http://reviews.cnet.com/tablets/microsoft-surface-pro-2/4505-3126_7-35827901.html
I reviewed this article above and was surprised to see the cost has not dropped.
Why they seem to be wasting so much energy on a new kickstand is beyond me.
Disappointed,
Joshua
Haswell processor, better keyboard, extended battery life.... I dunno. Looks pretty sweet to me.
The fact that everyone seems to salivating over the new kickstand is humorous to me.Overpriced still.
MS Surface Pro 2 Specs:Windows 8.1 Pro with one-month trial for new Microsoft Office 365 customers10.81" x 6.81" x 0.53", 2 lbsVaporMg casing, Dark Titanium colorStorage 64 GB, 128 GB, 256 GB, 512 GBDisplay 10.6" ClearType Full HD display, 1920 x 1080p, 16:9 (widescreen)10-point multitouchPen input and pen (included with purchase)Pen digitizer features 1,024 levels of pressure sensitivityCPU Fourth-generation Intel Core i5-4200U (1.6 GHz with Intel Turbo Boost up to 2.6 GHz) with Intel HD Graphics 44004 GB or 8 GB of RAM -- dual-channel LPDDR3 TPM 1.2 (Trusted Platform Module - for Bitlocker Encryption)Wi-Fi (802.11a/b/g/n), Bluetooth 4.0 low energy technologyBattery 42 W-h. 48W charger (including 5W USB for accessory charging)Cameras and A/V 720p HD front- and rear-facing cameras Stereo speakers with enhanced signal processingPorts: Full-size USB 3.0, MicroSDXC card slot, Headset jack, Mini DisplayPort, Cover portSensors: Ambient light sensor, Accelerometer, Gyroscope, MagnetometerMS Surface 2 Specs:10.81" x 6.79" x 0.35" Less than 1.49 lbs VaporMg- Magnesium (Silver)32 GB; 64 GB storage10.6" ClearType Full HD display, 1920 x 1080p, 16:9 (widescreen)5-point multitouchNVIDIA Tegra 4 (T40) 1.7GHz quad core 2 GB of RAMWi-Fi (802.11a/b/g/n), Bluetooth 4.0 low energy technologyUp to 10 hours of video playback, 7-15 days idle life3.5MP front-facing camera, 5MP rear-facing camera with 1080p video captureStereo speakers (digitally enhanced for fuller sound) Two microphones (with noise cancellation)Ports: Full-size USB 3.0, MicroSDXC card reader , Headset jack, HD video out port, Cover portSensors: Ambient light sensor, Accelerometer, Gyroscope, Magnetometer
As this is a Logos forum (surprise) I wonder if anyone in development will re-examine RT now or if they will revamp their Windows support for this new hardware in any way?
An announcement from a hardware company doesn't mean anyone will actually buy the said hardware.
Surface Pro 2 looks very impressive to me. It seems to have all it needs to run Logos 5 on a tablet, and that is exciting. In fact, I would gladly dump my iPad for it.
Of course, that is just me.
As this is a Logos forum (surprise) I wonder if anyone in development will re-examine RT now or if they will revamp their Windows support for this new hardware in any way? An announcement from a hardware company doesn't mean anyone will actually buy the said hardware.
I really question that Windows RT will ever sale, but the Surface Pro 2 is another story. I am sure excited about a table that can run Logos 5 well.
I really question that Windows RT will ever sale, but the Surface Pro 2 is another story.
I agree that the SP2 is looking better... but people still have to buy it. Windows users are used to "cheap" and the SP2 isn't.
Ah yes, the old 'cheap' argument. As a Windows user and an Android user (with a Macbook Air and an iPad), i do think there is a difference between products being available to different segments of the market, and the connotation that any company that wishes to play in all segments of the market is 'cheap'.
I really question that Windows RT will ever sale, but the Surface Pro 2 is another story. I agree that the SP2 is looking better... but people still have to buy it. Windows users are used to "cheap" and the SP2 isn't.
i do think there is a difference between products being available to different segments of the market, and the connotation that any company that wishes to play in all segments of the market is 'cheap'.
My comments weren't directed at the manufacturers. They were directed at the consumers. Apple owns the high end market for desktops, laptops, tablets, and smart phones. They not only sell more devices, but they make more money per device than their competitors. The funny thing? Apple has been known to get credit for being the best WINDOWS computer available. [:P]
i do think there is a difference between products being available to different segments of the market, and the connotation that any company that wishes to play in all segments of the market is 'cheap'. My comments weren't directed at the manufacturers. They were directed at the consumers. Apple owns the high end market for desktops, laptops, tablets, and smart phones. They not only sell more devices, but they make more money per device than their competitors. The funny thing? Apple has been known to get credit for being the best WINDOWS computer available.
My comments weren't directed at the manufacturers. They were directed at the consumers. Apple owns the high end market for desktops, laptops, tablets, and smart phones. They not only sell more devices, but they make more money per device than their competitors. The funny thing? Apple has been known to get credit for being the best WINDOWS computer available.
