PLEASE BE ADVISED!

Logos is now selling physical ONLY copies of books on its Logos.com website and not only as they should on the sister Lexham site. Do not be tricked into buying as I was!

I ordered this in pre-pub:

https://www.logos.com/product/178116/journeys-of-the-apostle-paul

I did not realize it was ONLY in physical copy. A couple of days later it was on sale for Christmas discounted 33% of what I had paid for it in pre-pub. What a way to treat your Christian customers! Is this the model for a Christian company to take advantage of its clientele?

Now I must return the physical book at my expense and do without the electronic version as they chose not to make it available at this time to FL's loyal customer base.

I feel this was poor marketing on their part, and they should have made it more clear what I was actually getting.

I believe this is almost borderline deception. I think they should limit physical books to their Lexham site and not be able to sell them on Logos.com. Granted if I read the fine print I may have understood this. As I was sick and this is a new approach this is my error.

Thus the posting. Be absolutely careful when you order off Logos.com that they are now selling physical only copies. Make sure which version you are buying. And be careful to watch the sales. IN an electronic format you have 30 days if such a sale would happen to get the reduced price. In a physical copy, ones does not. It reminds me of the Google fiasco I read about with their Pixel 3 launching at exorbitant pricing only to come out shortly on a Black Friday deal as much cheaper.

FL has gone the way fo the world We must be wise as serpents and harmless as doves as we are now dealing with a new business model.

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Comments

MJ. Smith

FL has gone the way fo the world

Hey, I was sympathetic to your cause until I got to this. I never realized that there was a separate site for physical books and think I've always gotten them off Logos.com (like merchandize) and they do list the format as "hardcover" although most buyers likely don't check. But please don't go insulting a company for such small a hassle as returning a book.

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078446#Comment_1078446

I would never scroll down to check format either but would assume from the page that it's an ebook like all the rest. In my shopping cart it becomes clearer and there is a shipping charge but perhaps in the US it's free shipping so you wouldn't notice that either. Is there just the (Hardcover) after the title to warn you?

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078446#Comment_1078446

FL has gone the way fo the world

Hey, I was sympathetic to your cause until I got to this. I never realized that there was a separate site for physical books and think I've always gotten them off Logos.com (like merchandize) and they do list the format as "hardcover" although most buyers likely don't check. But please don't go insulting a company for such small a hassle as returning a book.

Thank you! I appreciate your criticism. I accept it, too! I crossed a line in my frustration clearly. That is why I appreciate this community. I apologize for making a crass judgment.

Just an FYI, all of us need to read very carefully when we make future purchases in Logos. Logos.com has apparently expanded and no longer just sells products for Logos. Be very intentional in your shopping! Read the fine print.

Nor are pre-pubs designed to give one the best price. In this case, it was just the regular price and to assist a person in getting the resource the quickest. Patience can be very prudent.

And all of us need to continue to check our flesh when frustrated! Point taken. My patience was lacking. I should have taken my grief elsewhere first and calmed down before trying to warn others of making the same mistake. God Bless you for standing up!

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078448#Comment_1078448

I would never scroll down to check format either but would assume from the page that it's an ebook like all the rest. In my shopping cart it becomes clearer and there is a shipping charge but perhaps in the US it's free shipping so you wouldn't notice that either. Is there just the (Hardcover) after the title to warn you?

Yeah, I guess one needs to understand "hardcover" means one is purchasing a "hardcover" and not the normal Logos product nor an e-book from the sister site merely dedicated to e-books. It does not mean you get an electronic Logos version of the hardcover, it means you actually get a hardcover. Lexham Press the sister site dedicated to hardcopies, does make it quite clear. One has to manually select either the physical copy or the download version.

I assumed because they sell hardcopies there and because they make it clear there and because when I buy one of FL's e-books, they make it clear, in all cases that this was a Logos product. I was mistaken. I will pay the price. As stated above, that is minimal. What's a few bucks even in my current situation. I was sick and didn't pay attention. Now I will pay attention, or I will be returning more books.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078450#Comment_1078450

It also means that FL can produce physical copies and choose like any other publisher in its business model not to make it into either a Logos product nor an e-book and push a physical-only copy and sell that on its Logos site without an option to get either the Logos product nor the e-book. Whether it ever does become such is entirely up to them. Logos customers are not to expect every Lexham title to be sold in an electronic format.

