For the Nth time: the crossgrade option will be coming but isn't here yet.

A lot of people aren't real happy about the upgrade costs, new collection designations, and the money they'd have to spend to use all of the L5 functionality they had in L4.

Don't panic and don't throw Logos under the bus!

There will be a free engine and minimal crossgrade coming!

We don't know when. We don't know pricing. We don't know how it will calculate features.

Be patient. I'm waiting too. I won't upgrade until I see all my options, including the minimal crossgrade. Maybe you're in the same situation I am. If so, wait. Patience is usually worth it.

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Donnie Hale

There will be a free engine and minimal crossgrade coming!

We don't know when. We don't know pricing. We don't know how it will calculate features.

Be patient. I'm waiting too. I won't upgrade until I see all my options, including the minimal crossgrade. Maybe you're in the same situation I am. If so, wait. Patience is usually worth it.

I think we all understand that - I certainly do. The issue is on what basis Logos doesn't offer an upgrade path that they know they are going to eventually offer right out of the gate. It's inexplicable, presumptuous, and to my mind at least somewhat arrogant. As I posted to Dan Pritchett in another thread, I'd love to hear a rational explanation.

Part of the frustration is the fact that the web site is completely unusable right now. Numerous "Internal Server Error" pages on my iPad and now just spinning in Firefox and Chrome on my laptop. I can't even figure out what resources I'd get at the lowest possible "upgrade" I could do now because I can't get to the /upgrade page or any product details pages.

Donnie

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413019#Comment_413019

As I posted to Dan Pritchett in another thread, I'd love to hear a rational explanation.

I responded to your post there with some rational guesses.

Part of the frustration is the fact that the web site is completely unusable right now. . .

The site is quite usable for me. Maybe it's your connection, or maybe I just happen to be connected to a better server. As you can probably guess, the servers are being heavily used right now. Slowdowns are not to be unexpected.

I recommend patience.

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413019#Comment_413019

Please see Logos Frequently Asked questions for further details. http://www.logos.com/faq

Rich DeRuiter

Bump.

Just keeping this thread up front for folks to see.

Russ White

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413739#Comment_413739

I upgraded --but not for the books. There weren't any on the list I wanted, to be honest. I only upgraded for the tools. But I must say that $500 to "crossgrade," was a lot of money just to grab some tools, and a new engine.

I've spent well over $25k with Logos in the last several years, run a Logos users group, and have been trying to convince the seminary I attend and support to convert to a Logos school. And I understand Logos is a business, at bottom, not a ministry (as so many on this forum seem to think).

But, when Logos does something like this --when I must go tell my friends who I've convinced to run Logos that they must spend hundreds, if not thousands of dollars to get a tool set that will make them more effective at what they do for a living, which is preaching the Scriptures-- then it's a hard sell to make.

Trying to upsell me on resources is one thing. Forcing me to buy resources that I don't want so I can get to tools I do want --I don't see any way to justify this sort of thing.

IMHO, Logos is pricing themselves out of the market.

Russ

Russ White

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413812#Comment_413812

BTW, one more point to make --this entire idea of selling access to tools is going to be a big problem for Logos in the long run. The story I've always told people, to "start small and build over time," no longer works. You must buy a package, with all that goes with buying that package, to access the tools.

There's now a permanent difference between Gold and everything below.

That's a bad thing. The least Logos could do is offer a minimal book upgrade with the tools, rather than restricting the new tools to only higher level packages.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413812#Comment_413812

But I must say that $500 to "crossgrade," was a lot of money just to grab some tools, and a new engine.

This was not the crossgrade we are talking about. The crossgrade gets you the new databases (depending on current base package), but no resources. You upgraded to a new base package.

NOTE: the names of the base packages, while the same as the names for L4 base packages, are not equivalent to L4 base packages.

Johan L

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413821#Comment_413821

Has there been any official information about the crossgrade yet? Could anyone a link to the post/page? I've looked around a bit and encountered a lot of people saying there will be one, but so far I've not seen any statement by someone working for Logos.

Robert J Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413821#Comment_413821

"NOTE: the names of the base packages, while the same as the names for L4 base packages, are not equivalent to L4 base packages."

And how are we to actually know that? They took down the L4 comparison chart. Or is this another of your guesses?

