8.1 (8.1.0.0016) is Now Available
To immediately update to the current stable version enter the Update Now command. Otherwise, the app will automatically update the next time it's scheduled to check for updates.
Comments
-
-
This update is great! [Y]
0 -
I'm glad to see this update but: 6 weeks on and no updates to the Theology Guide dataset?
0 -
Sean said:
I'm glad to see this update but: 6 weeks on and no updates to the Theology Guide dataset?
Hey, there's no date function on the lectionaries either so just wait in line.[:P]
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
0 -
[Y] Thanks Philana and the FL team.
0 -
I'm very thankful for the continual improvements, especially now that highlights have returned to secondary resources in multiple resources view although it still needs some tweaking - see http://community.logos.com/forums/t/174383.aspx
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
0 -
Thanks to Philana and the team.
Great to see so many of the little bugs being ironed out.
0 -
Sean said:
I'm glad to see this update but: 6 weeks on and no updates to the Theology Guide dataset?
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
0 -
Sean said:
I'm glad to see this update but: 6 weeks on and no updates to the Theology Guide dataset?
https://community.logos.com/forums/t/176574.aspx
- Systematic Theology Cross References: new resource added, resource updates.
Is that what the guide uses? I looked at a few articles, didn't see any changes to the STs it referred to.
0 -
Sean said:
- Systematic Theology Cross References: new resource added, resource updates.
Is that what the guide uses? I looked at a few articles, didn't see any changes to the STs it referred to.
Ack! You are correct. I keep getting these datasets mixed up. This is the dataset that powers the Systematic Theologies passage guide section, not the Systematic Theologies theology guide section.
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
0 -
So when are you going to put a link back into the software to the release notes?
Why did Logos remove this in the first place. Why did you think it was an improvement to make it harder for users to access the release notes (or what resources have been update for that matter by burying this information in the library). A user should not have to go to the forums or the Wiki site to find the release notes, they should be easily accessible from the software, preferably the home page.
Most disappointing not to see such a basic piece of information that should never have been removed in the first place still not put back into the software after 6 weeks.
0 -
Any update on when the auto columns setting is going to be fixed on the home page.
Thank you for allowing me to finally turn off all of the advertising in the explore section of the home page. I now only have feature suggestions displayed. It looks much less like a box of discarded jigsaw pieces though I would prefer to be able to control the number of cereal box collector cards it displays.
0 -
doc said:
So when are you going to put a link back into the software to the release notes?
Why did Logos remove this in the first place. Why did you think it was an improvement to make it harder for users to access the release notes (or what resources have been update for that matter by burying this information in the library). A user should not have to go to the forums or the Wiki site to find the release notes, they should be easily accessible from the software, preferably the home page.
Most disappointing not to see such a basic piece of information that should never have been removed in the first place still not put back into the software after 6 weeks.
I agree it should be brought back, and I think they said they are planning on it. But to be fair, you always had to go to the wiki for the notes but having the link was nice for sure.
0 -
doc said:
Why did Logos remove this in the first place.
We didn't modify the old home page. Instead, we completely started over from scratch. There wasn't time to implement the feature you are talking about in the new implementation, and the old implementation could not be kept, as it is not compatible with the new homepage. It's still on the list to do, but there have been higher priority issues that have kept us busy.
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
0 -
Yes you always had to go to the Wiki, but you the link was in front of you, I never said it was otherwise, I simply did not go into all the detail for brevity’s sake.
David Taylor Jr said:doc said:So when are you going to put a link back into the software to the release notes?
Why did Logos remove this in the first place. Why did you think it was an improvement to make it harder for users to access the release notes (or what resources have been update for that matter by burying this information in the library). A user should not have to go to the forums or the Wiki site to find the release notes, they should be easily accessible from the software, preferably the home page.
Most disappointing not to see such a basic piece of information that should never have been removed in the first place still not put back into the software after 6 weeks.
I agree it should be brought back, and I think they said they are planning on it. But to be fair, you always had to go to the wiki for the notes but having the link was nice for sure.
