BUG: Multiple BSL issues:

The frequency bar does not fill the width available in the column:

And apparently some concepts are not yet tagged (Notice: "faith" in Ephesians = 0):

And it seems some concepts seem to be partially tagged. I have to choose a different sense "imprisonment ⇔ chain" to get a hit in Philippians. While this makes some sense from a Greek language perspective, the search is being done in English! Also, I would expect that if I entered "chain" that the list would broaden to include the "chain and shackles" and "imprisonment ⇔ chain" types, but it does not.

Also, the problem of the BSL choosing the first item on the list on Enter persists -- even if the term occurs in the list. For example: if I type "faith" in the box, "faithfulness" is first in the list but "faith" is second. If I press the Enter key, the entry for "faithfulness" is displayed.

I note these two entries in the "Known Issues" section of the wiki for L5b4:

Data for Bible Sense Lexicon is incomplete.
The implementation of the Bible Sense Lexicon panel is incomplete.

Perhaps that is what I am seeing, but I want to make sure that you are dealing with all of the above issues (at least). As is, this is still not a usable tool - at least not for me.

EDIT - Specs: Win764 SR-1; Logos5 beta4; Program Scaling: 100%; Default Text Size: 140%; other settings don't seem relevant to these issues. If there's anything else you'd like to know, ask.

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Comments

Rich DeRuiter

Bump: at least for the first issue.

Dave Hooton

And apparently some concepts are not yet tagged (Notice: "faith" in Ephesians = 0):

Notice faith in Habakkuk!

Sean Boisen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/408908#Comment_408908

We're still working to get all "the same" senses together across languages. In this case, "trust" is probably closer the sense you were looking for.

If you start from the Exegetical Guide or the interlinear ribbon, you can see the sense a particular instance in the text is annotated with. So Eph 1:15 has both the sense "trust in the gospel" and also "trust" (meaning we couldn't decide between these two distinct senses). There also appears to be an annotation problem here that i've reported: only pistis has both senses.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409337#Comment_409337

We're still working to get all "the same" senses together across languages. In this case, "trust" is probably closer the sense you were looking for.

Actually I was just testing the BSL, and I wasn't looking for a particular sense. I was hoping that both major ways "pisits" is translated in most English Bibles were included: faith & faithfulness, but I assumed this was approaching concept from the English language side of things.

BTW, I didn't know the "sense" field was available in the interlinear ribbon. It appears to be unselected by default - or at least given my selections (Surface, MSS, Morph, Louw) it wasn't added.

While I'm here, let me challenge the placement of "trust" as the sense in Gal. 5:22. BDAG gives "faithfulness, reliability, fidelity, commitment" as the primary meaning for "pistis" and includes Gal.5:22 in the example uses of this meaning. -- Maybe you're still getting to this.

BTW, no one has yet addressed the UI issue in the first of 3 issues I have with the BSL. Notice what I'm seeing in the left column for "trust." Notice how the graph only occupies about half of the column.

Bob Pritchett

The frequency bar does not fill the width available in the column:

I'm pretty sure we're using a fixed width for each book of the Bible, here and in the Exegetical Guide where we use a similar graph, and we aren't intending it to fill available width, but rather to use "x" pixels per book.

Sean Boisen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409385#Comment_409385

We're still working to get all "the same" senses together across languages. In this case, "trust" is probably closer the sense you were looking for.

Actually I was just testing the BSL, and I wasn't looking for a particular sense. I was hoping that both major ways "pisits" is translated in most English Bibles were included: faith & faithfulness, but I assumed this was approaching concept from the English language side of things.

If you want to see the different senses for a specific word, you can use the 'g:' or 'h:' prefix. For example, g:pistis shows you 6 different senses for this lemma.

BTW, I didn't know the "sense" field was available in the interlinear
ribbon. It appears to be unselected by default - or at least given my
selections (Surface, MSS, Morph, Louw) it wasn't added.

I agree that it ought to be selected by default.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409415#Comment_409415

The frequency bar does not fill the width available in the column:

I'm pretty sure we're using a fixed width for each book of the Bible, here and in the Exegetical Guide where we use a similar graph, and we aren't intending it to fill available width, but rather to use "x" pixels per book.

