Is the future of Logos to be 100% online?

Or will there always be an option to download and install software?

Playing with Chrome OS which is basically 100% online seems to be the future so I was wondering if Logos sees a future where all of their data sets and search capabilities being online.

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Lynden O. Williams

Would have to do some searching, but from my memory, there will always be the option to store most of your content for offline viewing.

Some aspects of the software massive databases, may need connectivity. Presently, the sermons online, and other multimedia material require online access.

Rich DeRuiter

Or will there always be an option to download and install software?

Playing with Chrome OS which is basically 100% online seems to be the future so I was wondering if Logos sees a future where all of their data sets and search capabilities being online.

This discussion comes up from time to time.Sometimes with a great deal of fear that this might happen, or in your case, with a hope that it will happen.

Biblia.com (a Logos run web site) already has some capabilities that Logos has (and syncs some data with your Logos installation), if you haven't played around there, you might find it enjoyable - limited as it is. Logos for iOS and Android also offer completely on-line uses of your Logos library, but also have limited tools.

As to the future of computing, and if it's all going to 'the cloud,' all I can say is that both MS and Google have heavily invested in technologies that they thought would be the future, promoted them as such, and then abandoned them just a few years later. Which is to say, anyone who thinks they know something about the future of computing is deluded or selling something.

Personally, I don't see Logos going this direction any time soon, but I'd be surprised if they hadn't talked about it and discusses how it might work. They're too innovative a company not to think along these lines. But for now, the technology available to them and to most users doesn't yet allow for such an experience to be on a par with a desktop application. If you can imagine tens of thousands of users running complex searches at the same time, you might begin to imagine the sort of server power required to yield results that didn't take minutes. Logos would have to buy/lease servers or server time that would begin to rival Google to get the job done. At this point, a user by user implementation seems the most efficient way of yielding a product that does what we users want. (This is all IMHO, of course. I don't have any inside information on how Logos is actually thinking about this.)

Xegesis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503372#Comment_503372

I actually don't desire it to be 100% online. I can see the frustration of wanting to use the software but the internet at my home being down. I'm not a Pastor but I can imagine the panic of Pastors needing the software but the internet is down. I always hope there is an option for it to be offline.

Russ White

We have this discussion from time to time... And people here know I'm pretty opposed to Logos going "all cloud." But let me approach the problem from another angle, to see if it helps. I know what MS and Google say. I also know a bit about the world of computer networks:

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/russ-white/0/471/a44
http://www.amazon.com/Russ-White/e/B001IYVAHY/ref=ntt_athr_dp_pel_1

The cloud makes a few basic assumptions:

1. The network is free
2. The network is 100% reliable
3. Delay and jitter don't exist (or don't matter)
4. Compute and storage always cost less when they are centralized
5. Security and privacy are either solved, or don't matter

None of these assumptions are true in the real world. The network is not free, and won't ever be. There are times when remote compute and storage are cheaper, and there are times when local computer and storage are cheaper. The network is never 100% reliable (regardless of my many attempts to make it so). Security and privacy are not solved (and I suspect we are just on the leading edge of a backlash in this area), and they can't be "solved" in the "cloud context" --ever.

So, in answer to your question --I hope Logos is smart enough to use the cloud where it makes sense, which means using it for streaming media, software updates, synchronizing things, etc. The day Logos moves into a fully cloud based world, with no local software, is the day I stop using Logos, because it's also the day Logos seals its own fate as a company. If Logos goes fully cloud, then the next time the pendulum swings against centralization (which is a matter of when, not if), then Logos, as a company, will be crushed against the pendulum. Since I have over $40k invested in Logos software, I'm not fond of Logos dying.

I appreciate how Logos is using the cloud. I do wish Logos would care more about privacy, and I hope Logos is smart enough to see where the cloud makes sense and where it doesn't (sometimes I wonder on this point). I wish Logos would give me more integration options, rather than pushing me into their cloud backend service for the information I keep surrounding my study of the Scriptures. I refuse to be pushed, and therefore I pay unnecessary costs in complexity and time.

To return to your question ---I don't think Logos will ever be "fully cloud." In fact, I hope they don't, because I value the investment I have in Logos products, and I don't think "cloud," is the "end all, be all," solution to every IT problem in the world.

Russ

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503391#Comment_503391

All great points from Russ, as usual.

We 'finally' unloaded our unlimited-data ISP in favor of our cellular hotspot. The ISP was unaware their email server had been hacked, an expanded cellular was cheaper (we travel), and we now have a bigger budget (less Logos) and more family time (less internet waste).

