Oy vey - Another Genesis question

Can anyone suggest a Logos resource that interpret the Book of Genesis from a Jewish perspective?
Looking for something like the book, Genesis: With Talmudic Commentary from Logos, but don't know anything about the resource.
Are there more up to date books, once again in Logos.
My library is pretty well non-existent with commentary etc., from Jewish eyes.
mm.
Comments
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Looks good.
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Sorry to bother you again, Milkman! It's raining herre, ruining a perfectly sunny springtime (though the wildflowers love it).
First, there's no 'jewish perspective' (singular). And second, what period? Philo in the first century, for example, writes up a storm on Genesis, happily describing it as a figment of someone's imagination (ie symbolic; not literal). Josephus was immensely proud but had a harder time than Philo. The various pseudepigrapha delight in Genesis, pretty much re-writing it (their favorite being the sons of God). As you already noted the Talmud makes significant use of Genesis to build various arguments/decisions, followed by 'middle-ages' discussions. Plus there's the more modern (and conservative) ones noted above.
I'm very sure MJ has a favorite too. So, what direction are you seeking?
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Hey Denise,
Yep still snowing with blizzard conditions here. Forecasting Spring to hit Friday May 1st.
Fair enough. I have no idea what period, what perspective, author or schools of thought or direction. For all I knew (and that may have been obvious) I figured there was only one view - the Jewish.
I just wanted to find out more. So can you or MJ or anyone else for that matter, suggest a summary of the various perspectives. So I'll check Philo and Josephus out. I'll do some reading in the false writings. Wish I had the Talmud, but that might come later once the pre-pub is ready for release. I guess I should find out what the differences are between the Babylonian and Jerusalem Talmuds are as well.
Like I mentioned, just wanted to find out as much as I can about as much as I can without leaving anything out.
And yes it is still snowy here! (My buddy taken this morning from our backyard)
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Wow. That looks to be a pretty big back yard. I guess it stretches maybe to Manitoba? Plus what looks to be a Canadian wolf? (Real cutie!)
Well, without going crazy, and staying within a reasonable budget, I'd recommend https://www.logos.com/product/30983/the-jewish-study-bible
This one is willing to bounce around a bit; jewish authorship, etc and well regarded. I don't think you're going to find a 'positions' book beyond the major participants (eg Philo, OT apocrypha, etc which I think you have). The reason is the 'positions' tend to be subject specific (e.g. Enochian at Qumran) and really deviate from traditional views. Marcion (2nd century) is a good example of how comfortable many were with axing Genesis.
I don't know about the Logos guides but I doubt it's going to get very wild. I hope MJ can chime in.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Maybe into Manitoba would be the correct answer and yes my buddy is a real great guy. Super gentle, great with kids and everyone loves him. He's 13 and will be hugely, hugely missed!!
The Study bible looks good. I'll have to pick up the Tanakh as well. Correct?
And I'll wait till MJ chimes in for anything else.
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Milkman, have you checked out Umberto Cassuto? He's a great Genesis rabbi..
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Answering the query on the Tanakh, unless you're pocket change is over-flowing your pocket, Tanakh isn't that much different from something like the NRSV (Old Testament). True, on a few of the Christianized passages (eg the virgin vs young woman, it'll track the hebrew closer). I like Tanakh mainly for its notes (which tend to be a little more forthcoming on 'who knows what the ??? this hebrew word means!).
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Thanks Mike,
I'll check him out.
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We need an edition of Miqra'ot Gedolot and more midrashim!
You can find an English translation of Rashi's commentary on the Bible here.
You could also search the internet for weekly Torah lessons, e.g. by the former Chief Rabbi Jonathan Sacks.
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Milkman said:
Can anyone suggest a Logos resource that interpret the Book of Genesis from a Jewish perspective?
Searching Library for:
Genesis (Jewish, Talmud)
found 15 resources, including Genesis: With Talmudic Commentary
Ariel's Bible Commentary => https://www.logos.com/product/4852/ariels-bible-commentary-the-book-of-genesis
Book of Jubilees => https://www.logos.com/product/5691/the-book-of-jubilees
Hill of Spices => https://www.logos.com/product/17023/hills-of-spices-poetry-from-the-bible
JPS Torah => https://www.logos.com/product/3930/the-jps-torah-commentary-genesis
Walk Messianic Jewish => https://www.logos.com/product/3334/walk-messianic-jewish-devotional-commentary-collection
A Walk in the Garden => https://www.logos.com/product/15132/walk-in-the-garden-biblical-iconographical-and-literary-images-of-eden
Keep Smiling [:)]
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You've received several excellent answers. The first book on this list I recommend as initial reading for anyone with any interest in Jewish interpretation - it gives you an appropriate perspective for everything else you read. It's an account of a contemporary group of Jewish laity in New York meeting regularly to study Genesis.
- Reading the Book: Making the Bible a Timeless Text by Burton L. Visotzky (essential to understanding Jewish perspective)
- Baal Shem Tov Genesis Exodus (Volume 1) by Rabb Eliezer Shore (Hasidic Judaism)
- Adam as Israel: Genesis 1-3 as the Introduction to the Torah and Tanakh by Seth D. Postell
- Between the Lines of the Bible by Yitzchak Etshalom (literal interpretation the Jewish way - Exodus volume better than Genesis but still essential for its methods)
- The Last Trial--On the Legends and Lore of the Command to Abraham to Offer Isaac as a Sacrifice: The Akedah by Shalom Spiegel and Judah Goldin
- Armenian Apocrypha Relating to Abraham by Michael E. Stone (just to throw in something exotic to broaden the prespective)
- One on the Trials of Abraham that I can't recall author or title - but it's very good.
