Need help doing a word search.

Hi. I am trying to get a graph like this one[1]: for the word "bruised" (Hebrew "ratsats" from Isa 42).

I'm getting two different results in Accordance and Logos, and I'm trying to understand why.

The Strong's key number is H7533.

When I search the NRSV for that key in Accordance, I get 19 matches[2].

When I do a 'morph' search in Logos, I get 19 matches[3]

BUT when I do the "translation graph" (is that what that color circle chart is called?), I only get 13 results [4].

I'm quite sure that this is a problem with me doing something wrong, probably in the Bible Word Study panel. I can't seem to enter the Strong's number there so I tried to get at it the best I could, but I'm guessing that I did something wrong.

Any help would be appreciated.

[1]: that's http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18414/H7533/Bruised-Logos-graph.png if it doesn't appear correctly in the post

[2]: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18414/H7533/Bruised-Accordance.rtf

[3]: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18414/H7533/Logos-Strongs-7533-19-results-18-verses.jpg

[4]: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18414/H7533/Logos-Graph-13-results.jpg

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steve clark

I am trying to get a graph like this one[1]: for the word "bruised"

EDIT: this strong's number has 2 different definitions for this word. So you will need to open 2 different Bible Word Study rings.

Second Definition

If you will find your word in your Bible (a reverse-interlinear, like the ESV) you can right click on the word that you want looked up. See below

1. Locate the word in your Bible, then right click on that word with your mouse. Logos4 will show you a pop-up menu.

2. On the right side of the pop-up menu find the Lemma for your word (sometime you might see more than 1 lemma) and click on the lemma. (this will change what shows on the left side of the pop-up menu)

3. On the left side now click on Bible Word Study.

4. Logos4 will open the Bible Word Study tool to your word (lemma form).

5. In the circle if you click on the color for your english word, Logos4 will pull it away from the ring. Then under the ring will be all the occurrences for that word found in your Bible version.

First Definition

From the Search results find a scripture passage which is not shown in the first Bible Word Study tool, then repeat above procedure

1. Locate your word in your Bible and right click on it.

2. On the right side of the pop-up menu find the lemma for your word and click on Lemma.

3. Then on the left side of the pop-up menu click on Bible Word Study to have Logos4 open it.

Notice that the 1st definition has 13 hits and the 2nd definition has 6 hits. So the combination of the two = what you found in Accordance and in the Logos4 Search results.

P.S. you can learn more about Logos4's Bible Word Study tool in this wiki page: Bible Word Study

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231759#Comment_231759

You can also select one or the other definition using the dropdown on the Bible Word Study window:

EDIT: Just click in the edit box where the lemma רצץ shows up at the top, and the dropdown will appear.

steve clark

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231767#Comment_231767

Cool Rosie, i didn't think of that tip. Thanks

tjluoma

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231767#Comment_231767

I don't seem to have that dropdown. Is that on Windows? I'm on the latest Mac version (I think) 4.2a SR-2 (4.21.5.0906)

tjluoma

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231759#Comment_231759

Just my luck! Thanks for the explanation. It took some doing to get this to work, it kept giving me the first definition, not the second, until I put

lemma:רצץ:2

into the Bible Word Search.

13 + 6 = 19, indeed.

Thanks for the help.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231773#Comment_231773

I don't seem to have that dropdown. Is that on Windows? I'm on the latest Mac version (I think) 4.2a SR-2 (4.21.5.0906)

Yes, it's on Windows. I wasn't aware that this isn't working yet on the Mac. I'll check with the Mac MVPs and have one of them report it if it's a discrepancy, since these sorts of things are supposed to work the same on both platforms. I think.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231779#Comment_231779

Clicking on hebrew lemma in BWS does not produce a dropdown - however, type a number or space (to left of word) then delete typing does:

Then can use arrow key to highlight desired lemma and press enter (or click on desired lemma).

By the way, Wiki Logos 4 Mac has What to Expect section lists several Logos 4.2a feature discrepancies between PC & Mac.

Edit: fixed Wiki section reference (and added this workaround to list).

Keep Smiling [:)]

Alan Macgregor

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231779#Comment_231779

I'll check with the Mac MVPs and have one of them report it if it's a discrepancy, since these sorts of things are supposed to work the same on both platforms.

Thanks for the heads-up, Rosie.

Here's how it works on Mac (I think).

Though they have the same features. Mac and Windows don't always work in the same way.

Every blessing

Alan

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231792#Comment_231792

I'll
check with the Mac MVPs and have one of them report it if it's a
discrepancy, since these sorts of things are supposed to work the same on both platforms.

Thanks for the heads-up, Rosie.

Here's how it works on Mac (I think).

Though they have the same features. Mac and Windows don't always work in the same way.