I am an L4 Portfolio user. They want $1,600+ for the upgrade and I can not tell from the chart that is posted what I would be getting that is new. There is no way I can see to discern what resources are new. And no list of features either.

I agree that Logos has handled this roll out poorly. I thought the L4 roll out was a mess, but congrats to Logos for topping themselves.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413894#Comment_413894

Hi Robert

They want $1,600+ for the upgrade and I can not tell from the chart that is posted what I would be getting that is new. There is no way I can see to discern what resources are new. And no list of features either.

I don't understand this.

On the upgrade calculator page there should be options called "New to 5" and "New to you". If you click these they filter the information provided accordingly.

There are also icons in the first column of the display indicating this status.

I'm not saying it is totally clear but the information you are looking for should be present.

Features are at the bottom of the comparison list

Graham

Thornell

When do you suppose they will make available the "cross grade"?

I just "upgraded" from a the Scholars Silver to the Platunim package, fresh out of resources for another upgrade.

Mike Binks

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413920#Comment_413920

When do you suppose they will make available the "cross grade"?

I just "upgraded" from a the Scholars Silver to the Platunim package, fresh out of resources for another upgrade.

Don't forget Logos' 30 day return offer.

If you think that your money would have been better spent on an L5 package ask for a refund and repurchase what you really want.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413880#Comment_413880

Has there been any official information about the crossgrade yet? Could anyone a link to the post/page?

http://www.logos.com/faq

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413920#Comment_413920

When do you suppose they will make available the "cross grade"?

Nobody outside of Logos knows for certain. Though it is considered that it will be late December or shortly after.

Bill Gordon

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413812#Comment_413812

Russ, I agree with you 100%. I currently have 6,610 sources in my Logos library. I have been spending between $100-$200 each month on new books. I am trying to decide if I want to cancel all of my future orders. They total up to $4240.59. I am seriously considering never buying another Logos book!

Donnie Hale

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413956#Comment_413956

Nobody outside of Logos knows for certain. Though it is considered that it will be late December or shortly after.

I just got off the phone with a sales rep. He told me that all of the sales staff has been told that there will *not* be a minimal crossgrade option at any time. And they have been telling customers that for the last 2 days.

I told him Bob, Dan, and others on the forums have seemed to state otherwise. To him, that was "emergency news" that needed to be passed along to the rest of the sales staff.

More from the "poor communication" department...

Donnie

Johan L

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/413946#Comment_413946

http://www.logos.com/faq

Maybe I'm just being blind, but I could not find it on this page, could you point me to the correct section?

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/414047#Comment_414047

Maybe I'm just being blind, but I could not find it on this page, could you point me to the correct section?

I just went and looked too. It looks like the reference to the minimal crossgrade was removed (it was there last night).

However Bob just posted here that the free engine is coming. I trust that the minimal crossgrade will also come at the same time, or before.

I wish there was a clearer statement from Logos that I could point you to. Maybe someone else has something.

Johan L

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/414081#Comment_414081

I just went and looked too. It looks like the reference to the minimal crossgrade was removed (it was there last night).

However Bob just posted here that the free engine is coming. I trust that the minimal crossgrade will also come at the same time, or before.

I wish there was a clearer statement from Logos that I could point you to. Maybe someone else has something.

Thanks for taking the time Richard. This was what I feared. I still hope there will be an option for this. I guess I just have to wait and see.

BTW: The best info I've found regarding the free engine is at this page under "Step 1..."

"Note: If you already have Logos 4, there is no need to uninstall. Logos 5 will upgrade your existing Logos 4 installation automatically."

Michael Sullivan

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/414081#Comment_414081

I do not work for logos so I have no clue whether or not the following is what they intend to do:

However: I noticed that each database has a price. I wonder - and this is pure speculation on my part - if the upgrade engine will be free, but that a person will have to pay for each database "a la carte" to make their own "cross grade" package.

Could this be the reason there is no mention of the "cross grade," but that the "free engine" is mentioned (but not offered?)

Just wondering. . .

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/414106#Comment_414106

Hi Michael

However: I noticed that each database has a price.

Sorry but the datasets will not be available individually. Logos will be changing this on their website

See http://community.logos.com/forums/p/58026/414094.aspx#414094 for a statement regarding this from a Logos employee

Graham