Internet connection needed for Logos4 ?

I have seen mentioned in another thread that "using Logos 4 offline might be painful" -- is this at all accurate?!?

I have been talking up Logos to missionaries and pastors overseas for the last several years, as it's PERFECT for those of us working in less-open areas. The ability to discreetly carry an entire Christian library with us means more than I can express. Frankly, Logos 3 has been one of the most important resources in my life and work over these last few years, it's just exploded what we're able to do -- I can't overestimate how much it's helped.

HOWEVER, the idea that "using Logos4 offline might be painful" raises *HUGE* red flags for me, and surely for others who already spend an inordinate amount of time dodging internet censorship and blocked internet access. We have pastors working with us who (apparently) have their internet traffic monitored by the authorities -- why would they want to use software that will either expose them even more (while online), or alternately offer only limited functionality when offline? I mean, for crying out loud, we can't even get GOOGLE sometimes...!!

I hope the need to be online in Logos 4 is being overstated -- I welcome more info on this aspect of the new version.

I mean, it makes sense that we need to be online for registration and updates. But if being online is required for what one would call "normal" or "standard" functionality of Logos 4, it's huge step BACKWARDS for many of us.

Of course, I'll hold off on any upgrades until I have more
understanding about this -- and please note that those who would
suggest I'm being melodramatic clearly have no idea what we're up
against.

THANKS, and I can't wait to hear more about this !! Smile

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Comments

Lynden O. Williams

Glen you can take comfort that Logos 4, is fully functional offline. As you stated, you need to go online for updates, etc.. I used it just last night on my computer when the internet was down. The only features that you will miss being ofline are getting sermons and powerpoint files, and topics.logos.com from the web.

But you have complete access to all of your books (resources) while offline.

Jacob Hantla

The only functionality that you lose being offline are the automatic updates, resource downloads, & syncing. You do have to go online to get your books (unless you also have v3 and install there first). Not painful at all to be offline.

Michael Hite

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34225#Comment_34225

There are a number of things Logos 4 does that uses the Internet - updates, registration, syncing licenses, etc... but you can work completely offline without issue. Again - you need to be online to get updates and for awhile that is going to be important as they implement new features. You can also sync preferences, layouts, collections and other items with an internet connection, but it is NOT a necessity.

Chris Elford

Glenn:

Let me share with you some of the things Bob said in discussion on this point during the beta process: (Believe me, we grilled him on this.)

A) We are NOT taking anything away from any Logos 3 user. We have
gone out of our way to ensure that Logos 4 and LDLS 3.x run side by
side. Logos 4 is the "new model", and future accessories (books) will
be designed for it, but we haven't disabled or removed anyone's use of
the old features. When they release the new car model with the iPod
connector and no tape deck they haven't "taken away" the tape deck from
people who had the old car. They're just offering a new car with
different features.

We've been clear about our intention to offer equivalent (really,
improved) versions of the "missing" LDLS 3 features; they just take
time to code. But nobody will have anything taken from them if we
release 4 without those features and add them (for free) in the coming
months. Statistics show that almost none of the features mentioned on
these forums as "missing" are used by more than 10% of our users. (A
different 10% for each feature, of course.) If you're affected, and
it's important to you, you can simply defer upgrading to 4 until the
feature is implemented. There isn't much difference between our
releasing now -- for the 90% who don't use the feature -- and you not
upgrading for three months, and us holding the product for three months
and then you buying it the day we release it. Either way the feature
doesn't arrive for three months. The only difference is psychological.

C) TODAY, Logos Bible Software 4 can run completely with no Internet
access. You can install it, upgrade it, and purchase books without
touching the Internet. (Though it may involve some traditional mail.)

D) In the future, Logos Bible Software is becoming a hybrid
online-offline application. Some of the features we have planned for
the future will require Internet access. Very few users have the hard
drive required to host http://books.logos.com,
which we'll be integrating more tightly. We have some plans
forincredibly power search capabilities that will require massive
amounts of memory, and which will probably be executed by making a web
service call to our servers where we can execute the query on a huge
in-memory database. We intend to preserve the ability to work offline
as much as possible, but some features simply require the Internet. It
isn't because we have some desire to "lock you in", it's simply a
requirement of the feature. Nobody gets upset that you can't use
YouTube or Hulu or GMail in a purely offline scenario. They are, by
definition, Internet applications.

