New Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, Why so High?

I am very curious why the prepub price of this work is placed so high along with the prepub for NIB. A different software company (not Abingdon) has released the NIDB for $299 regular price while your prepub price is $400. I had at first thought that your high prices might have been due to Abingdon but after seeing another 3rd party publisher release it at a more reasonable price I am not sure why Logos has not been able to offer some discount off retail pricing... It almost makes me think since this is not some radically conservative resource Logos has no real desire to release it.

-Dan

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George Somsel

I am very curious why the prepub price of this work is placed so high along with the prepub for NIB. A different software company (not Abingdon) has released the NIDB for $299 regular price while your prepub price is $400. I had at first thought that your high prices might have been due to Abingdon but after seeing another 3rd party publisher release it at a more reasonable price I am not sure why Logos has not been able to offer some discount off retail pricing... It almost makes me think since this is not some radically conservative resource Logos has no real desire to release it.

-Dan

According to Amazon the regular price is $400 and Amazon's price is $316.53. I imagine that the price was set by Cokesbury. I also imagine that the price will be the same after it comes off prepub.

tom

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/262969#Comment_262969

You can purchase the NIB in its old software format from anywhere $43.20 to $400.00.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263074#Comment_263074

We are not suppose to mention competitors but a "Oil" Tree named software company is offering the software version made for their system running on iPad-iPhone-Android-Blackberry for $299, regular retail price not a sale or discount. price. It is always possible Abingdon really doesn't want Logos to publish it but I can't see why their own software version is horrible, and they know it, even doing survey of their customers asking which Bible software you use.

-dan

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263213#Comment_263213

We are not suppose to mention competitors but a "Oil" Tree named software company is offering the software version made for their system running on iPad-iPhone-Android-Blackberry for $299, regular retail price not a sale or discount. price. It is always possible Abingdon really doesn't want Logos to publish it but I can't see why their own software version is horrible, and they know it, even doing survey of their customers asking which Bible software you use.

-dan

I believe the standard response from Logos on these questions is "we systematically tag all the pages in these resources to interact with Logos, which is why we charge a higher price". At least that's what they told me on a different Abingdon resource. (even though I did get it at a competitive rate during the meet and greet sale)

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263247#Comment_263247

Well that is all good I suppose, but they do that with ALL their items, and most have a discounted prepub price. I thought maybe Abingdon had forced them to have it at retail price, but then when someone else releases it at a lower price it makes no sense. I had heard several times that they would love to order the NIB and NIDB but that they were over priced. I just find it frustrating that these items are stalled out partially do to price, when others are releasing it cheaper. It never hurts to ask, I asked why Logos charged close to twice as much for talk thru the Bible as others were and now the lowered it to a competitive price. Admittedly I think I emailed Dan Prichettt to enquire, but I just feel that if these resources were offered at a better price we might see them in production rather than sitting in limbo.

-Dan

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263275#Comment_263275

Well that is all good I suppose, but they do that with ALL their items, and most have a discounted prepub price. I thought maybe Abingdon had forced them to have it at retail price, but then when someone else releases it at a lower price it makes no sense. I had heard several times that they would love to order the NIB and NIDB but that they were over priced. I just find it frustrating that these items are stalled out partially do to price, when others are releasing it cheaper. It never hurts to ask, I asked why Logos charged close to twice as much for talk thru the Bible as others were and now the lowered it to a competitive price. Admittedly I think I emailed Dan Prichettt to enquire, but I just feel that if these resources were offered at a better price we might see them in production rather than sitting in limbo.

-Dan

Go for it. I haven't had luck convincing them to lower the price before, but if you have pull I'm all for it!

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263277#Comment_263277

Well that is all good I suppose, but they do that with ALL their items, and most have a discounted prepub price. I thought maybe Abingdon had forced them to have it at retail price, but then when someone else releases it at a lower price it makes no sense. I had heard several times that they would love to order the NIB and NIDB but that they were over priced. I just find it frustrating that these items are stalled out partially do to price, when others are releasing it cheaper. It never hurts to ask, I asked why Logos charged close to twice as much for talk thru the Bible as others were and now the lowered it to a competitive price. Admittedly I think I emailed Dan Prichettt to enquire, but I just feel that if these resources were offered at a better price we might see them in production rather than sitting in limbo.

-Dan

Go for it. I haven't had luck convincing them to lower the price before, but if you have pull I'm all for it!

LOL [|-)] I have no pull but Logos likes to be competitive.

-Dan

Mike Childs

It almost makes me think since this is not some radically conservative resource Logos has no real desire to release it.