0 -
- The old home page was not broken so didn’t require starting from scratch again.
- if you understood your customers you would have known customers expected these to be there when they loaded Logos 8 for the first time,
- The home page is the first impression a user gets of a new Logos release and putting to market a home page that is missing features and uncustomisable is a huge mistake I hope FL never make again.
- You bought off more than you could chew with the notes upgrade the home page should have been left alone.
- Going about things the way FL has with the Logos 8 release has been a message from the company to users that we take our.Customers for granted.
doc said:Why did Logos remove this in the first place.
We didn't modify the old home page. Instead, we completely started over from scratch. There wasn't time to implement the feature you are talking about in the new implementation, and the old implementation could not be kept, as it is not compatible with the new homepage. It's still on the list to do, but there have been higher priority issues that have kept us busy.
0 -
doc said:
- The old home page was not broken so didn’t require starting from scratch again.
- if you understood your customers you would have known customers expected these to be there when they loaded Logos 8 for the first time,
- The home page is the first impression a user gets of a new Logos release and putting to market a home page that is missing features and uncustomisable is a huge mistake I hope FL never make again.
- You bought off more than you could chew with the notes upgrade the home page should have been left alone.
- Going about things the way FL has with the Logos 8 release has been a message from the company to users that we take our.Customers for granted.
I hope you can believe me when I say that we don't lightly make the decision to throw something away and start from scratch. There were (and still are) extremely good reasons for making the decision we made, including that the old implementation did not allow us to move forward in adding features that we want to add in the future.
I very much regret that this has been so upsetting for you (and others who share your opinion). I sincerely hope that your daily workflow is not excessively impaired until the time when we are able to provide a suitable replacement.
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
0 -
doc said:
- The old home page was not broken so didn’t require starting from scratch again.
- if you understood your customers you would have known customers expected these to be there when they loaded Logos 8 for the first time,
- The home page is the first impression a user gets of a new Logos release and putting to market a home page that is missing features and uncustomisable is a huge mistake I hope FL never make again.
- You bought off more than you could chew with the notes upgrade the home page should have been left alone.
- Going about things the way FL has with the Logos 8 release has been a message from the company to users that we take our.Customers for granted.
doc, how can you be so naive.
Logosians love cars ... used to be Cadallacs, but now Ferraris. Now, let's say the Italian car designer wanted to put in an engine that would go far faster. Future plans. So, they designed one, but it wasn't quite finished. But they put it in the new model anyway. And promised they'd try to finish it sometime .... priorities, priorities.
See?
Andrew's a good guy. And my old Ferrari 7 still does great at the track.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
0 -
-
doc said:
Any update on when the auto columns setting is going to be fixed on the home page.
This has been fixed and is working for me. It does still show 4 columns briefly before anything gets rendered but switches to 5 (which is what fits on my screen) when rendered. Are you seeing something different?
0 -
It's still on the list to do, but there have been higher priority issues that have kept us busy.
I, too, had been eagerly expecting and awaiting these seemingly simple widgets.
After the launch of Logos 8, it seemed the most common complaint (together with setting the preferred bible) to fix this omission - in fact it was actually a backward, retrograde step in the UX by actually making it harder (more steps/clicks) to do something that was easy in the previous version. Surely this level of interest/demand from users/customers should see these features included on your priority list. After all, users are ultimately your ambassadors and sales staff - you don't want to be creating a new tag line: 'Logos 8 - making things more difficult for the user than Logos 7'!!
Moan over! Thanks for all the fixes you have been working on.
James
PS: My list of other desired features/priority list are:
1. Tables and images in notes
2. Much much much improved library file management [e.g. easily change from within the program folder/drive book resources are stored, which books to download from my account to a particular device etc etc etc]
3. Tables and images in Canvas
3. More levels of the numbering/heirarchy in Workflows e.g. 3.a.i.(i) etc
0 -
doc said:
Why did Logos remove this in the first place.
