Is Logos 8 an improvement?
Comments
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
Improvement?
- From what I've read about, none for me. I don't use Logos notes, don't need a workflow, and the Canvas is a dead-end Logos will have to maintain for a while.
- What's worse the tabs and wasted space will likely destroy my tight heavily used layout. No thank you.
How?
- Would be an nice and easy UI for search. My main use, beyond reading. I'm a 7-er until the search UI appears (maybe on clouds). My first no-upgrade.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Personally I love Logos 8. There are lots of great features like improved notes, workflows and canvas but what I've appreciated the most so far is the increase in speed of searching and the incredible savings of highly discounted packages.
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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Maybe when it gets to 8.5. Too many things they broke, releaesed full of bugs or with immature data sets. Going from latest version of 7 to 8.0 is a backward step IMHO but if you want best pricing on new libraries you are locked into making the ‘upgrade’.
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
Yes, sure!
(well, looking over the new homepage, which was a design decision)
Workflows is a really great improvement. Even the current functionality is big, and with some additional tweaks it is bound to become the #1 killer reason to upgrade or to buy L8 for the first time. Cut the additional tweaks - even today it allows users to utilize the multitude of Logos functionalities in an ordered sequence, being explained what, why and to which desired outcome things are done. Shared Workflows give a whole new area of opportunity for using Logos in a teaching or group study environment.
Notes is a great improvement. The current functionality of it is a big step forward (okay, while I do have 60k of notes, I never cared for organizing them in those weird notebooks - and now I don't need to!). Faceted filtering of notes is so cool. Okay, I'll be happy when we can filter highlights as well, or at least search for them again.
Faceted filtering in general is a great improvement. While I believe that most of it was possible in the old versions (e.g. using elaborated filter syntax in the library, and tweaking those ever more to get the desired results), it is so much more user-friendly and intuitive.
Canvas is a great improvement. I'm not the most creative kind of guy, but what other users have created with this tool is breathtaking. And the first steps seem to be easy - just copy some bible verses over and then start adding info to it.
And there are many other improvements as well. One that comes immediately to mind: differentiating between recently added and recently updated resources in the library. I had a workaround by tagging all my resources with the same tag, so things in the library without that tag identified as newly added, whereas other recently updated resources were just this. Actually I can cease doing so, remove that tag and rather put meaningful tags in place, since I can see what's new and what's updated easily in the library filter facets. There must be dozens of threads over the years where user asked "I can see how to order the library by last updated - but what of the stuff showing on top is really new?" Now it's so easy.
So yes, in my opinion it is an improvement, a great one over L7. Do I miss the L7 homepage? You bet. But then large numbers of users skipped the old homepage altogether, and my very special usage shouldn't stand in the way of Faithlife developing a seamlessly integrated look and feel over all platforms, with a look that attracts new users to Logos. And some of the new tiles are improvements too, such as the instant access to started workflows and courses.
My 2c
Have joy in the Lord!
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One useful Logos 8 improvement is having two Library tabs open (with different filtering) when modifying titles and/or collection(s).
Thankful for Faithlife article => Changes from Logos 7 to Logos 8
Keep Smiling [:)]
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I agree with the positive comments. Best for me has been the free reading courses that have given me a great new way to use my library to my benefit. If you haven't tried them you should.
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For me it is light years ahead of L7 to the point I can deal with minor setbacks while kinks are worked out. The new Notes Tool is AMAZING for taking notes quickly and efficiently. Workflows help me remember to not just keep to the academic. Speed is greatly enhanced. I also love the new guides and that you can run individual pieces of guides on their own as a standalone report.
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
Yes. Speed and stability.
For some there were some elements left from some of the tools in shifting from version 7 to 8, losing therefore some feature parity. Personally, for what I use Logos for I was pleased and did not look back.
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I've been happy with it so far.
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I'm just a civilian (non-minister/student/teacher) user but I will say yes. Although I have only started looking into workflows they look promising to me. The library sidebar will come in handy. The new datasets i look forward to checking out. I can be somewhat jaded however as I view my bible software as some people view their cars or computer.... I want the best and support it. Sort of like buying a super fast sports car but know you do not really need all that speed :-)
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Yes.
Speed, cleaner UI, notes, and I even like Canvas (I thought it would be useless when I first saw it). Logos 8 is actually quite stable considering the changes. Faithlife did a good job rolling it out. Whiners are gonna whine whatever Faithlife does. [:D]
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I think there's some bumps in the rollout, some quirks I can't completely fathom, but this puppy is much faster which means I still don't have a justifiable excuse to buy a new machine.[8-|]
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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NB.Mick said:David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
Yes, sure!