-Dan

Dan,

Do you honestly consider the Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary a "radically conservative resource." Logos carries it, and has frequently sold it at a discount. AYBD is generally considered a superior resource to NIDB. Both are excellent respected works by top scholars, and both are left of center. I don't think your theory holds water.

It is just that NIDB has little interest outside of Methodism. (By the way, I am a Methodist.)

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263283#Comment_263283

Anchor isn't radically conservative nor is Hermenia, but both of those series tend to be far more conservative than the New Interpreter's Series, I will admit the dictionary is not as in-depth as AYBD, but I enjoy it anyway, even though I am an Anglican. NIB has a very broad theological scope, and the fact that it has many controversial things to say may make it less palatable for Logos is what I meant. NIDB has articles on Gay Biblical interpretation, Lesbian Interpretation, Gender Studies, now even having articles like this puts the NIDB out of the comfort level of many evangelicals. This is by no means to suggest that NIB takes a uniform stance being pro or anti gay, each scholar handles texts the way they see fit, but is generally not overly dogmatic. I appreciate Logos offering us the ability to get these resources but I am wondering if they have put them at a high price to perhaps discourage it's production quietly.

-Dan

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263452#Comment_263452

I have to disagree. IMO, Logos offers products based on what it thinks it can sell, not bc of the employees' personal theology. The fact is, most consumers of Christian products tend to buy conservative products. Just take a look at any bookstore's shelves. If Logos had a ethical issue selling the NIDB, they just would not sell it. My guess is it's just not on their priority list. Hopefully they're learning that there's a niche selling more progressive products for Bible software, since nobody else worthwhile seems to do so.

Mike Aubrey

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263452#Comment_263452

I am wondering if they have put them at a high price to perhaps discourage it's production quietly.

Nope. That's not it. Definitely not it. This is 100% an issue of licensing from the publisher.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263475#Comment_263475

I am wondering if they have put them at a high price to perhaps discourage it's production quietly.

Nope. That's not it. Definitely not it. This is 100% an issue of licensing from the publisher.

Glad to hear it.. not sure why they played so hard with Logos and gave OT the ability to offer NIDB for less. Personally I can live without the Dictionary, but I still hope NIB makes it to Logos.

-Dan

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263452#Comment_263452

NIB has a very broad theological scope, and the fact that it has many controversial things to say may make it less palatable for Logos is what I meant. NIDB has articles on Gay Biblical interpretation, *** Interpretation, Gender Studies, now even having articles like this puts the NIDB out of the comfort level of many evangelicals.

Logos has already published resources that take a far more liberal view than NIB on controversial issues. There are books that read favorably towards same-sex relationships, modern gender roles, inclusiveness and whole collections on the emerging church & "reading into scripture" what we want it to say.

I doubt it is fear of controversy setting high prices.

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263620#Comment_263620

I doubt it is fear of controversy setting high prices.

If fear of controversy were a factor, why would they even offer it since that simple act raises controversy?

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263629#Comment_263629

Adding insult to the price Logos was forced to set, the other software company just put it on sale for $60 off..... it's 299 price.

-Dan

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263968#Comment_263968

Adding insult to the price Logos was forced to set, the other software company just put it on sale for $60 off..... it's 299 price.

-Dan

Isn't that the way life often goes?

Hopefully someday all publishers will realize lower prices mean more sales, no matter what the platform or format.

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/263980#Comment_263980

Adding insult to the price Logos was forced to set, the other software company just put it on sale for $60 off..... it's 299 price.

-Dan

That's frustrating. Seeing it for $239.99 in electronic format elsewhere just made me delete my pre-pub order on Logos. I'm not going to rush into a different software program since I'm already pretty far in with Logos, but no longer will I agree to pay $400 for this either. Even the cd-rom version of the NIDB is only $240 on Cokesbury's website. And the 12-volume commentary set? It's only $480. You can even get all 12 versions in hardback PLUS the cd-rom for $657 - straight from the publisher. I think I'll cancel my prepub on that one too. Is anyone at Logos reading this thread???

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/264000#Comment_264000

Is anyone at Logos reading this thread???

A better question to ask is, "Is anyone at Abingdon reading this thread?"

but no longer will I agree to pay $400 for this either. Even the cd-rom version of the NIDB is only $240 on Cokesbury's website. And the 12-volume commentary set? It's only $480. You can even get all 12 versions in hardback PLUS the cd-rom for $657 - straight from the publisher.

This ploy works very well in marketing. A seller (copyright holder in this case) offers their product at three different prices. They point out how expensive their retail outlet is so you will buy it from their discount outlet. That technique is called whip-sawing. The difference in price enables the copyright holder to make a profit off the software's superiority. Everyone knows Logos is a better platform than the Abingdon CD-Rom or nobody would be complaining about it. They would all just buy from Abingdon if all things were equal. But things are not equal. If you buy directly from Abingdon, you get the same content but lose out on the superiority of the Logos capabilities.

