collections picked up an additional twenty titles. I happened to notice only three of the six southern baptist seminaries were listed and thought it may be good to include them all.
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Bruce Dunning said:
What a labor of love! Thanks so much Andrew.
From my perspective as long as you update your copy of the document the changes are automatically applied to each collection.
Thanks for the encouragement, Bruce, and for the feedback regarding making changes.
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Words, words, words... I know you're not nit-picking and that denomination is a word that many will deny even in "the word's most general meaning" (though the SBC website does accept this definition: http://www.sbc.net/aboutus/acloserlook.asp). One problem is that there is no widely accepted word for trying to describe a church group/organization/body...
When I started, I was often using the Wikipedia definitions. If I type "Southern Baptist" into Google then the Wikipedia entry comes up in summary form on the right of my screen saying "The Southern Baptist Convention is a United States-based Christian denomination." I don't use the word Convention for the search. In the spreadsheet, the category is generally an adjective (e.g. Lutheran, Pre-Reformation, Anglican) and the subcategory is the more specific body (e.g. Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod, United Methodist Church, Anglican Church of Australia). However, this is not a hard and fast rule and should probably be tidied up at some stage. For example, to keep subcategories short, the word Church is often omitted (e.g. Seventh-day Adventist). To me, Southern Baptist is the adjective, Southern Baptist Convention is the body. To keep it short, "Southern Baptist" could be used, as it is suitably unambiguous. I may yet change it at some point when I tidy the category and subcategory lists. I'll try to change a number at the same time though to prevent constant change.
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abondservant said:
Also - adding "Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary","Golden Gate Baptist","Midwestern Baptist" to both the baptist, and southern baptist collections picked up an additional twenty titles. I happened to notice only three of the six southern baptist seminaries were listed and thought it may be good to include them all.
Thanks for the feedback. Out of interest, which resources are brought up by Author:("Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary","Golden Gate Baptist","Midwestern Baptist")? The Logos website doesn't seem to suggest any resources where these are the authors.
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abondservant said:
Southern Baptist (not SBC convention is something we do once a year
)abondservant said:
Not to nit pick but the southern baptist denomination is simply: Southern Baptist. Convention is an activity our denomination participates in, so it would be like calling catholics "catholic massers" or something like that.
Southern Baptist Convention (aka SBC) is the official name of the denomination, as their website (sbc.net) confirms:
As Andrew later points out, Convention isn't strictly necessary to identify it, since Southern Baptist is suitably unique.
Another word sometimes used for a denomination is a conference. Even though conference can also mean an event (like convention can) it too also means a grouping of like-minded churches, as in the Conservative Congregational Christian Conference (CCCC), of which the church I grew up in was a member.
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i added them where the other schools are listed - under publisher if I remember right. I think the have been journal articles? As to the name - I've never heard it referred to with "convention" on the end other than as initials. Internally I've only heard it called southern baptist. In either case I can respond with more detail when I leave here and head back to civilization
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abondservant said:
Internally I've only heard it called southern baptist.
That's true, but the official name is still Southern Baptist Convention. Most of us shorten that to Southern Baptist or simply SBC.
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Oddly enough if you click on the image in my last post it shows it right side up, but the forum software displays it sideways. Weird.
Any way, I'll defer to Jack et al on this, if you want to keep calling us Southern Baptist Convention I'll not complain.
As to the seminaries, they were definitely added under publisher. I added "ANDNOT Edition:User" to eliminate the possibility of the change picking up personal books, same number of books added with or without PB's included (and later deleted that to keep my rules inline with those of the spread sheet).
Finally I am happy to report that other than Perseus I am down to 368 titles that are not yet in the spreadsheet..
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abondservant said:
Any way, I'll defer to Jack et al on this, if you want to keep calling us Southern Baptist Convention I'll not complain.
Interestingly enough, just yesterday my Pastor mentioned one of his professors saying that the Southern Baptist Convention only existed for two days a year. So your original interpretation is also held by others, even though the official web page reflects the full name. The North American Mission Board's mission statement begins, "The estimated 46,000 autonomous churches that cooperate together with the Southern Baptist Convention pool their resources to support the work of the North American Mission Board." With that many Baptists, we are certain to find multiple opinions. [:D]
After all, as the old proverb states, "Assemble 6 Baptists for a business meeting, and you are guaranteed to have at least 9 different opinions." [;)]
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Jack Caviness said:abondservant said:
Any way, I'll defer to Jack et al on this, if you want to keep calling us Southern Baptist Convention I'll not complain.
Interestingly enough, just yesterday my Pastor mentioned one of his professors saying that the Southern Baptist Convention only existed for two days a year. So your original interpretation is also held by others, even though the official web page reflects the full name. The North American Mission Board's mission statement begins, "The estimated 46,000 autonomous churches that cooperate together with the Southern Baptist Convention pool their resources to support the work of the North American Mission Board." With that many Baptists, we are certain to find multiple opinions.
After all, as the old proverb states, "Assemble 6 Baptists for a business meeting, and you are guaranteed to have at least 9 different opinions."
I wonder if we had the same professor
, Dr. Akin said something to that effect in one of the classes I've taken with him. L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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