We didn't modify the old home page. Instead, we completely started over from scratch. There wasn't time to implement the feature you are talking about in the new implementation, and the old implementation could not be kept, as it is not compatible with the new homepage. It's still on the list to do, but there have been higher priority issues that have kept us busy.
Andrew
Appreciate that it is difficult to give the level of detail that will satisfy everyone but some idea of where items fit in the priority list and how that might translate to a delivery date/release would be one way to avoid the on going frustrations.
Rightly or wrongly 8.1 was mentioned a lot in the context of what was missing from 7 on day one and this has set some "false" expectations. Unfortunately until some expectations are set by Faithlife these "false" expectations will persist and the frustration will continue.
0 -
MJ. Smith said:Sean said:
I'm glad to see this update but: 6 weeks on and no updates to the Theology Guide dataset?
Hey, there's no date function on the lectionaries either so just wait in line.
Hopefully they prioritize re-adding lectionary functionality in the next update. And why are the Lectionary and Devotional Quickstart layouts not included in the list of Quickstart layouts you can add to the homepage? If there are 11 Quickstart layouts total there should be 11 Quickstart layouts included in the list of Quickstart layouts you can add to the homepage, not just 9. I actually wouldn't mind if you brought back a single card with all the Quickstart layouts listed like you had in Logos 7. That was handy.
I have customized the homepage Lectionary layout, therefore it will only open the Catholic lectionary since that's the one I saved the layout with. Thus I like to also use the Quickstart Lectionary layout to open the Revised Common Lectionary in a layout. Right now I'm pretty much rolling with the Catholics since that's the only lectionary that will open from the homepage. Even when I add another lectionary card to the homepage it still opens the Catholic lectionary because I've customized the Lectionary homepage layout. If I could also add the Lectionary Quickstart layout to the homepage, at least it would open my top prioritized lectionary (RCL Daily). That's what I was doing in Logos 7, using the Quickstart layout with my RCL Daily readings and the homepage layout for the Catholic lectionary. Yes I do use more than one lectionary.
Faithlife might also consider simplifying the Lectionary homepage layout, there's way too much going on for daily reading. I wouldn't have to customize the homepage layout if it weren't so busy. I noticed you simplified the Passage homepage layout in the last update, you should do the same for the Lectionay homepage layout. My suggestion is to remove the commentary and devotional. I don't use a commentary for daily reading or for simple study, if I need a commentary I'll open one ad hoc, not off the bat. The devotionals are completely unrelated to the readings in the lectionary so I don't need that on the layout. Also, I don't need five bible translations, two would suffice. And put the "cited by" and "explore" tabs side by side in a panel instead of stacking them, there's too much info in both tabs for a half-screen set up (especially on my 14-inch laptop). So that leaves you with the lectionary (and the missal if Catholic), two bibles, and the explore and cited by tabs side by side in the same panel, simple and clean. Just my suggestion, but maybe others have input on how to simply the Lectionary layout.
0 -
David Taylor Jr said:
Honestly some people are going to complain no matter what Faithlife does.
Perhaps if we do it vigorously enough we can get some aerobic benefit out of it.
;-)
0 -
Now the font in the Table of Contents is small, at least I am happy! [:D]
Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 11
0 -
0
-
Right.
If you aren't familiar with the software industry that is always true. Development always look at their priority lists for fixes and enhancements. Faithlife, from an outsiders view that understands the industry of software development, does a good job. It is hard as you want to continue moving the product forward, but at the same time addressing issues and desires of the user base as it fits with resources.