There are booksellers on eBay that charge $900 for a book that sells on Amazon for $32. They only need 10 buyers a week to gross half a million a year. What amazes me is they do sell 10 or more books each week! The mentality of price gouging on low volume sales is archaic but will continue as long as there are those who buy regardless of price.

Mike Childs

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/264021#Comment_264021

Am I just mistaken, or has the Abingdon / Logos relationship not gone as well as hoped.

Abingdon is practically giving away (under $30) their own format of NIDB, but they want $400 for the Logos version. Ouch! What are they trying to tell us?

I had hoped that more titles - especially the bicentennial edition of Wesley's Works would find its way to Logos format, but not so at least so far.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/265320#Comment_265320

Am I just mistaken, or has the Abingdon / Logos relationship not gone as well as hoped.

Abingdon is practically giving away (under $30) their own format of NIDB, but they want $400 for the Logos version. Ouch! What are they trying to tell us?

I had hoped that more titles - especially the bicentennial edition of Wesley's Works would find its way to Logos format, but not so at least so far.

Having received a free copy on CDROM with my Hard Copy Set, I would say $30 is about all their version is worth. The interface is slow and poor. You cannot annotate or high-lite anything, The citation generator is joke. I almost never use it because of these limitations. The only good thing I can say about it is that you do not need the cdrom in the drive to use it... I honestly don't think Abingdon has a clue what they are doing. I called the other day to inquire when their products would be getting out of a dead platform (folio views) and was only told we are working on it but no firm plans are in place. I certainly cannot be sure but the only people capable of doing it half decently would be Logos. I have inquired elsewhere and was always told 'we would like to have it but it would be too expensive to produce'. Which makes me think that until they decide to parter up with a company we will see nothing. If they hired logos to do it like other companies (ie IVP or Zondervan have done, they could be under production now rather than sitting in limbo with some manufacturer's suggested retail price, which no one pays even if one buys directly from them.

-dan

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/265320#Comment_265320

Am I just mistaken, or has the Abingdon / Logos relationship not gone as well as hoped.

Abingdon is practically giving away (under $30) their own format of NIDB, but they want $400 for the Logos version. Ouch! What are they trying to tell us?

I had hoped that more titles - especially the bicentennial edition of Wesley's Works would find its way to Logos format, but not so at least so far.

I'm not sure where you get the $30 price from. Cokesbury's website lists it for $240 and the print edition for $140. If you can find it for $30, I'd be interested! You may be looking at the New Interpreter's Study Bible, which is less than $30 on Cokesbury's website. And while I love that study Bible, it's not the NIDB.

Mike Childs

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266238#Comment_266238

I'm not sure where you get the $30 price from. Cokesbury's website lists it for $240 and the print edition for $140. If you can find it for $30, I'd be interested!

NIDB is currently "on sale" in their format for less than $30, but it is a terrible format. Check your store if you want it. I passed on it because of the format limitations. I have bought Wesley's Bicentenial Works in their format to use until a Logos version becomes available - if ever.

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266507#Comment_266507

It is currently "on sale" from Cokesbury in their format for less than $30, but it is a terrible format.

Could you provide a link? Because when I look at Cokesbury's website, all I see is a $140 pricetag for NIDB (which is still way lower than Logos, which I think demands a revisitation of the contract between Logos and Abingdon). The only thing I see for under $30 from the NI series is the study bible.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/265494#Comment_265494

I have the NIB CD-rom and it's the worst piece of software I've ever owned.

You would think that a company of Cokesbury's caliber would be interested in fixing this, but no, they don't seem to be.

So if I want to Logos version - which I do - it's yet another several hundred dollars.

Cokesbury really has no shame, as far as I'm concerned. As long as they sell the product, so what if it's lousy?

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266518#Comment_266518

I have the NIB CD-rom and it's the worst piece of software I've ever owned.

You would think that a company of Cokesbury's caliber would be interested in fixing this, but no, they don't seem to be.

So if I want to Logos version - which I do - it's yet another several hundred dollars.

Cokesbury really has no shame, as far as I'm concerned. As long as they sell the product, so what if it's lousy?

There is, of course, one other way of looking at this. Cokesbury/Abingdon realizes they are not in the software producing business and realizes that their current offering for the NIDB is lousy. So, they have deeply discounted that product, while at the same time licensing companies who are in the business of producing Bible study software (including Logos) to produce better formats. We pay more for NIDB on these other formats because of the work that goes into making the software more accessible. I still think Logos needs to renegotiate with Abingdon, but I expect to pay more than I do for lousy software from the publisher. But I think it's unfair to say Cokesbury has no shame when clearly they are working with other companies to get their products on quality platforms like Logos.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266509#Comment_266509

Because when I look at Cokesbury's website, all I see is a $140 pricetag for NIDB (which is still way lower than Logos, which I think demands a revisitation of the contract between Logos and Abingdon).