It also means they can pre-pub items at regular price and two days after landing offer them on sale. That's simply the reality of doing business online in the 21st century regardless of the company. No qualms. Just business.

The point of this post is everyone now needs to be intentional in making certain exactly what one is buying as I myself never knew that I could buy physical books off Logos. I thought I had to go to Lexham Press to do that. I was mistaken and wish to help others learn from my mistakes, so they do not repeat them.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078450#Comment_1078450

Theo, your thread(s) surprised me. Thank you.

Plus, I learned Faithlife sells the NKJV in bonded leather! Ok, I prefer calves or goats. No sheep.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078453#Comment_1078453

Theo, your thread(s) surprised me. Thank you.

How so?

PetahChristian

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078457#Comment_1078457

A while ago, FL added books from their other sites to the Logos store. While this is a convenience that lets us now search in one place, it’s not obvious that this (print) resource is a lexhampress.com title.

Hopefully FL will clarify this on the product page, that Logos customers would not inadvertently purchase a print edition.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078459#Comment_1078459

A while ago, FL added books from their other sites to the Logos store. While this is a convenience that lets us now search in one place, it’s not obvious that this (print) resource is a lexhampress.com title.

Hopefully FL will clarify this on the product page, that Logos customers would not inadvertently purchase a print edition.

Thanks for understanding my plight! I only wish for others not to fail where I have!

David Wanat

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078448#Comment_1078448

I would never scroll down to check format either but would assume from the page that it's an ebook like all the rest. In my shopping cart it becomes clearer and there is a shipping charge but perhaps in the US it's free shipping so you wouldn't notice that either. Is there just the (Hardcover) after the title to warn you?

Assuming I understand it right, it might be wise for FL to put a “Format: XXX” at the top of the page so the buyer knows whether or not it’s digital or physical. Perhaps also allow filtering by digital/physical?

Kevin A

Maybe they can emphasize the shipping costs on the cart also, as another indicator that it is a real book.

Jan Krohn

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078470#Comment_1078470

Why not do it in the same way as FL ebooks? Have the product information on logos.com, but for purchase of the physical book, redirect customers to lexhampress.com.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078478#Comment_1078478

Why not do it in the same way as FL ebooks? Have the product information on logos.com, but for purchase of the physical book, redirect customers to lexhampress.com.

That sounds like a great fix!

DAL

FYI

It’s in the description, but we’re so used to not checking for those details that we just go ahead and preorder. I wonder why you didn’t get a shipping and handling charge warning.

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078448#Comment_1078448

I would never scroll down to check format either but would assume from the page that it's an ebook like all the rest. In my shopping cart it becomes clearer and there is a shipping charge but perhaps in the US it's free shipping so you wouldn't notice that either.

It is not free shipping, but I agree with the sentiment: It is likely that I would not have known this was a print book until it showed up in my mailbox!

DAL

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078504#Comment_1078504

I would never scroll down to check format either but would assume from the page that it's an ebook like all the rest. In my shopping cart it becomes clearer and there is a shipping charge but perhaps in the US it's free shipping so you wouldn't notice that either.

It is not free shipping, but I agree with the sentiment: It is likely that I would not have known this was a print book until it showed up in my mailbox!

That’s what I’m wondering! If the shipping is not free, then why still go through with the order? I tried to order once before, but as soon as I saw shipping charges I went ahead and double checked and cancelled the order; especially when shipping was $14 bucks! Maybe the OP carelessly click next, next and place order without paying attention. When I’m checking out I always pay attention even for the free stuff to make sure the balance remains zero throughout the checking out process.

DAL

Myke Harbuck

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078478#Comment_1078478

Why not do it in the same way as FL ebooks? Have the product information on logos.com, but for purchase of the physical book, redirect customers to lexhampress.com.

Agreed. Or perhaps a banner at the top of the page indicating one is looking at a physical resource, much like they do for the academic discount notification.

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078508#Comment_1078508

When I’m checking out I always pay attention even for the free stuff to make sure the balance remains zero throughout the checking out process.

That is a practice we all should follow, but most of us have not done so in the past. Now, I will pay more attention to the bottom line.

Thank you Theo for bringing this to our attention.

DAL

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078521#Comment_1078521

When I’m checking out I always pay attention even for the free stuff to make sure the balance remains zero throughout the checking out process.

That is a practice we all should follow, but most of us have not done so in the past. Now, I will pay more attention to the bottom line.

Thank you Theo for bringing this to our attention.

