Feedback Wanted: Changing Author Display Names
Greetings Logos Users.
We need your feedback on this question: Would you find it valuable to have more consistent author names, even if there are some unwanted short-term side effects?
Over the years we have worked hard to standardize how author names appear in our library and on logos.com.
This works well for Logos Editions where we have the ability to control the metadata. It breaks down for Faithlife Ebooks.
For Faithlife Ebooks we use an automated system that pulls book information directly from publisher data. Because publishers don’t always follow the same conventions we use, this can lead to multiple display names for the same author. This makes searching for products and finding the author you want in your library harder.
We have an improvement ready to go that will solve this problem. Multiple display names for a single author will be a thing of the past. It will also solve the problem where some authors display as “First Last” and others as “Last, First”:
As excited as we are about this improvement, it would have two potentially unwelcomed side effects. And we wanted to give you a heads-up and hear your reaction to them.
1. Sort order in the Details view in the library
Our primary sort order in the details view in the library has been “Last, First”.
This will change.
The new primary sort order in the details view in the library will be “First Last”.
We will probably be able to change this in the future back to “Last, First,” but we didn’t want to hold up shipping these improvements unnecessarily.
In the meantime, you’ll still be able to use the find box or the author facet to filter down and find the author you’re looking for.
2. Collection rules
In this forum thread users have shared some of their collections. In some collections, they assume the author name following a “Last, First” format. There is a potential for some of these collections to be altered. We’ve run some tests internally, and it appears the changes will be minimal but they might occur.
We’re interested in getting your feedback. We’re leaning toward shipping these improvements with these two drawbacks, and addressing them later. But we want to make sure you’re aware and on board. Please let us know what you think. Your input will help us figure out the best way to move forward.
Comments
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If it is the same author, Logos should be able to indicate that. I am very much on board for this. It would eliminate us needing to come up with fancy filters in our collection rules (or inadvertently missing/including works).
Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org0 -
Kyle G. Anderson said:
Would you find it valuable to have more consistent author names, even if there are some unwanted short-term side effects?
Definitely.
Very happy to accept any side effects (e.g. not matching my collection rules) if this can become more consistent.
Thanks.
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Definitely worth a bit of pain to get consistent author names.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Sounds fine to me although I much prefer last, first.
You know what else would be great? Including authors' articles in books and journals in the library (with toggle on and off ability).
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Tom Reynolds said:
You know what else would be great? Including authors' articles in books and journals in the library (with toggle on and off ability).
Yes!!! Authors in journals
...And titles for books within works (and articles within journals with toggle) to be searchable from Library
Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org0 -
Tom Reynolds said:
Sounds fine to me although I much prefer last, first.
Very happy with the concept, although long term would prefer last, first
Thanks for continually tweaking Logos to make it better for users.
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
We have an improvement ready to go that will solve this problem. Multiple display names for a single author will be a thing of the past.
Great!
Kyle G. Anderson said:We’re leaning toward shipping these improvements with these two drawbacks, and addressing them later. But we want to make sure you’re aware and on board. Please let us know what you think.
Go for it!
Have joy in the Lord!
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
We need your feedback on this question: Would you find it valuable to have more consistent author names, even if there are some unwanted short-term side effects?
Yes. (can use author: filter with last name to reduce consolidated list to desired author subset, same as today)
Concur with new feature idea of Library showing author articles (journals & magazines) along with chapters (books).
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
Would you find it valuable to have more consistent author names, even if there are some unwanted short-term side effects?
Generally yes. This has been an annoyance to me for some time although I've never said anything about it. I would appreciate consistency here so long as those "short-term side effects" don't become long-term problems.
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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James Hudson said:Tom Reynolds said:
Sounds fine to me although I much prefer last, first.
Very happy with the concept, although long term would prefer last, first
[Y]
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
The new primary sort order in the details view in the library will be “First Last”.
We will probably be able to change this in the future back to “Last, First,” but we didn’t want to hold up shipping these improvements unnecessarily.
I guess I will be the odd one out. I don't think you should make the change until you can keep it "Last, First." The author's first name is often irrelevant. What if I remember the first letter(s) of the author's last name (which is a frequent occurrence) but not the (irrelevant) first name? Now, I simply scroll through my library looking for author's last name. I won't be able to do that with this change.
I am strongly against this move.
macOS, iOS & iPadOS |Logs| Install
Choose Truth Over Tribe | Become a Joyful Outsider!0 -
JT (alabama24) said:
I am strongly against this move.
Luckily, I'm relaxing on L7. Backwards names is something Logos would do at some point. But be smart enough to (a) not plan ahead, and (b) get a pre-mea-culpa in the pocket. This is where you get the popcorn out.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Request U not ship till Last First.
Like the old traditional phone books.
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JT (alabama24) said:
I guess I will be the odd one out. I don't think you should make the change until you can keep it "Last, First."
I agree.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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I don't think it is a good move, just looking at my bookshelf, I can see half a dozen books where I know the authors surname, because it is always showing on the spine of the book, however I am not certain on the first names, and several authors I only know from their initials + surname.
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
The new primary sort order in the details view in the library will be “First Last”.