This had me investigating a bit. I realized that since I'm using the NIV as my default Bible, and there is not OT RI yet, some results (which point to the OT only) result in 0 hits - as in the above search for "faith." So, a part of the UI issue is simply that the NIV doesn't have an OT RI. When I choose a default Bible with an OT & NT RI, the graph appears to fill the column width, even when there are no hits in one of the Testaments.

A related issue: if I choose the sense field from the ESV (for example in Genesis 5:5 choosing the sense "posterity ⇔ seed"), I get 0 hits and hovering the bar graph only shows from Matthew through Revelation. The BSL seems to be taking its data from the RI of the default Bible only - and if there is no data present (e.g., no OT RI), it reports 0 results. I do notice that the Exegetical Guide run on an OT passage will take data from my next highest prioritized Bible with an OT RI (in my case the NRSV) when there is no OT RI present in the default Bible.

Is this intended behavior, or should the BSL behavior parallel the Exegetical Guide behavior when an RI is not present in the default Bible? If my vote counts, I would vote for the BSL to parallel the behavior of the Exegetical Guide in these circumstances.

Jeremy Thompson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409534#Comment_409534

In the case of the OT tagging, NASB and ESV translate "faith" very few times for noun forms (NASB only 2x and once in Psalm 146:6 I think is questionable). Certainly senses are not glosses, but I wouldn't expect to see much more faith in the OT until we tag verbs [:)].

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409590#Comment_409590

In the case of the OT tagging, NASB and ESV translate "faith" very few times for noun forms (NASB only 2x and once in Psalm 146:6 I think is questionable). Certainly senses are not glosses, but I wouldn't expect to see much more faith in the OT until we tag verbs .

I do understand that the database is still a work in progress, that's
not my latest issue though (at least not the issue to which you
"replied").

My latest issue to report is how the BSL functions when an
OT RI is not present in the preferred Bible: There is no way, at
present, to get results for OT terms (at least in the graph bar), if
one's preferred Bible has an RI for the NT, but not the OT -- one has to change one's preferred Bible to see those results.

Here's my investigation results so far:

The BSL does not return results for the OT at all, if the default Bible has a NT RI, but not an OT RI (e.g. NIV84/11).
If one sets a Bible with both an OT & NT RI (e.g., NRSV) results display as expected.
If you set a Bible without an RI (e.g., NET) at all as your preferred Bible, and a Bible with both OT & NT RI (e.g., NRSV) as your second prioritized Bible, results display as expected.
If you set a Bible without an RI at all (e.g., NET) as your preferred Bible, and a Bible with a NT RI but not an OT RI (e.g. NIV84/11) as your second prioritized Bible, there will be no returns for OT terms.

This is not desired behavior, IMHO.

I think this shows a missing feature/function in the BSL that is found in the Exegetical Guide.

Jeremy Thompson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409605#Comment_409605

Sorry. I should've replied to something higher in the thread. Just getting started posting in the forums.

Lynden O. Williams

I do not see this in L5. I go to tools, and it does not exist.

Welcome to the forum Jeremy

Lynden O. Williams

Found it under Bible facts.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409668#Comment_409668

I do not see this in L5. I go to tools, and it does not exist.

You should see this:

If not, can you post a screen shot of what you do see?

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409680#Comment_409680

Here is what I see.

Chris Robbers

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409694#Comment_409694

Here is what I see.

This is due to the issue Bradley posted here. Our new MVPs are being affected by this issue but we are working to resolve it. Thanks for your patience.

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409709#Comment_409709

Thanks Chris.

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409710#Comment_409710

Situation resolved.

Brisa Davis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/409605#Comment_409605

My latest issue to report is how the BSL functions when an
OT RI is not present in the preferred Bible: There is no way, at
present, to get results for OT terms (at least in the graph bar), if
one's preferred Bible has an RI for the NT, but not the OT -- one has to change one's preferred Bible to see those results.

This issue should be resolved in 5.0a Beta 2.

This bug was also reported here: http://community.logos.com/forums/p/58253/417915.aspx#417915