Yes, thanks Theo! Now thanks to your bad experience we all can learn to be more careful when we’re ordering online, not just in Logos, but anywhere else 👍😁👌

DAL

mab

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078531#Comment_1078531

I got an email on a book from Lexham, loved the price, clicked to add it to the cart and went to checkout. I looked down at the total and saw there was sales tax. ??? So I backed up and realized I was ordering a physical book, so that ended the sale.

I do think Logos needs to make physical book sales with a more distinctive flag to make it clear that you are ordering a print copy. I don't think it's deception. I think it's a lack of distinction.

I still relish my leather Bible and custom ground nib fountain pens. I can't imagine living in a house without a bookshelf. But I am spoiled rotten by Logos on my computer and tablet.

Kenneth Neighoff

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078559#Comment_1078559

Logos ebooks have sales tax as well.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078560#Comment_1078560

Logos is sending out a return label. They offered to reimburse the difference on the sale if I had wanted to keep the book. They were clear that this was a simple misunderstanding and will have their marketing team look over the whole affair and I even invited them to see the comments here as many of you had good ideas. It was Logos trying their best to make an all in one website and Lexham wanting to put their latest release on sale. Thanks for all your help and support 🙏

mab

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078560#Comment_1078560

Logos ebooks have sales tax as well.

Not everywhere. Yet...

SineNomine

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078585#Comment_1078585

I looked at the product page on a laptop... I can see title, description, price, sale banner, discount, rating, and the add to cart button without scrolling down, but nothing about format until scrolling all the way down to Product Details.

I know FL has sold physical books and other items on the Logos.com website for a number of years, but most people probably haven't noticed, and if I wanted that book, it would almost assuredly have made it into my cart before I would realize to my surprise and annoyance that it's a physical copy.

FL Marketing, please build in a banner or something similar onto the upper part of all Logos.com PDPs that are physical books indicating that they are physical books.

As an aside, I note that the Logos.com search function apparently does not pick up on information found only in Product Details. See this search for "Hardcover", which lacks this book presently under discussion among its results.

Adam Borries (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078585#Comment_1078585

Logos ebooks have sales tax as well.

Not everywhere. Yet...

FYI, the law requires that we charge sales tax in states where we physically have employees.

DAL

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078822#Comment_1078822

Logos ebooks have sales tax as well.

Not everywhere. Yet...

FYI, the law requires that we charge sales tax in states where we physically have employees.

In that case, don’t ever come to Florida, the Promise Land where no taxes are paid on Logos books! 😜

Adam Borries (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078566#Comment_1078566

Logos is sending out a return label. They offered to reimburse the difference on the sale if I had wanted to keep the book. They were clear that this was a simple misunderstanding and will have their marketing team look over the whole affair and I even invited them to see the comments here as many of you had good ideas. It was Logos trying their best to make an all in one website and Lexham wanting to put their latest release on sale. Thanks for all your help and support 🙏

Theo, I'm glad you contacted us so that we could address the issue for you. We makes mistakes sometimes, but if you are unhappy with a purchase for any reason, we'll always do whatever is needed to make it right. Customer service always has been, and always will be, a core part of our culture.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078825#Comment_1078825

Logos is sending out a return label. They offered to reimburse the difference on the sale if I had wanted to keep the book. They were clear that this was a simple misunderstanding and will have their marketing team look over the whole affair and I even invited them to see the comments here as many of you had good ideas. It was Logos trying their best to make an all in one website and Lexham wanting to put their latest release on sale. Thanks for all your help and support 🙏

Theo, I'm glad you contacted us so that we could address the issue for you. We makes mistakes sometimes, but if you are unhappy with a purchase for any reason, we'll always do whatever is needed to make it right. Customer service always has been, and always will be, a core part of our culture.

Yes, but in this case I wanted to make sure that an individual solution was not an immediate fix, so I posted here. By doing so, the community can support me to help me in my errors while offering the above suggestions to help you in yours and together all are equally edified. In the meantime, others can learn and avoid the same mistakes. I think some interesting possible ways to proceed have been offered above to help guide all in a better experience because the community responded.

Dr. Ken

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078823#Comment_1078823

FL in FL? Well... Heiser will soon be there! Lol Will they follow? Lol

DAL

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1078849#Comment_1078849

FL in FL? Well... Heiser will soon be there! Lol Will they follow? Lol

Ha! Heiser no longer works at Faithlife! 😜