In Christ,
Ken
Lenovo Yoga 7 15ITL5 Touch Screen; 11th Gen Intel i7 2.8Ghz; 12Gb RAM; 500Gb SDD;WIN 11
0 -
Kiyah said:
Faithlife might also consider simplifying the Lectionary homepage layout, there's way too much going on for daily reading. I wouldn't have to customize the homepage layout if it weren't so busy. I noticed you simplified the Passage homepage layout in the last update, you should do the same for the Lectionay homepage layout. My suggestion is to remove the commentary and devotional. I don't use a commentary for daily reading or for simple study, if I need a commentary I'll open one ad hoc, not off the bat. The devotionals are completely unrelated to the readings in the lectionary so I don't need that on the layout. Also, I don't need five bible translations, two would suffice. And put the "cited by" and "explore" tabs side by side in a panel instead of stacking them, there's too much info in both tabs for a half-screen set up (especially on my 14-inch laptop). So that leaves you with the lectionary (and the missal if Catholic), two bibles, and the explore and cited by tabs side by side in the same panel, simple and clean. Just my suggestion, but maybe others have input on how to simply the Lectionary layout.
My 2 cents: I would strongly argue in favor of the commentary (a study Bible for most laity) and for the devotional which for me is a Saints reference that ties directly into the lectionary/liturgical calendar. Are you seeing something different? Why would I argue for the commentary and the saints? Because (a) newbies don't have to learn how to open specific resources immediately if they are already there (b) people are lazy and won't bother to look up what they don't quite understand if it requires remembering the name of the resource to open, opening it, finding the right location ... but they will glance over if it is only a column away.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
0 -
MJ. Smith said:
My 2 cents: I would strongly argue in favor of the commentary (a study Bible for most laity)
Little Rock Catholic Study Bible seemed like a good tie in to remind people of this PrePub.
0 -
MJ. Smith said:
My 2 cents: I would strongly argue in favor of the commentary (a study Bible for most laity) and for the devotional which for me is a Saints reference that ties directly into the lectionary/liturgical calendar. Are you seeing something different? Why would I argue for the commentary and the saints? Because (a) newbies don't have to learn how to open specific resources immediately if they are already there (b) people are lazy and won't bother to look up what they don't quite understand if it requires remembering the name of the resource to open, opening it, finding the right location ... but they will glance over if it is only a column away.
Good point on the saints being tied in with the lectionary. Since a saints resource isn't my top prioritized devotional and since none of the non-saint, non-catholic devotionals in my library are tied to any of the protestant lectionaries, having the devotional open doesn't really help me. But I still think they could have just 2 bibles open (at most 3 like they've done with the Passage layout) instead of 5. I also see your point on the commentary/study bible, I just don't open commentaries that early in my reading process and I get annoyed by having to move or close the commentary so that I can see my Bible in a full vertical panel instead of stacked on top of the commentary that I'm not using. I just think it's such a busy layout for lectionary reading.
0 -
Kiyah said:
I just think it's such a busy layout for lectionary reading.
I've not thought of it as for reading the lectionary per se but for preparing weekday service remarks or answering questions for RCIA/Mystagogia students or . . .
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
0 -
MJ. Smith said:Kiyah said:
I just think it's such a busy layout for lectionary reading.
I've not thought of it as for reading the lectionary per se but for preparing weekday service remarks or answering questions for RCIA/Mystagogia students or . . .
That's fair. But I also know people who use the RCL Daily Readings for Lectio Divina or what ever kind of daily devotional reading they do. As a non-catholic who also isn't preaching each Sunday, I use the lectionaries for (quasi-)daily reading according to the church calendar. It has made me more engaged and disciplined in my reading than trying to do a daily bible reading plan, which I always abandon after a few weeks.
0 -
There is certainly no reason that there can't be more than one lectionary based layout.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
0 -
doc said:
Why did Logos remove this in the first place.
We didn't modify the old home page. Instead, we completely started over from scratch. There wasn't time to implement the feature you are talking about in the new implementation, and the old implementation could not be kept, as it is not compatible with the new homepage. It's still on the list to do, but there have been higher priority issues that have kept us busy.
