Number of Protestant denominations
Okay, the subject line is just to grab attention. In starting to work through Baptist churches systematically I've run into a number of articles trying to define denominations so one can count them. This is the best:
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Thanks MJ [:)][:)]
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I always enjoy the old joke about the multiplicity of Baptist denominations (I have dearly beloved friends who are Baptists, so no offense intended):
A man was walking along San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge when he
saw a woman about to jump off. He ran up to her, trying to dissuade her
from committing suicide. He told her simply that God loved her. A tear
came to her eye.
He then asked her, “Are you a Christian, a Jew, a Hindu, or what?”“I’m a Christian,” she replied.
He said, “Me, too! Small world! Protestant or Catholic?”
“Protestant.”
“Me, too! What denomination?”
“Baptist.”
“Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?”
“Northern Baptist.”
He remarked, “Well, ME TOO! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?”
She answered, “Northern Conservative Baptist.”
He said, “Well, that’s amazing! Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist or Northern Conservative Reformed Baptist?”
“Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist.”
“Remarkable! Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist Great Lakes
Region or Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist Eastern Region?”She told him, “Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist Great Lakes Region.”
“A miracle!” he cried. “Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist
Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative
Fundamentalist Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?”She said, “Northern Conservative Fundamentalist Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912.”
He then shouted, “DIE, HERETIC!”, and pushed her over the rail.
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Wow Rosie, who can remember that kind of complicated joke? [:O]
Bohuslav
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Bohuslav Wojnar said:
Wow Rosie, who can remember that kind of complicated joke?
Google Search, copy/paste.
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I am not a Baptist, but I graduated from an independent Baptist Christian High School. I teach and preach across denominational lines, so I still mingle with many various types of Baptist across the U.S. My brother was a Baptist for years and graduated from a Baptist College. While in college he was required to take a class called Baptist History (I still find it humorous that the school did NOT offer a class on Christian history). In that class they were told that there are in excess of 140 different types of Baptist organizations just within the continental United States; many more world-wide. I am a student of Church history, and upon further investigation discovered that similar variations exist in many other denominations as well. But, we are all one. No point to make other than the funny one :-)
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jwsheets said:
upon further investigation discovered that similar variations exist in many other denominations
One of the funniest things I've run into is a set of statistics claiming 242 varieties of Roman Catholics - turns out that the definition they used included "within a country" so no denomination can span a national border. How many new denominations does that make in the Balkans and the old USSR?
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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jwsheets said:
140 different types of Baptist organizations
I attend an Independent Baptist Church and they take the "independent" very seriously. A recent front page headline of our state paper did an article on an IFB church that teaches their Bible camp kids how to shoot machine guns. I had to reassure one of my fellow church attendees that we are not "one of those" type of churches.
Sometimes it is nice not to have to defend crazies with a similar name on their church sign.[:D]
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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I agree, among Independent baptist there are many different types from ultra conservative to moderate in belief and it seems most don't want to associate with the other. [:)]
I was raised Independent or Evangelical methodist and also in Ind. Baptist Churches. My family has pastored in both denominations. Now talk about something hard: having a Methodist church on your resume and candidate for a baptist church[:D]
I Pastor a Baptist church and there are more United Methodist's in our church than baptist. In fact there are relatively very few baptist background people in the church. What's even more amazing is that there is terrific unity in the church despite the many different denominational backgrounds. I have found Sound Biblical preaching transcends many bias.
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Jeremy Tondee said:
I have found Sound Biblical preaching transcends many bias.
Sounds like you've got the beginning of a new denomination there: "Sound Biblical Preaching Baptist." Of course you might need to specify which Bible and that would get something else going. So perhaps its better to forget the whole idea. [:(]
Pastor, North Park Baptist Church
Bridgeport, CT USA
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jwsheets said:
While in college he was required to take a class called Baptist History (I still find it humorous that the school did NOT offer a class on Christian history).
In seminary I had to take Baptist History, too, but they did have a Christian History requirement (called Church History). Quite frankly Church History was boring compared to Baptist History. [;)]
Pastor, North Park Baptist Church
Bridgeport, CT USA
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Through Wikipedia and Baptist World Alliance, I have a mere 64 African Baptist groups to check out. I think I am already dreading North America.[8-|]
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Jeremy Tondee said:
I agree, among Independent baptist there are many different types from ultra conservative to moderate in belief and it seems most don't want to associate with the other.
