F1 Multiple Hebrew words in context (Englishman's Hebrew)

I am away from home so I am doing this from memory, I have the silver scholars edition, and lots of other stuff.

In trying to deal with some SDA folks, I wanted to copy all the times that "evening and "morning" were in the samee verse in the Hebrew. The contention is that the words in Daniel 8:15 mean something other than the plain meaning--it is a long story, so if you do not understand, do not worry.

Today, I went through 12 pages on the forum, and I could not find the answer, thus I post here.

I did a lemma search on both the words, and found 79 or so times the words were used, but I could not copy and paste them into the word processor. All I got pasted was the reference to Genesis 2:19 without aany text. I tried this several times, with no result.

Most frustrating is the fact that I could do the same thing in Logos 3, but not Logos 4.

What am I missing?

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Comments

David Paul

John, perhaps the reason you haven't gotten any replies is because your references (Dan. 8:15 & Gen. 2:19) don't relate to the topic you've mentioned. I think you intended Dan. 8:14, which mentions the 2,300 evenings and mornings. I'm not sure what you are trying to prove or disprove (not enough info), so I can't comment. I use L3 as my primary tool, but I think I've read here in the forums that the inability to copy searches is one of the gripes folks have with L4.

What I can say is that there are two main ideas as to what is meant by 2,300 evenings and mornings, which the NET Bible Notes address:

The language of evenings and mornings is reminiscent of the creation account in Genesis 1. Since “evening and morning” is the equivalent of a day, the reference here would be to 2,300 days. However, some interpreters understand the reference to be to the evening sacrifice and the morning sacrifice, in which case the reference would be to only 1,150 days. Either way, the event that marked the commencement of this period is unclear. The event that marked the conclusion of the period is the rededication of the temple in Jerusalem following the atrocious and sacrilegious acts that Antiochus implemented. This took place on December 25, 165 B.C. The Jewish celebration of Hanukkah each year commemorates this victory.

Biblical Studies Press. (2006; 2006). The NET Bible First Edition; Bible. English. NET Bible.; The NET Bible. Biblical Studies Press.

Of course, the Hebrew doesn't exactly say "2,300 evenings and mornings"...rather it says (according to LHI):

עַד	עֶרֶב	בֹּקֶר	אַלְפַּיִם	וּשְׁלֹשׁ	מֵאוֹת
עד	ערב	בקר	אלף	ו · שׁלושׁ	מאה
for	evening	morning	thousand	and · three	hundred
for	evenings	mornings	two thousand	and · three	hundred
PD	NCcSMN	NCcSMN	NCNDMN	CC · NCNSMC	NCNPFN

...which I would translate as "until evening morning 2,300", because I always translate as literally as possible. I do this because it makes a profound difference when trying to comprehend prophetic intent. Making the Hebrew "make sense" in English is virtually a guarantee that the prophetic intent will be expunged or greatly truncated. Anyway, notice that the words "evening" and "morning" are not actually plurals. As best as I can tell, the two verses in Dan. 8 are the only ones where the word "morning" is plural in the English in the OT. Therefore some folks might be inclined to say that this word "just isn't written as a plural". But the word "evening" is different--it IS written as a plural in the Hebrew when used in the phrase "between the two evenings" as found in Exo. 12:6 and elsewhere (but sometimes translated as "at twilight"). See how it appears:

“between the two evenings” (בֵּין הָעַרְבָּיִם, beiyn haa`arbaayim).

It's worth noting that the word "two" doesn't seem to be in the Hebrew either, even though most sources that give a"literal" Hebrew reading include it. This is because the word haa`arbaayim is the dual form (this also explains how "thousand" becomes "two thousand" above). For some reason the LHI has this phrase as:

בֵּין		הָעַרְבָּיִם׃
בין		ה · ערב
at		the · evening
at		the · evening
Pb		XD · NCcDMPH

...which is a COMPLETE FLUB. According to its own morphology for beiyn it means "between". The fourth line above should read "between the two evenings", as was shown previously.

Also, going AGAINST the idea that Dan. 8:14 is referring to the "morning and evening sacrifices" is the fact that this verse reverses the order--"evening morning". This accords more with the Gen. 1 references to "and it was evening, and it was morning", and thus a 24-hour period. When the sacrifices are discussed together, it is almost always in the order "morning and evening".

So anyway...there's a lot to consider in this enquiry. As far as the NET note suggestions above are concerned, I would bet a week's wages that NEITHER of the two common explanations are valid. YWHW has an astounding ability to make what He intends appear to be something else all together. This is precisely how He was able to "seal" countless prophecies in a book that has been read by billions and yet have them remain wholly unrecognized.

Graham Criddle

Hi John

I'm not sure of some of the details in your post - for example I don't see the words "morning" or "evening" in Daniel 8.15

But you seem to be saying that you can successfully carry out the lemma search you want, the problem is getting it into your word processor.

If that is the case, have you tried using the Print/Export capability off the search window (press the small down-arrow at the bottom right of the magnifying glass icon) and exported the results of your search to Word?

See http://wiki.logos.com/Print$2fExport for more details regarding this capability.

If I am missing your point, please clarify

Graham

EDIT: Hadn't seen David's reply when I posted this - thanks for clearing up the 8:15 reference.

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/221317#Comment_221317

Also, if you export your results to a passage list you can copy from there or print the passage list (which will have some different formatting options).

The one thing you can't do is highlight and copy directly from the results.