Another Windows Experience Rating Question

My Windows Epxperience rating is nearly identical to some mentioned in a previous post, but since I loaded 4.0b SR2 and imported my old notes to L4, Logos is SLOW. I noticed that layouts that have books with notes can take several minutes to load, while layouts with books that have no notes, load almost instantly. Has anyone experienced this slow down since importing old notes?

Here is my Windows Experience Rating:

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John Norman

Yep... Who would have guessed the 4 in Logos 4 refered to the lowest Windows Experience Base Score needed for all features to work... [:)]

Kevin Becker

The more user content in Logos (Notes primarily) the slower Logos runs. You might try right clicking on a Visual Filter title and click 'Do not show in any resources." Do this for each note file. Logos placing the colored box linking the book to your notes is probably consuming a lot of processor time and memory. Leaving Note files Visual Filters off will hopefully help to ease the burden on your computer.

Michael Birney

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123580#Comment_123580

And possibly upgrade your video card (unless you have a laptop). Then you would have a 5.4. Then a new faster hard drive, and you are up to 6.1. Did I mention this all might cost 400 or 500? Maybe go with Kevin's idea first.

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123580#Comment_123580

You might try right clicking on a Visual Filter title and click 'Do not show in any resources."

It took me a while to find this. I would have thought it more obvious where you implied it to be ie. the VF/Note title in the File menu!

JimTowler

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123580#Comment_123580

The more user content in Logos (Notes primarily) the slower Logos runs.

At face value, this makes complete sense. After every open/move within a resource to a new location, it seems clear the application needs to process all our user-content. For each highlighting, search-hit, markers or whatever, it needs to evaluate if there is a hit, and process whatever it means.

I'd guess that whatever works fine for 10 test items, won't scale well for 100+, once we have lots of notes and filters etc.

This is one where I trust the Logos programmers to figure out ways; maybe to extract the matching portions out from our content, into some kind of indexed list, and then just process that condensed list, rather than every raw user-file. If so, the graphical rendering may well be the most demanding part of the operation.

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123592#Comment_123592

It took me a while to find this. I would have thought it more obvious where you implied it to be ie. the VF/Note title in the File menu!

Dave, you're right, I could have been more clear. It was obvious to me [:S]. Here's a picture to help the OP if he hasn't found it yet:

Mark

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123721#Comment_123721

Ok, I'm not sure where to put this post. I am non-techy and just recently got help from a couple of you guys.

I have 4 in both mac and windows - running parallels. I just took someone's clue and ran grandperspective scan and it showed almost half of my HD taken up with Parallels and Windows. I keep 4 in Mac, just hoping against hopes it will get up to speed soon and I can dump the Parallels. But, I guess I'm wondering if there are hints there to optimize the parallels experience and whether slowness is just part of that experience.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123732#Comment_123732

I've not read anything in particular regarding optimizing for parallels.

Jarred Edgecombe

Here is my whole problem with this slow-down. It didn't happen until I imported my old notes. Now just scrolling through parallel resources is aggravatingly slow. If I understand what you are telling me, it is the sheer number of notes that is slowing these pages down.

Michael: I have a laptop (Dell, 5 mos old) that I bought specifically to run L4. How about the irony in that?

Thanks for the help.

Mike

Hey Jarred,

Logos 4 is, graphically, much more resource intensive than Logos 3 ever was. Now that we're using the Microsoft .NET Framework and WPF, we're able to make everything look much cleaner, smoother and interactive. The downside of this, is that we require a much heftier video card to render all those layers.

Turning off the visual filters should help a little. Another thing that might help is turning off the Windows Aero theme. You can do that by right-clicking your desktop and choosing Customize. You can also set Logos 4 to do it for you whenever it is open, by right-clicking the Logos 4 icon, going to Properties, and checking the "Disable desktop composition" box in the Compatibility tab.

Beyond that, you'd probably want to close out of other applications, or look in to an upgrade to your video card, as recommended by others here. I would recommend an nVidia GeForce card, and/or anything with 1GB of dedicated video memory.

I hope that helps.

Ron

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123836#Comment_123836

Beyond that, you'd probably want to close out of other applications, or look in to an upgrade to your video card, as recommended by others here. I would recommend an nVidia GeForce card, and/or anything with 1GB of dedicated video memory.

Hi Mike, I've asked this a few other times, but we've never gotten an official answer from Logos regarding some specificity as to how important the video card is and where the point of diminishing returns lies. In my situation, I have a Core 2 Duo 3GHz, 8GB DDR2 RAM, Intel SSD, and a 4-year-old GeForce 7600GT with 256MB (which still rates 5.6 for Aero in the Experience Index). Would I see more of a benefit by upgrading my video card (to say an ATI 5770 w/1GB) than I would upgrading to a Core 2 Quad? By and large, my Logos 4 experience is very good performance-wise...the biggest areas that I'd like to see it snappier are fully populating a PG (25-45 seconds depending on size of passage) and "close all" which "feels" slow (though it probably takes less than 10 seconds).