(well, looking over the new homepage, which was a design decision)
Workflows is a really great improvement. Even the current functionality is big, and with some additional tweaks it is bound to become the #1 killer reason to upgrade or to buy L8 for the first time. Cut the additional tweaks - even today it allows users to utilize the multitude of Logos functionalities in an ordered sequence, being explained what, why and to which desired outcome things are done. Shared Workflows give a whole new area of opportunity for using Logos in a teaching or group study environment.
Notes is a great improvement. The current functionality of it is a big step forward (okay, while I do have 60k of notes, I never cared for organizing them in those weird notebooks - and now I don't need to!). Faceted filtering of notes is so cool. Okay, I'll be happy when we can filter highlights as well, or at least search for them again.
Faceted filtering in general is a great improvement. While I believe that most of it was possible in the old versions (e.g. using elaborated filter syntax in the library, and tweaking those ever more to get the desired results), it is so much more user-friendly and intuitive.
Canvas is a great improvement. I'm not the most creative kind of guy, but what other users have created with this tool is breathtaking. And the first steps seem to be easy - just copy some bible verses over and then start adding info to it.
And there are many other improvements as well. One that comes immediately to mind: differentiating between recently added and recently updated resources in the library. I had a workaround by tagging all my resources with the same tag, so things in the library without that tag identified as newly added, whereas other recently updated resources were just this. Actually I can cease doing so, remove that tag and rather put meaningful tags in place, since I can see what's new and what's updated easily in the library filter facets. There must be dozens of threads over the years where user asked "I can see how to order the library by last updated - but what of the stuff showing on top is really new?" Now it's so easy.
So yes, in my opinion it is an improvement, a great one over L7. Do I miss the L7 homepage? You bet. But then large numbers of users skipped the old homepage altogether, and my very special usage shouldn't stand in the way of Faithlife developing a seamlessly integrated look and feel over all platforms, with a look that attracts new users to Logos. And some of the new tiles are improvements too, such as the instant access to started workflows and courses.
My 2c
Ditto everything except Canvas. It's drraaggggyyy to use, never snappy. I already use an iPad and Apple Pencil for working with the text, and InDesign for designing handouts, and OmniGraffle for charting, and Canvas just can't compete with them. But, it doesn't offend me that it's there, and I know that some enjoy it very much.
As to the v. 7 Homepage, I had mine blank 99% of the time, because I didn't find it useful. I'd like to be able to turn off the dynamic content, and I look forward to adding my own layouts to the Dashboard. But again, it doesn't offend me, and some find it helpful.
Finally, 8 is much quicker for me, and I happen to like the interface update. It's cleaner and lighter looking, and doesn't look like a Windows port on my Mac any longer. For my purposes, it's the best update I've experienced (I think I started with Logos with v. 5, but don't quote me on that).
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
I think 8 is an improvement over 7 and will get better as your familiarity with it grows and features are completed. It's quicker and the UI is more consistent.
But I would suggest reading Phil Gon's document on the differences to verify how some of the changes will impact you and then schedule the update when you have time to play with it to get familiar with the changes. Good example is that UI consistency means that items have moved so are no longer where your muscle memory expects.
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
David,
I really enjoy L8 mostly due to the speed improvements. There are certain changes that may impact workflow depending on how you work. Specifically, reading plans and notes. As Graham suggested in the post above, you should read Phil's comments regarding changes and items yet to be implemented into L8.
L8 is a huge improvement given my workflow, mostly because it is faster and the customization of guides is more intuitive. The new notes system is going to be easier for me to work with, but I do not have thousands of notes and highlights. I might actually use them more because I always struggled with whether the file needed to be "resource specific" or not. I also never understood why highlights need to be in a "note" file. With the new system those are not as necessary but still available. I could not locate the link, but maybe someone can provide it for you.
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John Fidel said:David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
David,
I really enjoy L8 mostly due to the speed improvements. There are certain changes that may impact workflow depending on how you work. Specifically, reading plans and notes. As Graham suggested in the post above, you should read Phil's comments regarding changes and items yet to be implemented into L8.
L8 is a huge improvement given my workflow, mostly because it is faster and the customization of guides is more intuitive. The new notes system is going to be easier for me to work with, but I do not have thousands of notes and highlights. I might actually use them more because I always struggled with whether the file needed to be "resource specific" or not. I also never understood why highlights need to be in a "note" file. With the new system those are not as necessary but still available. I could not locate the link, but maybe someone can provide it for you.
Here's the link: https://support.logos.com/hc/en-us/articles/360019191392-Changes-from-Logos-7-to-Logos-8
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Thanks David!
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I don't see myself using canvas a great deal and I'm not sure about workflows, but yes, I think L8 is an improvement and I would not like it if I had to go back.
I too find it overall faster (I agree that canvas drags though) and cleaner UI (despite some of the space lost in bars). I like the font improvement. For me, faceted searching is a huge improvement all around (even though in many cases it is incomplete or even empty).
I find also the new docs, guides, and tools menu easy to use. I like the fact that I can quickly and easily use a guide part without having to create a custom guide.
