Searching for an exact quote

Years ago I read in the ECF the following, but I cannot find the exact qute even though I have a very large Logos collection. I would appreciate it if someone can provide the quote?

"Evangelical theologians are dusting off their copies of the Church fathers, Anselm, Aquinas, Scotus, Occam, Luther, Calvin, Arminius, and Molina. Perhaps it is not quite like fourth-century Constantinople where market places, street corners, and barbershops buzzed with discussion about the doctrine of the Trinity. "

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Todd Phillips

According to Google, that's a quote from an article in the Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society from 2002 (my JETS volumes in Logos stop at 2001):

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P3-133751951.html

NetworkGeek

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174846#Comment_174846

I found it, Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society, Vol. 45, No. 2, Pg 277:

Evangelical theologians are dusting off their copies of the Church fathers, Anselm, Aquinas, Scotus, Occam, Luther, Calvin, Arminius, and Molina. Perhaps it is not quite like fourth-century Constantinople where market places, street corners, and barbershops buzzed with discussion about the doctrine of the Trinity. But we are discussing the doctrine of God seriously and with passion—in scholarly and popular journals, in local and national, academic gatherings, and even in churches. We owe this renaissance in part to the controversial proposals of the "openness of God"¹ school of thought or, as I shall refer to it, "open theism." Open theism endeavors to revise the traditional doctrine of God to make it more biblical and of greater contemporary relevance. It fleshes out its intuitions by differentiating itself from the classical doctrine of God and process theism.² On the one hand, open theism disputes the traditional doctrines of divine immutability, impassibility, omnipotence, omniscience, aseity, and eternity. On the other hand, it declines process theism’s invitation to follow it in rejecting the doctrines of God’s unlimited nature and creation from nothing. Open theism dissents from the traditional consensus that God controls all things, but it refuses to give up the belief that God could control all things, if he so chose.

Gary Butner, Th.D.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174846#Comment_174846

I have the quote from the Evangelical Theological Society in my Logos system. However, that is not the original quote. If you read carefully you will see the ETS article refers to an event in history, which was written elsewhere.

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174911#Comment_174911

Sorry, I don't understand what you're looking for.

TCBlack

Did you search in the ECF? Like Dominic I searched my entire library of near 3000 resources and came up with this link from JETS 45.45.2.277

Volume 45, Number 2, Page 277

it is the exact quote you have there.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174911#Comment_174911

If you read carefully you will see the ETS article refers to an event in history, which was written elsewhere.

Are you meaning the original quote regarding how everyone what discussing the nature of God so that you couldn't walk down the street without listening to the discussion? That's an early church father often quoted in Catholic texts ... I suspect it will come to me which one ...

Gary Butner, Th.D.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174931#Comment_174931

The JETS article quotes the ECF, but does not give the reference. I specifically remember the discussions or debates were taking place in barbershops and markets. It wasn't in the CAtholic edition of the ECF.

Gary Butner, Th.D.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174931#Comment_174931

Tom, yes, I searched the ECF to no avail. Likewise, I have 3,600 resources.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174961#Comment_174961

It wasn't in the CAtholic edition of the ECF.

But it is from an ECF who attended the Council ... it is simply escaping me which one.

Gary Butner, Th.D.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174967#Comment_174967

MJ, I agree, and I am amazed that we cannot find it searching Logos.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174971#Comment_174971

I've read it too now that I know what you're looking for. And go figure I can't remember any specific phrases or I'd search for it. Searching for barber or barbershop isn't getting me anywhere.

Todd Phillips

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174976#Comment_174976

I've read it too now that I know
what you're looking for. And go figure I can't remember any specific
phrases or I'd search for it. Searching for barber or barbershop isn't
getting me anywhere.

The closest thing that I can find in Logos is in Schaff's History of the Christian Church:

[quote] In
Constantinople, during the Arian controversy, all classes, even
mechanics, bankers, frippers, market women, and runaway slaves took
lively part in the questions of Homousion and sub-ordination, of the
begotten and the unbegotten. [So Gregory of Nyssa (not Nazianzen, as J.
H. Kurtz, wrongly quoting from Neander, has it in his large K. Gesch. i.
ii. p. 99) relates from his own observation: Orat. de Deitate Filii et
Spiritus S. (Opera ii. p. 898, ed. Paris. of 1615). He compares his
contemporaries in this respect with the Athenians, who are always
wishing to hear some new thing.]

The speculative mind of the
Eastern church was combined with a deep religious earnestness and a
certain mysticism, and at the same time with the Grecian curiosity and
disputatiousness, which afterwards rather injured than promoted her
inward life. Gregory Nazianzen, who lived in Constantinople in the midst
of the Arian wars, describes the division and hostility which this
polemic spirit introduced between parents and children, husbands and
wives, old and young, masters and slaves, priests and people. “It has
gone so far that the whole market resounds with the discourses of
heretics, every banquet is corrupted by this babbling even to nausea,
every merrymaking is transformed into a mourning, and every funeral
solemnity is almost alleviated by this brawling as a still greater evil;
even the chambers of women, the nurseries of simplicity, are disturbed
thereby, and the flowers of modesty are crushed by this precocious
practice of dispute.” [Orat. xxvii. 2 (Opera, tom. i. p. 488). Comp. Orat. xxxii. (tom. i. p. 581); Carmen de vita sua, vers. 1210 sqq. (tom. ii. p. 737 sq.).]

On the Internet, the only thing I can find found regarding barber shops and theological controversies is in a book by Paul Tillich--

So
we now have the struggle between the homoosioui and the homoiousioi .
The hostile pagans in Alexandria made jokes about this fight going on in
the streets and barber shops and in the different stores and
everywhere: the Christians fight about the iota, the smallest letter of
the alphabet – the only letter distinguishing homoousios from
homoiousios.

--Which sounds similar to the original quote, but says the source is "pagans in Alexandria".

Elliot Ritzema (Faithlife)

Looks like it's Gregory of Nyssa, from his Oratio de Deitate Filii et Spiritus Sancti. I'm not sure whether it has been translated into English, but I found it footnoted here in Schaff's History of the Christian Church: logosres:schaff;art=V3.H117f

Here is the paragraph where it is footnoted:

The leading personages in these controversies were of course bishops and priests. By their side fought the monks, as a standing army, with fanatical zeal for the victory of orthodoxy, or not seldom in behalf even of heresy. Emperors and civil officers also mixed in the business of theology, but for the most part to the prejudice of its free, internal development; for they imparted to all theological questions a political character, and entangled them with the cabals of court and the secular interests of the day. In Constantinople, during the Arian controversy, all classes, even mechanics, bankers, frippers, market women, and runaway slaves took lively part in the questions of Homousion and sub-ordination, of the begotten and the unbegotten.

Schaff, P., & Schaff, D. S. (1997). History of the Christian church. Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/174994#Comment_174994

Well done! I wonder what a fourth century mechanic did?

I tried to search for Constantinople NEAR market, but got nothing. I was only one word out! (NEAR equates to WITHIN 10 WORDS)

Gary Butner, Th.D.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/175006#Comment_175006

Great job! I did send an e-mail to Dr. Highfield at Pepperdine asking for the source. He was between classes at the time, and promised to respond later when he was near his books.