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503409#Comment_503409

As in the past I'm with Russ on this.

Lee

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503391#Comment_503391

I appreciate how Logos is using the cloud. I do wish Logos would care more about privacy, and I hope Logos is smart enough to see where the cloud makes sense and where it doesn't (sometimes I wonder on this point). I wish Logos would give me more integration options, rather than pushing me into their cloud backend service for the information I keep surrounding my study of the Scriptures.

Nothing to say to that except [Y], [Y] and [Y]!

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503603#Comment_503603

I think a lot of us will say "Adios, muchachos" if Logos ever goes all cloud. Of course, I should always have what I now (and in the forseeable future) have so I could simply go offline.

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/503372#Comment_503372

Or will there always be an option to download and install software?

Playing with Chrome OS which is basically 100% online seems to be the future so I was wondering if Logos sees a future where all of their data sets and search capabilities being online.

This discussion comes up from time to time.Sometimes with a great deal of fear that this might happen, or in your case, with a hope that it will happen.

Biblia.com (a Logos run web site) already has some capabilities that Logos has (and syncs some data with your Logos installation), if you haven't played around there, you might find it enjoyable - limited as it is. Logos for iOS and Android also offer completely on-line uses of your Logos library, but also have limited tools.

As to the future of computing, and if it's all going to 'the cloud,' all I can say is that both MS and Google have heavily invested in technologies that they thought would be the future, promoted them as such, and then abandoned them just a few years later. Which is to say, anyone who thinks they know something about the future of computing is deluded or selling something.

Personally, I don't see Logos going this direction any time soon, but I'd be surprised if they hadn't talked about it and discusses how it might work. They're too innovative a company not to think along these lines. But for now, the technology available to them and to most users doesn't yet allow for such an experience to be on a par with a desktop application. If you can imagine tens of thousands of users running complex searches at the same time, you might begin to imagine the sort of server power required to yield results that didn't take minutes. Logos would have to buy/lease servers or server time that would begin to rival Google to get the job done. At this point, a user by user implementation seems the most efficient way of yielding a product that does what we users want. (This is all IMHO, of course. I don't have any inside information on how Logos is actually thinking about this.)

Firstly I checked out your linked in, and you have an impressive list of accomplishments. Not the least of which is working for Shepherds Theological Seminary. A seminary I heavily considered when praying for direction RE Seminary. I have a lot of respect for Stephen Davey, and appreciate his ministry.

Secondly, as you say, for the foreseeable future cloud based tech isn't where it would need to be to implement such a scheme.

It may be one day. But unless and until Logos can guarantee my ISP won't have a hiccup in a clutch moment, I wouldn't want to make the switch.

IF they housed the servers in-house - as do google et al - then they would still be using a tremendous amount of bandwidth each month. Climate control on a server farm is also incredibly expensive.

I worked for a web host for a while.... They kept the server room at 70f, which kept the air-conditioners running most all the time. in addition they had box fans duct taped to problem children.

Being here in florida, during summer it was a struggle to keep it at the proper temp.

Logos currently uses Amazon for their cloud distribution paradigm, and while pretty reliable, they have had some significant down times (seems like they were down over christmas, or easter, something like that - for a day or so). Plus I suspect the cost goes up with the complexity and volumes of the requests it recieves?. Which means that as logos web capabilities increase, the overhead increases without any additional increase in profit. For business reasons alone, I think this is unlikely using cloud tech as we know it.

Perhaps they will offer a subscription service for those using web only devices.

However, our brothers and sisters in creative access countries would not safely be able to use such a product. For their sake alone, I hope they do not use a cloud /only/ model.

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/504019#Comment_504019

I worked for a web host for a while.... They kept the server room at 70f, which kept the air-conditioners running most all the time. in addition they had box fans duct taped to problem children.

Being here in florida, during summer it was a struggle to keep it at the proper temp.

Which is why Facebook opened a huge new server hall in northern Sweden last month. Much cheaper.[:)]

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/504059#Comment_504059

I worked for a web host for a while.... They kept the server room at 70f, which kept the air-conditioners running most all the time. in addition they had box fans duct taped to problem children.

Being here in florida, during summer it was a struggle to keep it at the proper temp.

Which is why Facebook opened a huge new server hall in northern Sweden last month. Much cheaper.

Yes, I would suggest placing server farms in Barrow, Alaska. [;)]