We will probably be able to change this in the future back to “Last, First,” but we didn’t want to hold up shipping these improvements unnecessarily.
As much as I will love the consistency in naming, I don't think you should do anything until you can have the Last, First name convention. Having the first name first is just not going to work well for me.
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Kyle G. Anderson said:
The new primary sort order in the details view in the library will be “First Last”.
We will probably be able to change this in the future back to “Last, First,” but we didn’t want to hold up shipping these improvements unnecessarily.
My vote would be to wait till you're really ready with "Last, First."
That also solves the problem with Collection rules.
Thank you for asking!
Grace & Peace,
Bill
MSI GF63 8RD, I-7 8850H, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, NVIDIA GTX 1050Max
iPhone 12 Pro Max 512Gb
iPad 9th Gen iOS 15.6, 256GB0 -
BillS said:
My vote would be to wait till you're really ready with "Last, First."
Why is it called "first name" if everyone wants it last, and last name first... [^o)] [:D]
No, I'm just kidding... Please do wait until you're ready with "Last, First".
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Randy W. Sims said:James Hudson said:Tom Reynolds said:
Sounds fine to me although I much prefer last, first.
Very happy with the concept, although long term would prefer last, first
After following along and reconsidering, I'd like to change my vote to No. Respectfully, Faithlife does have an unfortunate tendency to not finish what they start and I'd hate for that to happen here and leave it in intermediate state for ages. Please wait until it can be completed before rolling out the change.
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Randy W. Sims said:
Faithlife does have an unfortunate tendency to not finish what they star
Finish it before releasing it. Randy is correct, and this is my biggest irritation with FL. We already have far too many half-done features. Please do not add another.
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Definitely, finish it before releasing.
What you haven't indicated clearly is:
- whether the Sidebar Filter is first,last or last,first
- impact for the author: search field, which is flexible about order and completeness e.g. author:"T. Alexander" or author:"Alexander, T" for Alexander, T. Desmond
- impact for strict {Author} extension syntax e.g. must be {Author "Alexander, T. Desmond"}
- this syntax is also used for results in the Sidebar Filter.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Well, I would ABSOLUTELY want it changed, to be consistent. I have software that lists all the books that I have (Logos, Kindle, epub, hardback, etc.). Then I can do a quick search to see if I have already bought that book in some form. When the names are inconsistent, it could lead to my repurchasing a book I already have in my library. So, yes, please make it consistent!
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Charlene said:
Well, I would ABSOLUTELY want it changed, to be consistent.
I don't think anyone here is arguing that it shouldn't be changed... To the contrary, I would guess that most of us think it is long overdue. The only question is should the change be made BEFORE the "last name, first name" issue can be resolved. For me, the answer is a resounding "no." To do otherwise would make the medicine worse than the disease.
macOS, iOS & iPadOS |Logs| Install
Choose Truth Over Tribe | Become a Joyful Outsider!0 -
JT (alabama24) said:
I don't think anyone here is arguing that it shouldn't be changed... To the contrary, I would guess that most of us think it is long overdue. The only question is should the change be made BEFORE the "last name, first name" issue can be resolved. For me, the answer is a resounding "no." To do otherwise would make the medicine worse than the disease.
Agreed.
I have my Personal Books word files in folders on my PC on First Last ordering and a couple of times I have messed up because of it. Just don't ask WHY I have them that way and don't change them!!!0 -
JT (alabama24) said:
To do otherwise would make the medicine worse than the disease.
I'm likely completely off-base (as usual), but the software change seems like an multi-locational undertaking (risk-prone). Sitting on the downhill side of a major update, while battling Corona doesn't seem like an easy to-do.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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JT (alabama24) said:Kyle G. Anderson said:
The new primary sort order in the details view in the library will be “First Last”.
We will probably be able to change this in the future back to “Last, First,” but we didn’t want to hold up shipping these improvements unnecessarily.
I guess I will be the odd one out. I don't think you should make the change until you can keep it "Last, First." The author's first name is often irrelevant. What if I remember the first letter(s) of the author's last name (which is a frequent occurrence) but not the (irrelevant) first name? Now, I simply scroll through my library looking for author's last name. I won't be able to do that with this change.
I am strongly against this move.
Agree with JT 1000%. I'd rather deal with the inconsistency now and wait unit you can ship with Last, First, even if that meant waiting another year. A First, Last sort order wouldn't be very helpful and, IMHO, would be more of a nuisance than anything.
Myke Harbuck
Lead Pastor, www.ByronCity.Church
Adjunct Professor, Georgia Military College0 -
JT (alabama24) said:
To do otherwise would make the medicine worse than the disease.
This is what I was trying to say in my reply, but didnt say it near this well!
Myke Harbuck
Lead Pastor, www.ByronCity.Church
Adjunct Professor, Georgia Military College0 -
Denise said:
I'm likely completely off-base (as usual),
But we love you anyways. [:)]
My personal trainer took his honeymoon in your neck of the woods. When he told me where he had gone and showed me the pictures, I thought of you. [:)]
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JT (alabama24) said:
My personal trainer took his honeymoon in your neck of the woods. When he told me where he had gone and showed me the pictures, I thought of you.
Well, I sure hope they had a great time! And a nice future.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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