Matt Bennett said:

Some of you have noticed recently an influx of titles on the Logos platform that aren’t related to Bible study. One of our company priorities is bringing you new books faster so Logos can be your one-stop shop for ebooks of all kinds. We’ve gotten feedback in the past that users want to consolidate all their ebooks in Logos, but we have a ways to go before we can serve users in this way. 

However, as many of you have noted, a difficulty in broadening the content available on logos.com is that we rely on publishers to provide relevant, helpful content that doesn’t violate our standards of containing erotic/graphic language or inciting violence. (You can read our entire distribution philosophy here.) Many Bible-focused, respected publishers add books to the Logos platform using an automated feed. Some of these publishers have imprints that publish books which sometimes violate our standards—and these imprints also send books to the Logos platform using the automated feed. We’ve always used BISAC codes to filter out as many of these books as we can and we take down individual titles as we find them. 

However, we’re currently working to tighten these controls so the Logos platform is always a safe place for going deeper in the Bible. A few things that means going forward:

• We have turned off the automatic feed for publishers and publishing imprints with multiple titles that violate our distribution philosophy. This means that titles from these publishers will be reviewed to ensure nothing erotic/graphic or violent makes it to our website.

• Our team will review titles flagged by users like you within one business day. If a title violates our standards against erotic, graphic, or violent language, we will remove it ASAP. You can send questionable titles to titlereview@logos.com to be reviewed by someone at Logos.

We apologize for the few resources that have bypassed our filtering system in the past. Thank you to those who have brought them to our attention so we could immediately remove them, and thank you for continuing to trust Logos to help you go deeper in your study of Scripture.

 

Sounds very positive. I'm one of those who loves to have all my Christian books in one place, although I'm less worried by having "secular" ebooks in Logos. In addition to your comments, it would be great if publishers didn't apparently overlook Logos when it comes to ebook sales of resources in the Faithlife ebooks store. If you follow the Faithlife ebooks forum, you'll see many overlooked sales.

Thank you for taking these steps. One thing I look to Logos for is a curated catalogue of works that can advance my study of God's word. For me, personally, Logos would be less useful and appealing to me if it turned into another Amazon.

Appreciate the openness and the steps you are taking, Matt!

"We apologize for the few resources that have bypassed our filtering system in the past."

1. Unfortunately, from what I've read, the offending resources can hardly be classified as "few," at least in number if not percentage.

2. Your "policy" regarding content is meaningless unless it is effective.

3. Your (LOGOS) failure to respond to a subscriber's concern regarding this matter for close to one month has caused this matter to snowball into something that has resulted in a very visible stain on the reputation of Logos/Faithlife.

4. Trust has to earned, and this matter has damaged the trust. You need to do much better before that trust can be returned.

5. Thank you for finally responding in a positive way to this. I would still expect an effort to examine why this was not discovered sooner, and why Logos did not respond in a more timely way when this matter was first reported.

The Protestia article was very damaging, where complaints was disregarded. I asked myself what I should do hereafter. I am not fully sure yet.

Sam Shelton said:

EastTN said:

Thank you for taking these steps. One thing I look to Logos for is a curated catalogue of works that can advance my study of God's word. For me, personally, Logos would be less useful and appealing to me if it turned into another Amazon.

I agree with this statement by EastTN.

I for one have no desire to read one of my cookbooks (for example) within the Logos platform ...

First, cookbooks (example) are much better in an cooking app. 

But what exactly is the issue here (not questioning violence, erotica/graphic).

 - If you don't buy cookbooks they won't be in your library.  No 'Jane's Hunky Cowboy' either.  Seems to me, the issue is Logos.com (specifically) including a lot of junk (cookbooks, novels, etc).  There's no easy way to have user-managed filters (the carot menu is a pain). Shopping is currently painful, and I avoid it.

- If you DO buy cookbooks, novels etc, it's a pain managing them, relative to religious use. Everytime a search, you have to do this or that. Versus separate libraries. If you have kids, you can't give them their area for ease of use ... all one big pot.

My guess (no offense) is marketing-wise, FL needs the purchases, no matter. Why else, mindlessly dump in books?

Wellll..... If I was running the Logos Company ....  we all know it would be perfect in every way.... right?  LOL  LOL  LOL.... 

I fully realize that statement is wrong... just because I'm human and not perfect. Knowing this causes me to consider to give a little leniency to others and understand they will also make mistakes. If those mistakes become the trend of what they do, that's one thing. But if they try to and do correct their mistakes, welll.... that's another thing. 

I see Logos making mistakes, no doubt, mainly because Logos is run by a group of humans, and if those humans are like me... welll... they make mistakes.

But...  I am thankful that Logos is actually trying to correct their mistakes. That's why I gave them a big "ATTA BOY"!    And .... I would hope we all would encourage them in keeping on doing this. 

That's my opinion, and mine alone! [8-|] 

"Cleis Press is the largest independent sexuality publishing company in the United States. With a focus on LGBTQ, BDSM, romance, and erotic writing for all ..."  If this sounds like a "respected publisher" that "adds books to the Logos platform using an automated feed," then I would be interested in knowing how they got the feed in the first place. I would also like to know why, as of a few minutes ago, their disgusting trash is still on the platform. I'm still waiting to be told why previous complaints about this situation were not addressed.