-------------------------------- Unrelated to main comment------------------------------------------
That is where i disagree. I do agree that Macbooks are often better Windows computers than many other laptops apart from a few by Lenovo, Sony and Asus at the same price points.
Apple does own the high end market primarily because they choose not to compete in the lower end markets. That is a sales and marketing strategy and one that I give them credit for. However, they are not averse to going downmarket when their high end market is tapped out. Case in point, the iPad mini, the Macbook Air and to some extent the iPhone 5C. Notice that Apple does not split up sales between its higher end iPhone/Ipad and the lower one on opening weekend. Their marketing team has wisely ensured that the focus remains on the iPhone and the Ipad as one high-end entity till the Q4 results are out.
Owning the high end for desktops? I think the 50 million or so users on Steam would disagree with that, given that an average gaming desktop is in the vicinity of 800-1000 dollars if you build it yourself and more if you get it from a manufacturer or boutique. I am leaving out workstations and laptops focused on niche markets using technology like GPU-based computing and so forth.
Laptops? true in the US. The same for smartphones and tablets. but I find it amazing that Samsung can sell the S4 in the numbers it does (I have an HTC One which is a superior device in almost every respect) given that on-contract its price is the same as that of the iPhone.
Money per device? True. Does it matter? Apple makes next to nothing on iTunes and App store relatively. They use them to push hardware. It matters to developers on these platforms (with a big caveat, see below.) I find it amusing that this metric is taken as a matter of pride, as if the willingness to pay more automatically translates to a better consumer. See the threads in this forum complaining about NICOT prices [:P]
We have seen this story play out before. Apple and IBM. OS/2 and Windows. In the end, there will be an inflexion point when the number of users on other platforms becomes too hard for almost all developers to ignore. Amazon has already done this to some extent in the US with its Kindle fire tablets (22% of marketshare already). Already, the number of apps exclusive to iOS looks like the Mac days of the designer holding out to Quark Express on the Mac [:D]
At the end of the day, as a computer engineer, I like to see devices such as these being transformational. I love my iPad (atleast till iOS7 made it inexplicably slower and uglier in one shot) but do I see that being the next generation of transformational computing technology? Nope, because it wont be sold for Rs 2000 in India. Local engineers won't have access to the core OS to make it work in their local language. There is a platform that will do this though. Will I buy a cheap tablet like that for myself? Nope, but that does not stop me from wishing such manufacturers all the luck in the world.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Back to the main point, there are cheap Windows and Android consumers, there are mid-end Windows and Android consumers, and there are high end Windows and Android consumers. Equally, all these categories are found in the Apple folk too, especially in the US and Canada where most people buy phones on contract. Do not believe me? Take a look at the top free and paid apps on the Apple Store. How many $5, $10, $20 apps do you see there. Perhaps more people buy 99 cent apps on iOS than other platforms, which is probably a true assumption. Hardly the definition of a well-heeled customer. (Funnily enough, I know many friends who have no data plan on their iPhone and religiously hunt for wi-fi everywhere)
For clarification: My comment wasn't intended to be derogatory, just an observation. I still don't see large numbers of windows users jumping on this new device. Rather, I see MSFT having to cut the already too thin price point as they did with last year's model. And as a friendly jab... Your "average gaming" price makes my point. The "average" gaming system is lower than the starting price of a Mac desktop. [:P] And as for the iOS App Store... You are right about apps being "cheap." What you failed to point out is that iOS users spend many more times on iOS apps than Android users do. Remember, .99 adds up much faster than .00 does. [;)]
FWIW - My "season of life" has changed so that I can't update my computers as frequently as I did in the past. I am hoping to update my hard drives to get some more life out of my systems until I can afford to spend the higher price points for my next iMac or MacBook.
For clarification: My comment wasn't intended to be derogatory, just an observation. I still don't see large numbers of windows users jumping on this new device. Rather, I see MSFT having to cut the already too thin price point as they did with last year's model. And as a friendly jab... Your "average gaming" price makes my point. The "average" gaming system is lower than the starting price of a Mac desktop. And as for the iOS App Store... You are right about apps being "cheap." What you failed to point out is that iOS users spend many more times on iOS apps than Android users do. Remember, .99 adds up much faster than .00 does. FWIW - My "season of life" has changed so that I can't update my computers as frequently as I did in the past. I am hoping to update my hard drives to get some more life out of my systems until I can afford to spend the higher price points for my next iMac or MacBook.
For clarification: My comment wasn't intended to be derogatory, just an observation. I still don't see large numbers of windows users jumping on this new device. Rather, I see MSFT having to cut the already too thin price point as they did with last year's model. And as a friendly jab... Your "average gaming" price makes my point. The "average" gaming system is lower than the starting price of a Mac desktop. And as for the iOS App Store... You are right about apps being "cheap." What you failed to point out is that iOS users spend many more times on iOS apps than Android users do. Remember, .99 adds up much faster than .00 does.
I didnt take it as derogatory at all. I admit I am rather 'cheap' in many ways lol.
One of the things I liked about my old Macbook circa 2008 was how easy it was to replace the hard drive though it absolutely murdered battery life. Sadly all manufacturers seem to going down a path where stuff like upgrading your RAM and HDD are impossible to do.