It is a doctrinal issue common to Independent Baptists. They do not believe there is a "universal, unseen" church. Most only believe in individual churches. Refer to your Logos resources regarding church polity views of Independent Baptists. They differ significantly from all other Baptist denominations (Southern, American, Missionary, Free-Will.....) They believe the ecclesia ("calling out") happens at Rapture and the "be ye separate is a different thing from "One-Church", "One-Body:, or "Family of God" altogether
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Matthew C Jones said:Jeremy Tondee said:
I agree, among Independent baptist there are many different types from ultra conservative to moderate in belief and it seems most don't want to associate with the other.
It is a doctrinal issue common to Independent Baptists. They do not believe there is a "universal, unseen" church. Most only believe in individual churches. Refer to your Logos resources regarding church polity views of Independent Baptists. They differ significantly from all other Baptist denominations (Southern, American, Missionary, Free-Will.....) They believe the ecclesia ("calling out") happens at Rapture and the "be ye separate is a different thing from "One-Church", "One-Body:, or "Family of God" altogether
Found one polity discussion in "Christian Ministries and the Law" (Scholar's and above): logosres:chrminlaw;ref=Page.p_34;off=1454
MJ. Smith said:Through Wikipedia and Baptist World Alliance, I have a mere 64 African Baptist groups to check out. I think I am already dreading North America.
Observation: dread may include Anabaptists (worldwide), whose heritage is distinct from Protestant denominations.Keep Smiling [:)]
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Observation: dread may include Anabaptists (worldwide), whose heritage is distinct from Protestant denominations.
Who could dread Anabaptists? They are pacifists. Never hurt anyone.
Actually while they do share some things (predominantly believers' baptism) with Baptists, they are quite distinct. Anabaptists are the branch of the family tree that include Mennonites, Amish, Hutterites, and some Brethren denominations. They were called "Anabaptists" in derision by those who who thought they were heretical during the Reformation (Anabaptists means literally "rebaptizers"), and they were terribly persecuted -- drowned, burned at the stake, etc. -- for their beliefs/practices back then. I'm not sure the Baptists of today have that same heritage, though some of them might.
I found this in The Baptist Heritage: Four Centuries of Baptist Witness, which I have in Logos: "Most European Baptists see themselves in close kinship with the earlier Anabaptist movement. Many European historians portray Baptists as direct descendents [sic] of the Anabaptists and thus emphasize a European origin for all Baptists. Despite some similarity, evidence to trace any historical linkage between the two groups remains scanty."
Arggh! After finding that misspelling of descendants in that resource, I did a search in my Entire Library for it out of curiosity. 749 hits. I guess I'm going to be busy with Report Typo all night tonight... [:(]
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Rosie Perera said:
Arggh! After finding that misspelling of descendants in that resource, I did a search in my Entire Library for it out of curiosity. 749 hits. I guess I'm going to be busy with Report Typo all night tonight..
It's an acceptable alternative spelling: logosres:mwdict11;art=descendant1
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Okay folks. The cartoon was NOT aimed at any particular group. If you look at the recent reading lists you will find that I am working on three threads:
- Lutheran
- Reformation movement
- Baptists
The mention of Baptists was solely because I was doing research to identify the groups I should search for information on. I find information on about a quarter of the organizations I search for. The items done thus far (Reformation Movement is very incomplete) is:
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Mark Barnes said:Rosie Perera said:
Arggh! After finding that misspelling of descendants in that resource, I did a search in my Entire Library for it out of curiosity. 749 hits. I guess I'm going to be busy with Report Typo all night tonight..
It's an acceptable alternative spelling: logosres:mwdict11;art=descendant1
Thanks. Whew! You saved me hours of work.
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Matthew C Jones said:Jeremy Tondee said:
I agree, among Independent baptist there are many different types from ultra conservative to moderate in belief and it seems most don't want to associate with the other.
It is a doctrinal issue common to Independent Baptists. They do not believe there is a "universal, unseen" church.
Matthew
That is not true of IFB Churches in North Carolina/Virginia. Although they seldom work together, all those with which I am acquainted do recognize a universal Church consisting of all believers in Christ Jesus. There may be some disagreement as to whether that universal Church includes anyone from the SBC, however. [:D]
Matthew C Jones said:They differ significantly from all other Baptist denominations (Southern, American, Missionary, Free-Will.....)