[:D] I agree! I nominate YOU to contact Abingdon and ask them to underwrite the Logos 4 development of the NIDB and sell it for the same $140 price tag. I imagine they will be polite to you. I also imagine they will chuckle after they hang up the phone. [;)] If it truly costs Abingdon $140 to produce their barely useful version, surely it costs more to create a useful Logos version. If it does not cost Abingdon $140 to produce their own version, where is the outcry against their "profiteering?" Are they not a ministry? How dare they profit? [6]

$400 for a Logos version of NIDB probably factors in $399 for perpetual support costs and $1 for the CD production. Abingdon sells you the $1 CD and provides what? for the other $139?

fwiw: I think the $400 price is too high for the NIDB ($140 for a Logos version seems fair.) I also thin $800 for the NIB is steep. But certain publishers (Zondervan comes to mind) have not yet been convinced they can make more money selling 1000 copies at $300 instead of 100 copies at $800. maybe that will change someday but until it does, Logos has their hands tied on many titles.

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266522#Comment_266522

I agree! I nominate YOU to contact Abingdon and ask them to underwrite the Logos 4 development of the NIDB and sell it for the same $140 price tag. I imagine they will be polite to you. I also imagine they will chuckle after they hang up the phone. If it truly costs Abingdon $140 to produce their barely useful version, surely it costs more to create a useful Logos version. If it does not cost Abingdon $140 to produce their own version, where is the outcry against their "profiteering?" Are they not a ministry? How dare they profit?

lol - I'm sure I'd have about as much pull with them as you give me credit for! I'm not suggesting Logos charge $140 for the NIDB - in fact I said I thought we should pay more for a higher quality product. However, $400 is too high IMO, given that at least one other competitor for Logos (and not Abingdon) offers the NIDB for a significantly lower price. It's still more than the publisher's format, but not $400.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266523#Comment_266523

However, $400 is too high

If I could only get one I would buy the Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary. I think it is the best regardless of the price and at $270 it is even better!

If money were growing on trees in my back yard, I would be on board for both the New Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible & the New Interpreter's Bible. I would even throw in all 53 volumes of the International Critical Commentary.

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266532#Comment_266532

If I could only get one I would buy the Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary. I think it is the best regardless of the price and at $270 it is even better!

Agreed. I picked that up during the Forum Week sale for really cheap, and am glad I did so. For now I'll stick with that and my hard-copy of the NIDB, and hope that Logos and Abingdon can find a way to make the electronic version more competitive.

Mike Childs

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266509#Comment_266509

Chris,
I was offered the price in the Cokesbury store on Friday. The clerk said it was on sale, and she would order it at the price of $28. I had been told it was on sale for that price for some time. I passed because of the poor format.

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266728#Comment_266728

Chris,
I was offered the price in the Cokesbury store on Friday. The clerk said it was on sale, and she would order it at the price of $28. I had been told it was on sale for that price for some time. I passed because of the poor format.

I believe you that the format sucks. But, based on the prices on their website, I'm led to think your clerk was looking at the wrong product. That is, of course, unless she has a copy and it's been in her store for over a year and she's putting it on clearance, which has been known to happen.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266535#Comment_266535

Agreed. I picked that up during the Forum Week sale for really cheap, and am glad I did so. For now I'll stick with that and my hard-copy of the NIDB, and hope that Logos and Abingdon can find a way to make the electronic version more competitive.

Likely the best thing but as long as it functions on the current Windows OS I don't have high hopes of them gracefully exiting the market with their own version.

-dan

Rev Chris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/267135#Comment_267135

Likely the best thing but as long as it functions on the current Windows OS I don't have high hopes of them gracefully exiting the market with their own version.

-dan

No, I doubt they'll remove their electronic version of the NIDB from product listings either. As long as people are buying copies, they will sell them. Personally I don't have a problem with them selling it - I just won't buy it because I'm committed to the Logos platform. But if it helps others in their ministry, then great. And when those people get to a point where they decide they want something more, Logos will be here to welcome them

Mike Childs

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/266809#Comment_266809

All who are interested in Abingdon products in Logos should continue to e-mail, write, and speak directly and politely to both Abingdon and Cokesbury encouraging them to continue to release books in the Logos format. When they come to our Annual Conference, I always thank them for what they released in Logos format and encourage them to release more - especially the Wesley's Works Bicentennial edition.