I am willing to be charitable, but before I start handing out compliments, I'm going to need some answers, and I would like them to be honest answers. 

JT (alabama24) said:

Logos does supply books to seminaries and other academic institutions. Even at conservative schools, there are courses which utilize sources from different backgrounds for the purpose of education (even if refuting). It would be easy to see some school utilizing a source from that publisher. 

Seeing that this book is geared towards children, I highly doubt that any academic institution is using it for a textbook.

The Junior Witch’s Handbook: A Kid’s Guide to White Magic, Spells, and Rituals. The link is still active at the time of posting.

Edit: Logos used to be a safe bookstore for all family members, regardless of age. It is not that place anymore.

John Norvell said:

"Cleis Press is the largest independent sexuality publishing company in the United States. With a focus on LGBTQ, BDSM, romance, and erotic writing for all ..."  If this sounds like a "respected publisher" that "adds books to the Logos platform using an automated feed," then I would be interested in knowing how they got the feed in the first place. I would also like to know why, as of a few minutes ago, their disgusting trash is still on the platform. I'm still waiting to be told why previous complaints about this situation were not addressed.

I am willing to be charitable, but before I start handing out compliments, I'm going to need some answers, and I would like them to be honest answers. 

There's only one title by this publisher in the store. For those interested, it's The Collected Writings of Bayard Rustin, a civil rights activist and key strategist/adviser to Martin Luther King, Jr. This is not a BDSM/romance/erotic title. There's nothing overtly sexual about the title, cover, or description of this book. This "disgusting trash" is simply the collected works of a key civil rights leader, and a review of the table of contents indicates that the book is about his experiences in the civil rights movement and his perspective on civil/human rights and non-violent resistance.

I'm not trying to argue with anyone, nor will I be arguing with anyone. I just wanted to introduce some facts into the discussion that the quoted post neglected to mention. This is why I would rather decide for myself whether a book is appropriate than have a minority of the loudest users deciding for everyone else what we can and cannot purchase in Logos.

I'm also posting just in case others wanted to purchase the book before Logos removed it. It's reasonably priced for a 422-page book and represents a diverse perspective you don't often find in Logos.

Carry on.

I received the above response via email from customer service a day or so back that some titles were "inadvertently" added to your catalog because you were trying to expand your offerings and didn't have enough controls in place to vet what publishers were automatically uploading. I'm thankful you are working to clean that up.

MJ. Smith said:

I appreciate your opinion. You have always been fair to me.

No matter the outcome, I wish everyone involved well.

Hi M.J.  Yes I did take the time read a sampling of various offerings from an assortment of of the thousands of erotic/pornographic books that were the catalyst for this event. I did not read any from Cleis, as the titles were disgusting enough. I was unaware that they published some of the titles you mentioned, and I am grateful for your correction. In any event, the point of all of this is that offerings such as "Hard Rhythm," Wild Licks," and "Crimson Craft:Sexual Magic for the Solo Witch," and so many others, would seem to be inappropriate for the platform, and fortunately Logos appears to agree. I am thankful for their decision to remove material that is contrary to their stated policies and offensive (again, the erotic/pornographic tomes) to most (and hopefully all) professing Christians.  In no way to I desire to interfere with anyone's philosophies of ministry outreach or child rearing. Sincere thanks for sharing the Cleis information, and for listening.

John Norvell said:

Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Yesterday 5:18 PM Actually I was not referring to to Mr. Rustin's work but rather the erotic offerings of Cleis Press which they are best known for according to their own site. Several of their books were available when I wrote my post, and apparently they were removed prior to your post. I hope this clarifies my post and I apologize for any misunderstanding

No worries. I see that there was a several-hour time gap between my post and yours.

I agree that there shouldn't be erotica on the Logos platform. I just don't want Logos banning publishers wholesale since many publishers offer a breadth of content. Kudos to Logos for trying to provide a breadth of content while continuing to refine their filters for inappropriate content. I hope we can give them some grace while they do that.

We've had a recent instance of Logos pulling a title that wasn't erotica or promoting violence because a few loud users personally disagreed with its topic being on Logos. We were not given a reason why it was removed, nor did the decision seem to fit with their policy. I don't want Logos to get in the habit of bowing to that kind of pressure.

Hopefully going forward there can be more consistency and more prompt communication with users. And I hope Logos errs on the side of selling too many books than not enough. I for one am glad the Rustin title slipped through.

Hi Matt. I sent you a DM. Thanks

You're late to the party. There were several erotic titles by this publisher available on Logos until recently. This publisher's focus is erotica and pro-homosexual publications. They should never have been considered as a source for materials for Logos, one or two exceptions notwithstanding. Whoever at Logos gave them access to the site did zero homework.

Gosh, I better act quickly to get such titles as "A Witches' Bible: The Complete Witches' Handbook", which gives detailed instructions for witchcraft such as setting up rooms for rituals.

I don't know anyone in our church who would even consider buying such occultic material.

Logos, please speed up the process and get rid of rubbish like this!

DMB said:

- Our church doesn't like it: Yep

I would argue that "Please don't offer books that promote the occult" has more in common with "Please don't offer books that glorify violence" than "Please don't offer books that our church doesn't like." Occult titles may not bother you personally, but it's not unreasonable to suggest that they're "off-brand" for a retailer catering to a Christian market.