This was precisely what the connect subscription was intended to avoid, a steady development rather than a rushed release
0 -
Mike Pettit said:
This was precisely what the connect subscription was intended to avoid, a steady development rather than a rushed release
But it's not possible to completely re-write something in six-week intervals. The new home page couldn't (easily) have been built in that way. Six-week blocks are great for incremental improvements. Major releases are great for significant changes. I'm glad there's both, because if Logos only ever had incremental improvements it would fall behind, and if it only had major releases I'd get impatient for change.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
0 -
Mike Pettit said:
This was precisely what the connect subscription was intended to avoid, a steady development rather than a rushed release
Of course, this assumes that L8 was a rushed release which I wholeheartedly disagree with. And honestly, the release notes are a minor issue when you really think about it. It is not as if they are not available, you can get them just like always.
0 -
Things are better with 8.1 but I do think 8 was rushed. it felt more like a beta than a release to me, too many things not functioning properly and consistently, I seriously wanted to downgrade. 8.1 while more stable still feels to me less polished than 7 was.
-dan
0 -
I don’t think L8 was rushed. But it was time-limited. It was the best that could be done in a limited time period. Given that 8.1 is already out, and 8.2 won’t be far behind, I think ”best in the time available“ is OK.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
0 -
Ken Shawver said:
Right.
If you aren't familiar with the software industry that is always true. Development always look at their priority lists for fixes and enhancements. Faithlife, from an outsiders view that understands the industry of software development, does a good job. It is hard as you want to continue moving the product forward, but at the same time addressing issues and desires of the user base as it fits with resources.
^This.
On the basis of several major releases now, Faithlife has figured out that it must deliver major point releases in the late Q3 or early Q4 time frame in order to capitalize on sales. The business must sell packages to generate revenue to build the business. Judging from my purchases this go around, they succeeded. [:P]
This time cycle determines their priorities for release, and there are always challenges that come up. I think they've succeeded in delivering a worthy release to us.
0 -
I fit 7 across my screen but it opened up to 4, I had to manually force go an click on auto to get it to resize from 4 to 7. I'll have to take note next time I restart Logos 8 to see if it is now work correctly. Thanks Reuben.
0 -
Denise said:doc said:
- The old home page was not broken so didn’t require starting from scratch again.
- if you understood your customers you would have known customers expected these to be there when they loaded Logos 8 for the first time,
- The home page is the first impression a user gets of a new Logos release and putting to market a home page that is missing features and uncustomisable is a huge mistake I hope FL never make again.
- You bought off more than you could chew with the notes upgrade the home page should have been left alone.
- Going about things the way FL has with the Logos 8 release has been a message from the company to users that we take our.Customers for granted.
doc, how can you be so naive.
Logosians love cars ... used to be Cadallacs, but now Ferraris. Now, let's say the Italian car designer wanted to put in an engine that would go far faster. Future plans. So, they designed one, but it wasn't quite finished. But they put it in the new model anyway. And promised they'd try to finish it sometime .... priorities, priorities.
See?
Andrew's a good guy. And my old Ferrari 7 still does great at the track.
Not Naive, just don't like a home page that looks like a beta version of Logos 4 Kids. It looks like a sticker page where I can put all the collector cards that come in my cereal box.
I have no personal issue with Andrew or anyone at FL, it is the collective decision to scrap something that was not broken and looked professional to replace it with what we now have and remove a lot of basic functionality in the process and then not have not in a state ready to release to customers but release it to us anyway, not just release but sell it to us. I am sorry but this is treating your customer with disrespect when the CEO of a company signs off on doing this sort of thing and somebody needs to keep FL honest and call them out for unacceptable decisions like this one. Logos 8 home page is the worst home page in the history of this software and its introduction to customers was handled poorly. FL is a much better company capable of much more than what and how they dished it up Logos 8 to customers. And the CEO is nowhere to be seen.
0 -
David Taylor Jr said:
Honestly some people are going to complain no matter what Faithlife does.
… because they keep treating customers with disrespect, don't take your customers for granted, don't sell us beta software that you broke because you decided to redesign something from scratch that was not broken. Those who wanted Logos 4 Kids have now got the Logos 4 Kids home page. They way the design is heading Logos 9 will start rewarding us with 'badges' for completing reading plans, workflows etc.
