Significant Omissions in LDHB tagging of Reported Speech
I've been doing some work on Exodus and noticed a few points in the LDHB where the tagging of Reported Speech was missing. I've tried reporting this to data.discourse.ot@logos.com as indicated in the dataset documentation, but the email has bounced as undeliverable.
This morning I've done a very quick run through Genesis to Deuteronomy and I've spotted a whole lot more Reported Speech tagging issues. This suggests that the problem is more widespread in the database. This is particularly disappointing as the use of INTERSECTS or NOT INTERSECTS searches with Reported Speech are potentially really helpful in lots of ways. Here are the points I've spotted problems, though I may have missed some:
Genesis
8:16-17, 21c-22 (SENTENCE indentation incorrect at 8:22)
22:14bc (?)
22:20b-21
25:22c
26:32d
28:13c-15, 16bc, 17cde, 20b-22
38:24bc
40:8bcef, 12b-15, 16d-17
48:20bcd, 21b-22
Exodus
3:6b
5:14c
17:7d
25:2-30:10
32:29bcd
Leviticus
22:4-9
Numbers
32:6b-15, 16c-19
Deuteronomy
The tagging is missing through most of Deuteronomy except for some passages in chapters 31 & 33. Chapter 34 is OK.
As far as I can see, the indentation of the outline SENTENCE level is correct for Reported Speech in the vast majority of these cases.
In view of the email failure, does anyone know how I can contact the relevant people at Logos who can fix these issues?
Comments
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Hi John,
I'll make sure this error report gets to the right people, and report back here once I find out more.
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Thanks, Mark!
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I normally have Speaker labels turned off, but on a quick review of the passages I've listed, I see that there is also an inconsistency in whether or not they have Speaker labels. For instance, compare Gen 8:16 (no Speaker label) with Gen 26:32d (Speaker label).
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I make no claims for exhaustive accuracy, but a further speed read through Joshua to Ruth reveals issues with Reported Speech at:
Joshua
3:9ab
Judges
4:8bc, 9bcd
6:29e
11:30bc
13:6c-7
14:18d
Ruth
1:15bc
2:2d0 -
Thank you for reporting these instances. I will look through them and make updates to the Reported Speech data.
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Thanks Jimmy for doing this research. This is a great resource.
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Jimmy,
Is the LDHB Reported Speech tagging likely to be fixed soon? At present I can't trust search results for this feature.
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John Kendall said:
I make no claims for exhaustive accuracy, but a further speed read through Joshua to Ruth reveals issues with Reported Speech at:
You are checking the Hebrew not the English, right? It is the Hebrew that is tagged. Unfortunately, I don't read Hebrew so I can't tell if it is direct speech in Hebrew.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Well, it was 10 months ago, but as far as I recall, I was working with the LDHB Hebrew text. My Hebrew is a bit rusty but it's passable in narrative. Anyway, Hebrew quotative frames are not difficult to spot.
However, I've just realised that my comments on Deuteronomy, at least, are partially mistaken. I had not appreciated that a Bible search for LDHB:"Reported Speech" would not pick up "Reported Speech (Level 2)" or "Reported Speech (Level 3)".
Sometime over the next few days, I'll review the passages I noted above and I'll report back.
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As promised, I've now rechecked the LDBH Hebrew text and spotted a few typos in my lists above:
- for Lev 22:4-9 read Lev 24:2-9
- for Jos 3:9ab read Jos 3:9bc
- for Jdg 11:30bc read Jdg 11:30b-31
Otherwise my observations still stand for the most recently updated LDHB.
Regarding Deuteronomy, though I've not checked their accuracy, Reported Speech Levels 2 and 3 seem to be marked up at points throughout the book. However, the Reported Speech markup is missing for Moses' three major discourses within which the speeches at levels 2 and 3 are embedded. I can't guarantee that I've spotted everything, but note the lack of Reported Speech markup at the following points:
- the beginning of Deut 1:6 and end of 4:40;
- the beginning of 5:1c and end of 26:19;
- 27:1b-8, 9b-10;
- the beginning of 27:12 and end of 28:68;
- the beginning of 29:1c (Heb) and end of 30:20
- 31:2b-6
- 31:10b-13
- the beginning of 32:1 and end of 32:43
- 32:46-47
- 32:49-52
- 33:2b-5
- the words to Reuben in 33:6 should be marked as Unframed Reported Speech
- 33:7b-e, 12b-d, 13b-17, 18b-19, 20b-21, 23bc
- the words to Asher that begin at 24b should end at 25b
- 26-29 clearly resumes 32:2b-5 and so the beginning of 26 should be marked as Unframed Reported Speech
I may have missed other omissions, but many of of these occur at structurally significant points in the book and really shouldn't be missing.
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