Update Suggestion

How about listing what each update you send has done... i.e. FIXED a BUG - ADDED a Feature - Increased PERFORMANCE.. This can be added easily to the Home Page in Logos 4.

I really don't like seesing a lot of updates to the program without an explanation. Not that I don't appreceiate you care in keeping my program updated. but I'm not seeing very many new features or promised features being added.

This tends to make me think these are performance and bug fixes. I do appreciate this also but when paying two grand for a program one does not like to think he is simply testing a Beta Two Program.. I almost am begining to fill that once everything is finally added and all yours bugs are fixed - your going to release the new and improved Logos 5!

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Robert Pavich

Fred,

Not sure if you are aware, but every release comes with "release notes" posted to the forum and the Logos wiki.

Here is an example of RC-2 that was posted on the Logos 4 forum (not the beta forum)

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/16743.aspx

And here is the text of the notes:

Logos 4.0c RC 2

Logos 4.0c RC 2 (v4.03.3.9443) was released on Friday, May 7, 2010.

Bug Fixes

Added fields from BDAG and (most) fields from LGNTI to Basic
Search drop-down.
Fixed bug causing all spaces to be stripped out when pasting text
from the BHS to Notes.
Fixed bug causing Hebrew text to display left-to-right when notes
were attached.
Fixed bug that caused Passage List “Add ... a file” to fail if
the text file was open in Word.
Fixed bug preventing highlighting style names from appearing in
the Search Analysis view.
Fixed bug that could cause an InvalidOperationException during
synchronization (http://community.logos.com/forums/t/16498.aspx).
Fixed crash caused by synchronizing resource priority in the
background.
Fixed crash when choosing “Morph Search” from Clause Visualizer
context menu.
Fixed crash when choosing multiple suffix morph codes (in
Westminster morph) in Morph Search.
Fixed crash when exporting certain images from resources.
Fixed crash when navigating to a new verse in Clause Visualizer
resources (http://community.logos.com/forums/t/16581.aspx).
Fixed crash when creating a new document from the command box.
Fixed crash and/or incorrect hyperlink placement when pasting
text that includes pointed Hebrew characters into notes.

Known Issues

For Help:
- Updated Help for 4.0c is not yet available for download. An
  update will follow later.
For Rich Text:
- Paste option on Hyperlink box context menu is grayed out after
  copy function. Workaround: Ctrl+V.
For Self Tests:
- The LDLS3 version of M2120SW.lbxlls (from 2005) needs to be
  replaced by an updated version. Otherwise, opening Exam 4 will cause
  Logos 4 to crash.
- The courses in the self tests tool are
  collapsible, but the settings are not saved in RC 2.

Dave Hooton

I really don't like seesing a lot of updates to the program without an explanation. Not that I don't appreceiate you care in keeping my program updated. but I'm not seeing very many new features or promised features being added.

This tends to make me think these are performance and bug fixes.

I appreciate your point. The link to release notes for 4.0c RC1 and RC2 in the Logos4 Forum do not tell you what features were added earlier in the beta of 4.0c - you need to have appreciated http://community.logos.com/forums/t/16573.aspx, which was posted by a beta user! The wiki contains the history of features & bugs of earlier beta versions but that is insufficient for advising/advertising a potential new release.

Logos do need to improve their advertising for a potential new release.

Wesley Crouch

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126832#Comment_126832

Not sure if you are aware, but every release comes with "release notes" posted to the forum and the Logos wiki.

Yes it is very true those release notes are shown in the Logos wiki and it is very true that a wonderful job is done showing them there however, there are some who don't have internet all the time. Some who are just unable to look up the forum or the wiki every time. Some who have to take their laptops to a friends house to download updates, or go to public libraries or wherever they can plug in quickly and take their updates home with them.

Some also have dial-up at home like myself so "surfing the net" is like riding a snales back across town! [:)]

Fred J. Morgan

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126832#Comment_126832

This is very worrysome. As stated elsewhere I appreciate all the BUG fixes, but this is more like a BETA program being fixed... When spending 2 grand I really expected the updates to be new and promissed features and not just FIXES.... I didn't know I was buying a Buggy program....

I am very worried that when all the bugs are finally removed that I may be treated like a Microsoft customer..... Fix the program then offer an upgrade to say....LOGO 5?

