Removing titles from the Logos platform

Portnoy's Complaint

I definitely want a clean Logos experience.  Some books will be obvious by their title: SB gone.

Some will slip thru.  I have no idea of 'Portnoy's' ' content.  I remember it being in bookstores decades ago, + know who the author is by having seen its cover those many years past, but that's it.

I believe we will have to report some volumes to Logos.

However, we’re currently working to tighten these controls so the Logos platform is always a safe place for going deeper in the Bible.

The process has been been automated and they are working on improving it.  However, mistakes are bound to be made and some titles will accidentally slip through.  When that happens, users have the option to report this to Logos.  

I would also suspect that Logos will be able to learn from these mistakes and fine tune their selection process.  

Exactly.

Again, why are we being asked to do their jobs for them?

I agree it's kind of silly that we're being asked to report titles to them. Perhaps they truely don't (or didn't) understand how big of a mess they had on their hands. I took the one category of Harlequin romances as a suggestion for them to take care of. My initial search of the Logos library showed 1,148 titles/matches for the search term "Harlequin". Most of them were clearly not useful in anyway whatsoever for "research" that a Christian would/should be doing. Last night, I finally recieved a reply to my email in which I suggested they search for "Harlequin". This morning, a search for "Harlequin" returns 16 matches. Several are of the "Christian romance" category, and some are non fiction.

In the email, it was explained:

[quote]

I appreciate how this is a poor reflection on what we are aiming to do here at Logos and want to reiterate that we are taking the matter seriously.  I have gone through and pulled these resources from the platform.  So, to answer your questions directly, the answer to both is no.  These resources were never intended to be put on the platform as they are not acceptable and no, they will not be remaining on the site. 

 

I will state it is a very manual process to reverse these and while I’ve aimed to get them all there may be some that are missed.  I will keep searching for anything with the same search term and keep addressing until they are all removed.

I'm grateful that things titles like this are not accpetable and will not be left on the platform.

I think their response has been slow - perhaps because they did not realize the massive numbers of offensive titles that had been uploaded by the previously ungated automated process. However, I appreciate that perhaps they're starting to understand the mess on their hands. And that it it requires manually removeing each title (one at a time?)

I can't help but think that these are not merely oversights by the publishers and imprints, but rather the actions of a nefarious person(s) wanting to sow chaos for a Christian company that did not have their digital doorway sufficiently secured.

I would hope that Christian scholars would not, as a general rule, directly quote explicitly pornographic material. But I would note two things. First, there are a number of Christian works that address pornography and describe aspects of it (e.g., objectification of women, implicit or explicit violence, transgression of traditional sexual norms, prevalence of various fetishes, unrealistic representations of sexuality, etc.) that certainly suggest the authors have done original research. Second, pornography has become a recognized area of study in the broader academic world, and much of that work is not shy about quoting from the source materials.

It may not be a perfect analogy.

Yes, exactly. Display of pornographic practices (and violence) would be offensive to any Christian reader who studies the named areas in scholarly and academic resources, whereas display of occult practices, in general, is not.

Proof:

These are just a few examples from scholarly works in my library.

You won't find anything similarly graphic in studies of pornography and related areas.

On behalf of the Logos team

Thank you, Matt, and the Logos team for cleaning this situation up.

Thank you, Matt.

Yes, thanks Matt. I've read this and now the statement on the Logos website. I'm glad you're working this diligently and appreciate your efforts.

Can you please explain why Cleis Press was one of the publishers Logos chose to partner with? They are described as:

"...an American independent publisher of books in the areas of sexuality, erotica, feminism, gay and lesbian studies, gender studies, fiction, and human rights."

This is not a general publisher with some problematic titles but a publisher dedicated to erotica and LGBTQ titles.

This is not a general publisher with some problematic titles but a publisher dedicated to erotica and LGBTQ titles.

LGBTQ titles are clearly of interest to Christians as it is a highly contested religious issue. I have known both liberal and conservative pastors who have gone to great lengths to educate themselves on the issues.

Agreed. Non-erotica LGBTQ titles are relevant to me and other Christians, even those who don't take an affirming position. I do not believe Logos should remove a title simply on the basis that it has LGBTQ-related subject matter. Erotica, straight or LGBTQ, should be removed, but simply having an LGBTQ label should not be sufficient grounds to have a title removed.

I hope Matt considers this feedback going forward as he endeavors to bring  broad and relevant content and does not succumb to pressure from a loud few who think God ordained them to control what everyone else can buy from Logos. Whether we're affirming or non-affirming we may want to engage the issue from an informed/educated stance, and I would like all of us to have the freedom to chose to do so, and to do it with Logos. Logos makes studying these issues so much more powerful and efficient and I don't want to always have to go to a different, less feature-rich reader.

Thank you for this update. Are you able to speak to why it took so long and why it's seemingly only being treated as a priority now? We saw a large scale purge of sexual books only in the last 48 hours, compared to the previous 7 weeks when this was initially brought to your attention. What changed in the last two days, other than our continued pressure?

...does not succumb to pressure from a loud few who think God ordained them to control what everyone else can buy from Logos.

Could we all try to dial some of this rhetoric back just a little bit? 

• We've all been rather loud, on both sides.
• Without a representative poll of all Logos users, it's impossible to know who the "few" are.
• I don't recall anyone actually claiming a divine ordination in this matter.

Appreciate your update, and all the hard work of the team there!

Last update was mid April and it is currently May 12th, 2024. I haven't seen any other news on updates for the removal of the pornographic, or graphic material. 

What publishers or distributors have now been removed from Faithlife/Logos because of this; and what proper measures is Faithlife/Logos done and continually doing to prevent this from happening again without having to depend upon those of us whom you provide this Christians Bible Application to.? 

I do appreciate all of your help that Faithlife/Logos have done for my studies with the Bible. I'm praying for the highest level of Christ like integrity.

Lev 11:44; Lev 19:2; Lev 20:7; 1 Peter 1:16 because it is written, “YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY.” 

I trust the LORD. Man, as well as in myself, I have less than trust in. And that is where accountability comes in. 

I think the update from mid April says it all, so I'm not we should expect a further update.

@Matt Bennett, would you please address what Protestia released on 5/11/2024? Thanks!