E) We intentionally designed a high-end system for serious Bible
students using modern hardware and the Internet. We appreciate that
there are needs for Bible study software in the third world, but we
also know there are lots of good (and free) solutions available for
those markets. They don't require Internet access, don't use as much
machine power, etc. We are ensuring that "while you're off the grid"
Logos 4 still runs -- you CAN use it offline for weeks -- but it IS
designed "for the grid". If you need a permanently off-the-grid
solution, we recommend choosing something designed for that.

F) We have listened to your requests, and are doing everything we
can to accommodate them, within the design framework of the
application. So you now have control over updating and Internet access;
you can easily tell the application to not use the Internet, and you
can request updates at the time of your choosing. You can turn off auto
updating and update at the interval you or your IT department choose.

Then later in response to several responses to him on this:

You can run offline indefinitely. I was saying weeks just as an
example. After some weeks you might want to sync, or get an update,
etc. If you run on one machine and don't care about syncing, you can
run offline forever.

If you had to reinstall in a country with no Internet, you'd need to
get your license file emailed to you. If you had no Internet AND no
email, then you should get out of that country ASAP. :-)

Just kidding... you're probably there for missions, and I shouldn't
encourage you to leave. You'll need to get the license file and a media
disk mailed to you. (If you have a DVD-ROM with serial number, you can
install and it'll run for 45 days or so before you need the license
file.)

If you're going to be offline and without mail for a long time, you
should get an open source LInux based Bible software package and a
compiler. Then you never need the Internet and you can add features in
your spare time. :-)

Hope this helps you undersand what Logos is doing.

Chris

Matthew C Jones

I mean, it makes sense that we need to be online for registration and updates. But if being online is required for what one would call "normal" or "standard" functionality of Logos 4, it's huge step BACKWARDS for many of us.

I just posted (on that other thread) I hope Logos takes BOTH options in the future. A completely cloud-based application AND a stand-alone version that can be carried to the farthest (& furhtest) reaches of the world and used in underground ministries to proclaim the gospel. It is possible to do both. It is needful to do both.

Glenn Watts

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34236#Comment_34236

WOW, fast replies.... !!

THANKS for that info -- you guys have really set my mind at ease. [:D]

I suppose it sounds silly, but I almost get emotional when I talk about Logos to people, it's helped us *that* much. Now I can continue my fandom with impunity...

[:P]

Jacob Hantla

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34236#Comment_34236

What part of Logos4 couldn't work offline indefinitely after the initial install? The only problem I foresee is a loss of data if your computer crashes before syncing?

In my mind, one of the best features of Logos is the benefit for missionaries. Every missionary we send has at least Scholars. I've been out of the country for many months at a time recording indigenous language Bible translations for distribution on solar powered players for illiterate people groups, and Libronix was a lifesaver. The only book I needed to take was my computer.

If Logos is planning to shut these people out of having the possibility of using the software I have HUGE complaints. But I'm not seeing that that is the case with the current version (unless I'm missing something). And if Logos ever makes internet mandatory, because they would be cutting out missionaries Logos will lose one its biggest fans. But I don't think that'll be the case, particularly because Bob listens to the customer base, and the customer base is speaking loud and clear right now.

Rich DeRuiter

I have seen mentioned in another thread that "using Logos 4 offline might be painful" -- is this at all accurate?!?

No. It is completely inaccurate.

You will be able to use everything Logos was designed to do offline, except for those few, and isolated operations that explicitly require being online (syncing, updating, and upgrading). Every Bible-study function and every resource is available off-line, and works as well off-line as on-line. This is without question.

Reality Check: As a volunteer firefighter, I've seen my share of trauma. I know what pain is and what it looks and sounds like. To term some mere inconveniences as pain seems ridiculous. Or else, it tells us just how good we have it, and how sheltered we are, that something like that could be called 'painful,' in even a metaphorical way. (Somebody pass me the acetaminophen, I'm getting a headache.)

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34259#Comment_34259

Every time I read one of these threads I ask myself...what's the fuss???

Install Logos

Load books from CD

Load license by typing in.

Take an image of your drive as it is

Work offline until the cows come home and re-install Logos 100 times a year if you feel so inclined....

Seriously..what's the fuss about?

In my mind, if someone has an install thats THAT mission critical...I'd NEVER go without a full disk image of my Laptop...and one on CD as a back up....

I've been doing it for years....and it cost me 40.00 3 years ago....pretty cost effective and a full re-install of my whole C drive takes about 10 minutes.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34247#Comment_34247

What part of Logos4 couldn't work offline indefinitely after the initial install?