I Bought Windows XP when bugs were fixed they took the program and upgraded the graphic interface and changed the name to VISTA when you bought it they again upgraded the DESKTOP to a faster interface and charged to upgrade to Wiindows 7... I'm tired of buying programs with Bugs..working with them as a kind of unpaid tester then being charged to upgrade to get a working version with all the features I expected in the first. I pray this is not Logos' Plan..

Fred

Fred J. Morgan

Yes.. Thanbks for the link.. BUT WHY NOT LIST THESE ON THE HOME START PAGE... Claimed to be like a magazine to keep us updated with info.. why not use it as such without customers looking up this information... ALSO WHERE ARE THE UPGADE FEATURES PROMISED.... WHAT IS THE PROGRESS STATUS... WHAT IS THE ETA>>> SOME info please... Again on the START HOMEPAGE...

ATTENTION..I am not a BLOGGER..so Capital letters are not yelling.. I do not Yell.. they are for inflection in tone. I am never angry just concerned....

AWAITTING MY PBBs and Preacher File

I don't even know If ANY FEATURES were added from Ver4 to Ver4 RC2??? WHERE THERE ANY? Is there a hidden link I have not found to this page... Maybe PBBs have been added.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126901#Comment_126901

Yes.. Thanbks for the link.. BUT WHY NOT LIST THESE ON THE HOME START PAGE... Claimed to be like a magazine to keep us updated with info.. why not use it as such without customers looking up this information... ALSO WHERE ARE THE UPGADE FEATURES PROMISED.... WHAT IS THE PROGRESS STATUS... WHAT IS THE ETA>>> SOME info please... Again on the START HOMEPAGE...

ATTENTION..I am not a BLOGGER..so Capital letters are not yelling.. I do not Yell.. they are for inflection in tone. I am never angry just concerned....

AWAITTING MY PBBs and Preacher File

I don't even know If ANY FEATURES were added from Ver4 to Ver4 RC2??? WHERE THERE ANY? Is there a hidden link I have not found to this page... Maybe PBBs have been added.

Forum conventions treat capitals as the inflection of yelling - emoticons are used for other inflections. Sorry you are unaware of the conventions - it means you get misunderstood. Features that have been added in 4.0a, b or c:

importing of Notes along with several enhancements of Notes
Visual Filters
Passage List
Highlighting & importing of L3 highlighting style
speed search
additional commentary sections in Passage Guide
full-page interlinear

That's not a complete list. Note some of the items were done because of user pressure - trumping some of Logos' original prioritization. If you do your homework in terms of what users are pushing for on the forums and user voice and watch what features generate questions on the forums, it is clear that Logos is both making progress and listening to users. It is necessary for users to listen in return.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126900#Comment_126900

This is very worrysome. As stated elsewhere I appreciate all the BUG fixes, but this is more like a BETA program being fixed..

To be fair, the bug fixes will continue to increase as the beta testers become more familiar with how to test the product. In addition, the adding of new features also make apparent errors that were invisible prior to the new feature. If there are not a number of bug fixes, beta testers aren't doing their job. However, regression bugs I'll lay directly at the program development team - I suspect the usual management shortcuts on testing software and protocols. Perhaps, a Logos employee will tell me I'm wrong.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126908#Comment_126908

Forum conventions treat capitals as the inflection of yelling - emoticons are used for other inflections. Sorry you are unaware of the conventions - it means you get misunderstood. Features that have been added in 4.0a, b or c:

Also, this forum software allows you to use formatting (bold or italic) for emphasis. Capital letters are have become widely understood as yelling in the online world, not just on blogs. The intent may be harmless, but it can rile people up, so it's best to avoid it except in acronyms or titles/headings and the like. Something meant to draw attention, such as NOTE: or CAUTION: before a line of text should be fine as well. Nobody is expected to know this as a newbie, but usually there are a few generous souls in cyberspace who will educate the uninitiated, and it all works out harmoniously. (I wonder if anyone nowadays ever gets away with actually using capital letters to yell when that's what they inteneded to do, without being gently reminded that it means yelling by someone who thinks they are doing it unknowingly. [:)]) Pity the poor souls whose Caps Lock key is stuck. I've seen that happen to folks before, and they are constantly having to apologize and getting chided. Oh, online communities can be such a challenge sometimes...

Fred J. Morgan

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126909#Comment_126909

I believe this does make since. The more changes added the more chance of Bugs...