I do not have 1K to spare for any of the Surface Pro machines....RT is pointless...it wont run full Logos.
I confess Father God (and in front of all my fellow Christian post-ers)....I have spent way too much time/energy/hope on all of this.
Forgive me Lord. You never had or needed a SP2 either. Help me live, learn, and love more.
Amen.
Glory to God....Jesus Lead On! /Josh
The trouble is the typical Window's user likes feature rich applications, lots of multitasking and the ability to tinker with almost everything.
The typical Apple user wants something aesthetically pleasing, simple and works without any tinkering.
But when it comes to iOS Apple broke into a new class of user, the new consumer who largely stood on the computerise sidelines but just needed something to browse the Internet and draft email messages. Experienced users also found tablets a useful light and portable tool for the same use.
MS knows it cannot make "out of the box" Windows match iOS's battery life and simplicity, hence Windows RT. Trouble is, seasoned Window's users lambast it because it is too simple for them. To them, it is "crippled," even though it's not meant for them except in relatively limited situations, the same situations as we listed before.
MS has a marketing problem. On the one hand they want everything under the Windows brand but that sets a certain expectation. People expect Windows to be all things to most people, complex and flexible, suitable for light and heavy duty.
But Windows RT, like iOS isn't designed for heavy duty. And for experienced Windows users, that is a disappointment. No surprise then that it was heavily criticized by most writers, since most are experienced Windows users.
Unfortunately the target segment rely on said writers for advice and guidance.
Considering Surface Pro 2. I agree with Michael looks good option for Logos 5. It may be a little pricey, but I think compares more than favorably with iPad Air in terms of specs. Anyone been using Logos 5 on Surface Pro 2 care to comment on your experience?
Surface Pro 2 looks very impressive to me. It seems to have all it needs to run Logos 5 on a tablet, and that is exciting. In fact, I would gladly dump my iPad for it. Of course, that is just me.
Of course this is an opinion like all the others here, but the Surface RT in 32GB @ $449 is currently sold out on Microsoft's online store...link. It seems that those willing to post a review on the Microsoft site are very complimentary. The suite of built-in apps is very nice and well-rounded. If you use Microsoft Office as your primary productivity tool you have it installed here. As an iPad user and having used the mobile and web versions of both Apple and Microsoft office products, my opinion is that Microsoft is more mature, full featured. The Apple versions are nice, but using Microsoft Office at work and at home and at school makes my choice really simple.
I think there is a lot going for the upgraded Microsoft Surface products...hardware and software. Will it make a dent in the tablet market dominated by Apple and various Android products? Probably not.
When it comes to selecting my next tablet there is a lot more to consider than the first time around. Microsoft is making a good run at it.
[:)]
P.S. I realize everyone knows this already but I should have full disclosure ... I am biased in that I purchased a very modest Windows 8 HP laptop earlier in the year, spending a third less than many other options, and am extremely pleased with its stability and performance at home and at school.
I continue to be believe that when it comes to Logos and Tablets
RT = Really Terrible
For me if I go the Surface Pro 2 it will be the 256Gb model with 8GB Ram and Windows 8 Pro. Logos 5 is a little more graphics intensive than say Office so I wonder does this present any stumbling blocks when using Logos 5 on it.
I also will likely go with the Surface Pro 2 250 GB model with the 8 GB RAM. That should be quite adequate for running Logos.
As to the question my buddy from Alabama raised about whether the Surface Pro 2 will sell. I think that is being answered with a very certain "Yes!" They are selling so fast that Best Buy cannot keep them in the store. They will have them online one night and by morning be sold out. This is happening time and again. I know because I tried to buy one just the other day. It seems the 256 GB and the 500 GB models are the ones that are selling as fast as the stores get them, or as fast as they are posted online. You can buy them on ebay if you are willing to pay hundreds of dollars more than retail. I haven't seen any real sales numbers, so this is just my observation, not based on official data. But it is hard to get one because of demand.
I think Microsoft may have over estimated the demand for the models with 2 GB RAM, and underestimated the demand for the 8 GB RAM models which can do real work. Surface Pro tablets are not going to be the next iPad, which is as much a toy for children to play games on as it is a tool for work. (My 3 year old grandkids love iPads.) But the 8 GB models meet a need that no one has really met, and I think that they will be a real winner. Microsoft may have stumbled upon something big, and I hope they realize it.
The one thing to be aware of is that Logos 5 was not written and designed for a touch screen computer. This means there will have to be some getting used to how one uses it on a tablet.
But hopefully that will change in time. Touch screens for desktops are out there and with the direction taken for Windows 8 Microsoft are building an OS platform to take advantage of touchscreen desktops as well as devices. Right now the numbers may not add up for Logos to make a big investment into this area of the program, but I am sure it will pay dividends for them in the longer term if they do make a start.
I've noted in the Microsoft Store there is also a docking station to work with the Surface Pro 2 but it has sold out. If they bring these back into stock it makes the Surface Pro 2 just that little more appealing.