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123844#Comment_123844

Hi Mike, I've asked this a few other times, but we've never gotten an official answer from Logos regarding some specificity as to how important the video card is and where the point of diminishing returns lies. In my situation, I have a Core 2 Duo 3GHz, 8GB DDR2 RAM, Intel SSD, and a 4-year-old GeForce 7600GT with 256MB (which still rates 5.6 for Aero in the Experience Index). Would I see more of a benefit by upgrading my video card (to say an ATI 5770 w/1GB) than I would upgrading to a Core 2 Quad? By and large, my Logos 4 experience is very good performance-wise...the biggest areas that I'd like to see it snappier are fully populating a PG (25-45 seconds depending on size of passage) and "close all" which "feels" slow (though it probably takes less than 10 seconds).

Hey Ron,

I would definitely upgrade the video card to minimum of 512MB Dedicated video RAM, but I really recommend going to 1GB if possible. It's really pretty cheap these days. I buy my hardware from www.newegg.com and their prices aren't bad at all, plus the customer reviews make selecting the right hardware quick and easy.

My personal preference is always toward nVidia over ATI, but that has more to do with experience and the simplicity of nVidia's driver update system. I always use an nVidia card at home.

I'm right with you on the delayed response with "Close All" and loading a full layout. I've been thinking about upgrading my video card at home (GeForce 8600GT 512MB) toward improving that. We're also hoping to see some perfomance increase once we're able to switch overfrom .NET 3.5 Sp1 to .NET 4.0.

Ron

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123857#Comment_123857

Hey Ron,

I would definitely upgrade the video card to minimum of 512MB Dedicated video RAM, but I really recommend going to 1GB if possible. It's really pretty cheap these days. I buy my hardware from www.newegg.com and their prices aren't bad at all, plus the customer reviews make selecting the right hardware quick and easy.

My personal preference is always toward nVidia over ATI, but that has more to do with experience and the simplicity of nVidia's driver update system. I always use an nVidia card at home.

I'm right with you on the delayed response with "Close All" and loading a full layout. I've been thinking about upgrading my video card at home (GeForce 8600GT 512MB) toward improving that. We're also hoping to see some perfomance increase once we're able to switch overfrom .NET 3.5 Sp1 to .NET 4.0.

Fantastic, thanks for the straight forward answer Mike. That's exactly the kind of information I was looking for...especially since you have a card that is similar to mine, but 1 generation newer and still feel that it would be worthwhile to upgrade.

I buy from NewEgg all the time, so am very familiar with them...I have just been going back and forth for the last few months as to whether it would be worthwhile to upgrade my video card (it is by far the oldest component in the system) vs doing a processor swap for a Core 2 Quad. I can upgrade to i7 for about twice what it would cost to drop in a Core 2 Quad, but at this point I'm thinking that I'll make due and see what Sandy Bridge brings...especially since by and large I'm not hurting from a performance standpoint at the moment.

Regarding ATI vs nVidia, I've used nVidia exclusively for a long time as well for similar reasons...I had some poor experiences with ATI drivers (though it has been a number of years ago now). The only reason I'm considering ATI is because if I'm going to upgrade the video card, I'm thinking I might as well go with a DX11 card...and the only one nVidia offers at the moment is their stratospherically priced top-of-the-line model.

I'm not sure if you are one of the programmers, but one other question if you don't mind (and if you know the answer)...does Logos take any advantage of the WDDM 1.1 features that are available with a DX10.1 or higher card? That has been another question on my mind since the 7600GT is DX10 and therefore (from my understanding) doesn't take full advantage of the new features offered by WDDM 1.1

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123883#Comment_123883

I'm not sure if you are one of the programmers, but one other question if you don't mind (and if you know the answer)...does Logos take any advantage of the WDDM 1.1 features that are available with a DX10.1 or higher card? That has been another question on my mind since the 7600GT is DX10 and therefore (from my understanding) doesn't take full advantage of the new features offered by WDDM 1.1

I'm in the Tech Support Department, so not a Developer by any means. I know we do take advantage of DirectX 10, but I don't know if we see any significant improvement on DX11 cards. I haven't seen it run on any yet.

Ron

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123890#Comment_123890

I'm in the Tech Support Department, so not a Developer by any means. I know we do take advantage of DirectX 10, but I don't know if we see any significant improvement on DX11 cards. I haven't seen it run on any yet.

Good deal...thanks again [:)]

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/123732#Comment_123732

I'm wondering if there are hints there to optimize the parallels experience and whether slowness is just part of that experience.

See this item by John Fidel in the Wiki Parallels