0 -
Mark Barnes said:
I don’t think L8 was rushed. But it was time-limited. It was the best that could be done in a limited time period. Given that 8.1 is already out, and 8.2 won’t be far behind, I think ”best in the time available“ is OK.
Rushed or time limited it was not ready for release. FL once again bit off more than they could chew and have turned out their worst home page.
0 -
doc said:
because they keep treating customers with disrespect, don't take your customers for granted
That hasn't happened here.
doc said:don't sell us beta software
They didn't.
doc said:Those who wanted Logos 4 Kids have now got the Logos 4 Kids home page.
It amazes me that people are so enraged about the HOME PAGE. I mean really? The Home Page is not why you buy the software. If it is, then I have news for you, you bought the wrong software. It changed, you don't like it, we get it. Move on. Honestly....
0 -
David Taylor Jr said:
Honestly some people are going to complain no matter what Faithlife does.
And there will always be some who think it’s appropriate to respond to others issues in a way that adds no value to the situation.
0 -
These are your opinions Dav and the way you choose to contiue to respond to me online after your offline judgements shows you have no idea to handle dealing with people who disagree with you. May God grow you in this area.
David Taylor Jr said:doc said:because they keep treating customers with disrespect, don't take your customers for granted
That hasn't happened here.
doc said:don't sell us beta software
They didn't.
doc said:Those who wanted Logos 4 Kids have now got the Logos 4 Kids home page.
It amazes me that people are so enraged about the HOME PAGE. I mean really? The Home Page is not why you buy the software. If it is, then I have news for you, you bought the wrong software. It changed, you don't like it, we get it. Move on. Honestly....
0 -
David Taylor Jr said:
It amazes me that people are so enraged about the HOME PAGE. I mean really? The Home Page is not why you buy the software. If it is, then I have news for you, you bought the wrong software. It changed, you don't like it, we get it. Move on. Honestly....
Enraged? What thread are you reading? I haven’t seen anyone enraged just customers wanting to be free to express their feedback free from judgement.
Once again where has anyone said they bought the software for the homepage? You are good at reading things into comments peopl make in order to build up a straw person that you say characterises the people with whom you disagre.
Honestly the home page is the entry point into the software and therefore first impression of it, it is also a launch pad for ongoing tasks a user is working on in the software and used to also be a dashboard where you could have quick to your Logos Account, release notes, recently downloaded resources and for those not comfortable with resource prioritsation they could quickly set their preferred bible. This was also useful for those who liked to switch their preferred bible with ease depending upon the task they were using the software for at the time.
The home page is not a big deal for you, I’m ok with that. Telling other people is shouldn’t be important to them because it’s not important to you. That’s not on David. Maybe I am just a simple man, after all I just had to look up a word in another private message you just sent me because you wanted to say even more judgemental things to me offline. Seems to me you are the one that needs to let go.
0 -
doc said:
Honestly the home page is the entry point into the software and therefore first impression of it,
Yes, you have made this point often. However, NEW customers (who are the only ones getting first impressions) wouldn't see the old homepage so they wouldn't have the bias toward it. New customers wouldn't have the same complaints because they wouldn't know anything else.
Old customers may not like the homepage, personally, I'm not crazy about it but I wasn't crazy about the old one either, spend most of their time in the software itself and not the homepage.
0 -
The thing about old customers is they have invested a lot of money in FL to enable them to be still in business so they could release Logos 8 and reach out to new customers. Both groups of customers need to be considered rather than turning upside existing customers experience of the software overnight and not even having that new interface ready to go to give to the old customers. Just be thankful I haven’t started on notes.
David Taylor Jr said:doc said:Honestly the home page is the entry point into the software and therefore first impression of it,
Yes, you have made this point often. However, NEW customers (who are the only ones getting first impressions) wouldn't see the old homepage so they wouldn't have the bias toward it. New customers wouldn't have the same complaints because they wouldn't know anything else.
Old customers may not like the homepage, personally, I'm not crazy about it but I wasn't crazy about the old one either, spend most of their time in the software itself and not the homepage.
0