Yes Beta tester are needed throughout program development were new features are promised and the Program is STILL in development.. But When I bought this I was told LOGOs 4 was ready - NOT a Beta development program.

As you stated "too be fair... any other program you bought which is sold to you as a running program - I do not believe you would exspect yourself as buying a Beta Version UNLESS stated. I do know programs constantly fix problems and even add features. My Photoshop did have one update to fix a problem with "New Printers" for compatability, but I never got 4 or 5 updaes to fix bugs.... I believe a natural response would be to get a little upset. Don't get me wrong- I did understand that all features were not yet available in LOGOS 4 but I thought it had been throughly Beta tested.

It seems it may have been a bit rushed. Most programs are pre Beta tested BEFORE release. Also I don't see new feature to justify these bugs. This is the main point of this inquiry. I seem to constantly being updated with bug fixes (this ias what happens when Beta Testing a program) and getting no Features added-at least non which have been reported. The problem is ""IM Not a Beta Tester... I bought a New Program. When I purched Logos 3 (Libronix) the Engine was pretty much complete and running and most updated were to add features and Add-in as I recall (I could be wrong).

I have asked several times What features which were promised to be added in fact have been added and if know what is the ETA of these features.

As of this time I have not heard. Maybe someone at Logos will be so kind as to update me and other by placing a "Status Report" on the Logos 4 Startup Homepage for all to read. This will keep us informed at least of what the Updates we receive are for and What features they have added and also when to expect new features such as PBBs and what progress is being made on these features?. Most do not like Forum and searches. And this IS to my previous understanding the reason for the "Newspapeer stiyle of the Startup Homepage.

AT ANY RATE I STILL LOVE MY PROGRAM... I just fill a little in the dark and would rather know what was going on without Forum blogging to find out.

Thank everyone for patience with my venting. I love you all in the name of our savior and may God Bless

I''ll get back to this blog in a few days.. still in VA hospital.

In Christ

Fred

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126946#Comment_126946

Fred,

Since we're instructing one another. Please take this little correction as a help, not a hurt. [:)]

This is a Forum; which is a collection of individuals posting messages and responses in individual threads.

A Blog is short for a "web log" which is usually one author (or a select few authors) posting individualized commentary or articles based upon a given theme.

The distinction between the two can be vague at times, but I thought you might appreciate knowing.

Grace to you,

Tom

Mike Childs

After all has been said on this topic, the point remains that it would be nice to be better informed about the content of the updates. Doing it on the homepage is a great suggestion. One shouldn't have to go hunting for this information, nor should it be left to beta testers to give such information.

Really, this is not so hard to do. Is it? It would seem the more professional way of doing things.

That said, THANKS LOGOS!! (I intended to yell.) YOU ARE DOING A GREAT JOB AND THIS IS A GREAT PROGRAM!

I personally appreciate all the bug fixes and updates. There is a lot of hard work going into making this the best Bible study / theological study program in the history of the world.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126977#Comment_126977

Michael,

Thanks for bringing us back on topic. YES ([;)]) I agree that the update information should be pushed to the home page or a popup. Even if it's only just a link to the wiki page.

Todd Phillips

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126977#Comment_126977

After all has been said on this topic,
the point remains that it would be nice to be better informed about the
content of the updates. Doing it on the homepage is a great suggestion.
One shouldn't have to go hunting for this information, nor should it
be left to beta testers to give such information.

I agree
that the home page would be a good place for release notes. However
there is no need to go hunting. They are posted on the wiki here:

http://wiki.logos.com/Logos_4_Release_Notes

For non-beta users, check out the entries marked "Gold". Those have all the new features for each official release listed. The other entries are incremental beta release change lists which don't have enough info for the non-beta user to understand without reading all the previous ones.

Rob Stanley

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/126977#Comment_126977

Doing it on the homepage is a great suggestion. One shouldn't have to go hunting for this information, nor should it be left to beta testers to give such information. Really, this is not so hard to do. Is it? It would seem the more professional way of doing things. That said, THANKS LOGOS!! (I intended to yell.) YOU ARE DOING A GREAT JOB AND THIS IS A GREAT PROGRAM! I personally appreciate all the bug fixes and updates. There is a lot of hard work going into making this the best Bible study / theological study program in the history of the world.

Well put Michael. Greater access to the greatest word! [;)]