Having served as Pastor in both IFB and SBC Churches, I can truthfully say that there is very little difference. Neither side truly understands the other, and there are multiple falsehoods firmly believed on both sides.
I served one SBC Church that included Missionary in its name, not that they were particularly mission-minded, but they wanted to distance themselves from the Primitive Baptists that filled the area.
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Rosie Perera said:
I always enjoy the old joke about the multiplicity of Baptist denominations (I have dearly beloved friends who are Baptists, so no offense intended):
When I first heard that joke several years ago, it was about Presbyterians (or was it Pentecostals?). [:D]
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Jack Caviness said:
I served one SBC Church that included Missionary in its name, not that they were particularly mission-minded, but they wanted to distance themselves from the Primitive Baptists that filled the area.
Isn't that generally the case for most Missionary baptist churches (and the reason for the name)?
Sometimes it's hard to tell when a name means something and when it doesn't. "Primitive baptist" tells me more about church than "Missionary baptist" does.
MacBook Pro (2019), ThinkPad E540
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Todd Phillips said:
"Primitive baptist" tells me more about church than "Missionary baptist" does.
Yes it does. But then, there were Hard-shell and Soft-shell in that area. The Soft-shell were somewhat closer to the "Missionary Baptist" in doctrine and Church policy. The Hard-shell were extreme Calvinists.
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When I was in Texas last month I saw an interesting church name which I'd never seen anything like before. Preterist was in the name of the church. I couldn't remember the rest of its name, but a quick Google search landed me on the only Preterist church in Texas and it is indeed the church I saw. It's a whole denomination, it turns out. A very tiny one (only 9 known fellowships). Perhaps they don't consider themselves a denomination, but they have a website, and there's a wiki with documents about their beliefs, so that makes them a denomination as far as Martha's project is concerned. [:)]
So Martha, good luck being exhaustive with your list. There will probably always be a few of these tiny little denominations that are not officially subsets of anything else, that you wouldn't hear about unless you knew someone who knew of their existence.
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Rosie Perera said:
There will probably always be a few of these tiny little denominations that are not officially subsets of anything else, that you wouldn't hear about unless you knew someone who knew of their existence.
At least they'll be less frustrating than the churches I know of that either don't have a website or McAfee redlines their website.[^o)]
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Jack Caviness said:
When I first heard that joke several years ago,
http://community.logos.com/forums/p/7960/63361.aspx#63361
Emo Philips created this in a comedy routine back in the 1980s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBKIyCbppfs (joke begins @ 2' 40"
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Rosie Perera said:
little denominations that are not officially subsets of anything else, that you wouldn't hear about unless you knew someone who knew of their existence
I had never heard of snake handlers until I became friends with a fellow raised in that tradition.
And just today I ran across A.A.Allen and "Miracle Valley." So I am afraid there is never going to be a complete list on the "independent" churches
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Matthew C Jones said:
I had never heard of snake handlers until I became friends with a fellow raised in that tradition.
I first heard of them in college - same film on them shown in two different classes.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:Matthew C Jones said:
I had never heard of snake handlers until I became friends with a fellow raised in that tradition.
I first heard of them in college - same film on them shown in two different classes.
Is it true they lock the church doors before they bring out the snakes? I don't think I'd want to visit their service.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Matthew C Jones said:
Emo Philips created this in a comedy routine back in the 1980s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBKIyCbppfs (joke begins @ 2' 40"
Ha! I'd never heard of that comedian. He's pretty funny. Here's another take on religion that he had in a related video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRLPr5biDhs0 -
Jack Caviness said:Rosie Perera said:
I always enjoy the old joke about the multiplicity of Baptist denominations (I have dearly beloved friends who are Baptists, so no offense intended):
When I first heard that joke several years ago, it was about Presbyterians (or was it Pentecostals?).
that's a real gut-buster...thanks!
Robert Pavich
For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__
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Matthew C Jones said:
Is it true they lock the church doors before they bring out the snakes? I don't think I'd want to visit their service.
That part may be a myth. I've never seen a church that locked their doors when a politician was invited to speak. But then, I wouldn't want to be a part of their services either.
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 0
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