The new Notes tool makes it easier to search and find notes quickly across different annotation files (now, notebooks).
I also like it that Denise does not because it contributes a sense of normality to my world [;)]
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
In addition to Phil's document there is a lot of information in this Forum as well.
Hard to come up with a good analogy but I think that most would agree that 7 to 8 is a bigger step forward than 6 to 7 so has a bit more of a learning curve than you might expect.
The other downside of this bigger step forward is that there are some rough edges that still need finishing off.
The big plus here is that by taking the bigger step 8 removes constraints that could probably never be addressed in smaller steps. UI consistency is probably a reasonable example. Personally I did not appreciate or even notice the accumulated inconsistencies in 7. I can see it now and while the transition is painful I appreciate that there will be further benefits as new features appear.
Better and improved are subjective terms and believe me when 8 downloaded to my system and I went to the home page to start my daily Bible reading these were not the words that described 8.
8 is enough of a change to justify making time to familiarise yourself with it IMHO.
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
In addition to Phil's document there is a lot of information in this Forum as well.
Hard to come up with a good analogy but I think that most would agree that 7 to 8 is a bigger step forward than 6 to 7 so has a bit more of a learning curve than you might expect.
The other downside of this bigger step forward is that there are some rough edges that still need finishing off.
The big plus here is that by taking the bigger step 8 removes constraints that could probably never be addressed in smaller steps. UI consistency is probably a reasonable example. Personally I did not appreciate or even notice the accumulated inconsistencies in 7. I can see it now and while the transition is painful I appreciate that there will be further benefits as new features appear.
Better and improved are subjective terms and believe me when 8 downloaded to my system and I went to the home page to start my daily Bible reading these were not the words that described 8.
8 is enough of a change to justify making time to familiarise yourself with it IMHO.
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Francis said:
I also like it that Denise does not because it contributes a sense of normality to my world. Right, Denise?
You guys are like the husband that told his wife what you really, really wanted in a new car. You were quite specific (you thought). She happily came home with the brand new car, and it was missing pretty much everything you spoke about. But, oh wow, what a great car!! Maybe the next one?
Or need I reference the thread?
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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That's it! Go for it, Dee!
Joke aside, one may ask a Corvette for Christmas and not get it. To replace the 2015 Mazda, they get the 2018 edition. Not as glamorous that's true but doesn't mean it's not an upgrade and nicer.
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Francis said:
That's it! Go for it, Dee!
Joke aside, one may ask a Corvette for Christmas and not get it. To replace the 2015 Mazda, they get the 2018 edition. Not as glamorous that's true but doesn't mean it's not an upgrade and nicer.
Mr Francis, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I haven't updated about 40 of my ios apps. If there's no security issues, and nothing I need, let it sit ... devs have bad habits. See doc's comment.
Regarding the Mazda, if you're married, you'll do well.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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deleted post (digression)
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One useful Logos 8 improvement is having two Library tabs open (with different filtering) when modifying titles and/or collection(s).
Thankful for Faithlife article => Changes from Logos 7 to Logos 8
Keep Smiling
I did not even know this. Thanks.
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David McKay said:
Do you think Logos 8 is an improvement? How?
I'm choosing to be patient. 'Now' really isn't the time to ask this question. Wait a year until all the marketing promises have been fulfilled (or not). I've learned to smack myself when I see something in Logos that looks "promising." Sometimes it is; sometimes it isn't.
As I said, I'm choosing to be patient. There will be *plenty* of time to rejoice or be critical in a few months when we see where this goes.
My only point of negativity (I've expressed elsewhere on the forums) is my surprise at the not-ready-for-primetime nature of the new release. I'm sure there are reasons known only to those in the meeting rooms where the decisions were made, but based on recent history, I'm surprised at the volume of, "coming soons" in the software (one example below).
Eating a steady diet of government cheese, and living in a van down by the river.
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Doc B said:
I'm surprised at the volume of, "coming soons" in the software (one example below).
FYI - this is now included in the current beta, which doesn't negate the point you are making but I wanted to let you know
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For me, it is NOT. This is why...
For those who work in more than one language like me (Spanish and English) it is NOT an improvement. They removed the "Preferred Bible" button from the Home Page. Technical Support told me I have to go to the Library, search for the preferred Bible I want to use, select it, go to Prioritize and then move it up to the top. WOW! This is important because the hyperlinks work according to the preferred bible. So each time I decided to study and prepare lessons in English or Spanish, I now have to go through all these steps.
This feature removal outweighs for me the benefits of Logos 8. If you work this way DO NOT switch to Logos 8 until they restore this feature or provide an easier way to switch preferred Bibles.
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Roland Bowen said:
until they restore this feature or provide an easier way to switch preferred Bibles.
https://community.logos.com/forums/p/174028/1006149.aspx#1006149 shows some ideas that are being considered to address this.
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Awesome!
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