That nifty homepage, notes backup, bug-fixes, downloading new resources.

Nothing that would cripple the functionality of the installed siftware.

Damian McGrath

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34275#Comment_34275

nifty homepage

The home page works fine off line - even better because you don't get blog content

The only thing I miss is seeing Philip Spitzer's name because there are no reading lists

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34309#Comment_34309

The only thing I miss is seeing Philip Spitzer's name because there are no reading lists

So what you're telling me is this is a feature not a bug....[:D]

Damian McGrath

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34312#Comment_34312

The only thing I miss is seeing Philip Spitzer's name because there are no reading lists

So what you're telling me is this is a feature not a bug....

Well, considering I also missed Thomas on account of no blogs - I'd have to say "YES!!!"

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34314#Comment_34314

The only thing I miss is seeing Philip Spitzer's name because there are no reading lists

So what you're telling me is this is a feature not a bug....

Well, considering I also missed Thomas on account of no blogs - I'd have to say "YES!!!"

I called it a "nifty home page" tongue-in-cheek because at first I hated it (reminds me of Yahoo, facebook, MSN.) After I paid attention to the content, including reading lists, I warmed up to it. I can almost say I like it. [Y]

Damian McGrath

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34319#Comment_34319

I called it a "nifty home page" tongue-in-cheek because at first I hated it (reminds me of Yahoo, facebook, MSN.) After I paid attention to the content, including reading lists, I warmed up to it. I can almost say I like it.

It's come absolutely miles since its first incarnation. That was truly ugly.

I still keep all blog posts off for three reasons:

1. I read them through a dedicated reader

2. It's too bright and bubbly and I feel like I'm being pressured to buy something

3. I can't focus of Jesus if I have Thomas' image burnt onto my eyeballs.

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34336#Comment_34336

3. I can't focus of Jesus if I have Thomas' image burnt onto my eyeballs.

I've been thinking about starting a thread called "WARNING - This thread contains humorous banter." or something like that so that all thread Hijacking thoughts could be moved over to it. Statements like this are just too good to ignore. But my fear is that the poor Logos people have to weed through our junk and spend time on it instead of helping genuine concerns.

That being said, don't you mean "burnt onto my eyeball"

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34350#Comment_34350

I've been thinking about starting a thread called "WARNING - This thread contains humorous banter." or something like that so that all thread Hijacking thoughts could be moved over to it. Statements like this are just too good to ignore. But my fear is that the poor Logos people have to weed through our junk and spend time on it instead of helping genuine concerns.

And this coming from a guy who's avatar was grizzly bear just a few minutes ago?? And only for a few hours as that grrizzly bear!

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34336#Comment_34336

3. I can't focus of Jesus if I have Thomas' image burnt onto my eyeballs.

HA HA HA.

Focus Damian, Focus.

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34358#Comment_34358

And this coming from a guy who's avatar was grizzly bear just a few minutes ago?? And only for a few hours as that grrizzly bear!

It makes me happy that people pay so much attention....very happy....very very happy....so you know what my Avatar has to be know don't you?

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34365#Comment_34365

Philip, I cant believe it. I looked at your avatar and sprayed my keyboard again. Second time in just a few minutes.

Gotta go get me some paper towels and a bib....

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/34373#Comment_34373

Philip, I cant believe it. I looked at your avatar and sprayed my keyboard again. Second time in just a few minutes.

Gotta go get me some paper towels and a bib....

Now THIS is why you need internet access. Try & keep up with Philip Spitzer's avatars.

He has morphed from a decent preacher-type, to grizzly bear, to a blurry sign, to a dog by the fire hydrant, all in one week.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/35084#Comment_35084

Matthew,

You must have missed the pink carebear.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/35093#Comment_35093

Matthew,

You must have missed the pink carebear.

I did, and I must say I am happy I missed it.

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/35084#Comment_35084

He has morphed from a decent preacher-type, to grizzly bear, to a blurry sign, to a dog by the fire hydrant, all in one week.

Its a personality conflict.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/35168#Comment_35168

He has morphed from a decent preacher-type, to grizzly bear, to a blurry sign, to a dog by the fire hydrant, all in one week.

Its a personality conflict.

What? Are you the dog or are you the hydrant?

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/35170#Comment_35170

What? Are you the dog or are you the hydrant?

Or am I what the dog left on the fire hydrant....I just can't decide...

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