Every blessing

Alan

All of what you described works on Windows too, and is an alternative way of seeing the full list at once (in Hebrew only).

I think Mac is just missing the ability to
click to get the dropdown menu for the quick way of toggling back and
forth between the two versions of the same lemma. But KS4J has provided a
workaround. It remains to be seen whether that's an intentional
discrepancy (because Mac UI standards sometimes trump feature parity) or
whether it's just an oversight. If the former it should be added to http://wiki.logos.com/Mac_and_PC_User_Interface_Differences. If the latter, it should be reported to Logos as a bug/oversight.

What
I'm puzzled by, though, is why on both your and my experiences, the
total number 19 is listed beside Hebrew Bible in the Textual Searches
section, but for luomat in his image [4], it only shows 13 there.
Luomat, I'd be interested to know what happens for you if you click on
the "Hebrew Bible" link in that shot where you've got only 13 showing.
Does it go to the morph search with only 13 results?

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231797#Comment_231797

What
I'm puzzled by, though, is why on both your and my experiences, the
total number 19 is listed beside Hebrew Bible in the Textual Searches
section, but for luomat in his image [4], it only shows 13 there.
Luomat, I'd be interested to know what happens for you if you click on
the "Hebrew Bible" link in that shot where you've got only 13 showing.
Does it go to the morph search with only 13 results?

Wondering about Library prioritization differences ?

Keep Smiling [:)]

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231801#Comment_231801

What
I'm puzzled by, though, is why on both your and my experiences, the
total number 19 is listed beside Hebrew Bible in the Textual Searches
section, but for luomat in his image [4], it only shows 13 there.
Luomat, I'd be interested to know what happens for you if you click on
the "Hebrew Bible" link in that shot where you've got only 13 showing.
Does it go to the morph search with only 13 results?

Wondering about Library prioritization differences ?

Keep Smiling

Could it be a different Hebrew Bible he has prioritized, you think?

I've got BHS/WHM4.2 (Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia with Westminster 4.2 Morphology).

Can't imagine number of times a particular lemma appears would differ between versions, but perhaps different morphological tagging would account for the discrepancy.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231804#Comment_231804

What
I'm puzzled by, though, is why on both your and my experiences, the
total number 19 is listed beside Hebrew Bible in the Textual Searches
section, but for luomat in his image [4], it only shows 13 there.
Luomat, I'd be interested to know what happens for you if you click on
the "Hebrew Bible" link in that shot where you've got only 13 showing.
Does it go to the morph search with only 13 results?

Wondering about Library prioritization differences ?

Keep Smiling

Could it be a different Hebrew Bible he has prioritized, you think?

I've got BHS/WHM4.2 (Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia with Westminster 4.2 Morphology).

Can't imagine number of times a particular lemma appears would differ between versions, but perhaps different morphological tagging would account for the discrepancy.

Library priority affects textual search results - if AFAT or LHI prioritized first, then 6 Hebrew verses (after click here in Alan's picture on BWS bruised):

if BHS/WHM 4.2 is first, then 19 Hebrew verses:

Keep Smiling [:)]

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231805#Comment_231805

Thanks for the confirmation.

If BHS/WIVU prioritized, then 18 results in 18 verses.

Can't reproduce the 13 results in 12 verses that luomat saw.

tjluoma

Is there a way to get one graph which shows all the occurrences of Strong 7533?

If so, I can't figure out how, and that's what I really need.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231893#Comment_231893

Is there a way to get one graph which shows all the occurrences of Strong 7533?

If so, I can't figure out how, and that's what I really need.

No, there isn't, because Strong's #7533 actually represents two different words which happen to be spelled the same.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231893#Comment_231893

Is there a way to get one graph which shows all the occurrences of Strong 7533?

If so, I can't figure out how, and that's what I really need.

Living and learning. With BHS/WIVU prioritized, can click in Bible Word Study (BWS) Textual Searches on Hebrew Bible, which opens a Morph Search for lemma רצץ with "Graph Results" button that shows all 18 occurrences of Strong's 7533 in one graph:

Keep Smiling [:)]

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/231775#Comment_231775

Just my luck! Thanks for the explanation. It took some doing to get this to work, it kept giving me the first definition, not the second, until I put

lemma:רצץ:2

into the Bible Word Search.

13 + 6 = 19, indeed.

More living and learning, If The Hebrew Bible: Andersen-Forbes Analyzed Text (AFAT) is prioritized first in library, can modify Morph Search for both lemma's, then graph 19 results for Strong's # 7533:

Note: after copy and paste of <lemma = af/he/רצץ:2> used mouse to highlight "2:" then type ":1"

English Reverse Interlinear Bibles have Andersen-Forbes Hebrew/Aramaic Morphology.

Keep Smiling [:)]