- What's Bothering Rashi? by Avigor Bonchek available in book form or online
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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What do you think about these?
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Milkman said:
Studies in Talmud and Midrash Collection
I found them useful introductions. However, if you have absolutely no background I would read Torah Through Time by Shai Cherry first.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Perfect.
So if the milkman got some extra cash, would you suggest purchasing the Talmud?
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Milkman said:
Perfect.
So if the milkman got some extra cash, would you suggest purchasing the Talmud?
Honestly, unless you find a cash box stuffed with windfall, no. Unless you feel like you will be quoting from the Talmud often, it isn't really necessary. Get it if you have extra cash floating around, but most of these other resources will quote the Talmud if they are referencing it. That should suffice for the time being. It is something you can access online in a variety of ways.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Ok. I think I have enough information to begin to figure out some "direction" (Denise) to wander down. With all the very helpful suggestions and the money I just put out for some of these over the weekend I can now begin to begin a new study on what I hope/feel will be a very fruitful and eye opening adventure into these streams of thought.
Thanks again to all for your help.
Time to disappear into the books....
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mike said:
Milkman, have you checked out Umberto Cassuto? He's a great Genesis rabbi..
I agree that this is a resource to have. My brother was once on a plane reading this commentary in English. He left his seat to use the restroom and returned to find a group of Hasidic Jews hovering over his seat. They had not known that Cassuto's work was translated into English but they told my brother that he is regarded as an authority and greatly respected, and read by all Jewish scholars today.
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MJ. Smith said:
You've received several excellent answers. The first book on this list I recommend as initial reading for anyone with any interest in Jewish interpretation - it gives you an appropriate perspective for everything else you read. It's an account of a contemporary group of Jewish laity in New York meeting regularly to study Genesis.
- Reading the Book: Making the Bible a Timeless Text by Burton L. Visotzky (essential to understanding Jewish perspective)
- Baal Shem Tov Genesis Exodus (Volume 1) by Rabb Eliezer Shore (Hasidic Judaism)
- Adam as Israel: Genesis 1-3 as the Introduction to the Torah and Tanakh by Seth D. Postell
- Between the Lines of the Bible by Yitzchak Etshalom (literal interpretation the Jewish way - Exodus volume better than Genesis but still essential for its methods)
- The Last Trial--On the Legends and Lore of the Command to Abraham to Offer Isaac as a Sacrifice: The Akedah by Shalom Spiegel and Judah Goldin
- Armenian Apocrypha Relating to Abraham by Michael E. Stone (just to throw in something exotic to broaden the prespective)
- One on the Trials of Abraham that I can't recall author or title - but it's very good.
- What's Bothering Rashi? by Avigor Bonchek available in book form or online
Thanks helpful list. Need these as a collection in Logos.
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MJ, you should suggest these for Logos.Disciple of Christ (doc) said:MJ. Smith said:You've received several excellent answers. The first book on this list I recommend as initial reading for anyone with any interest in Jewish interpretation - it gives you an appropriate perspective for everything else you read. It's an account of a contemporary group of Jewish laity in New York meeting regularly to study Genesis.
- Reading the Book: Making the Bible a Timeless Text by Burton L. Visotzky (essential to understanding Jewish perspective)
- Baal Shem Tov Genesis Exodus (Volume 1) by Rabb Eliezer Shore (Hasidic Judaism)
- Adam as Israel: Genesis 1-3 as the Introduction to the Torah and Tanakh by Seth D. Postell
- Between the Lines of the Bible by Yitzchak Etshalom (literal interpretation the Jewish way - Exodus volume better than Genesis but still essential for its methods)
- The Last Trial--On the Legends and Lore of the Command to Abraham to Offer Isaac as a Sacrifice: The Akedah by Shalom Spiegel and Judah Goldin
- Armenian Apocrypha Relating to Abraham by Michael E. Stone (just to throw in something exotic to broaden the prespective)
- One on the Trials of Abraham that I can't recall author or title - but it's very good.
- What's Bothering Rashi? by Avigor Bonchek available in book form or online
Thanks helpful list. Need these as a collection in Logos.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Another couple of titles you might consider are...
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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If/since it's true that there is no single Jewish interpretation of Torah AND that there are seventy faces to the Torah (Num. Rab. 3.15//) does a book exist that has some/many/all interpreters commenting on verses?
So if one wanted to find out what some/many/all Jewish interpretations of Genesis 1.1 was, is there a book or something that combines all interpretations into a set of books? Or would you have to buy individual authors/books/volums on each book in the Hb. Bible?
Or, would it be much like what was said of the Christian Messiah that were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.
mm.
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Sounds like you're asking for an "exegetical summaries" of Jewish Tohraah commentary. I doubt any such thing exists, apart from the Mishnah & Talmud...and the Midrashiym...and the middle ages and modern commentaries...and you get the picture. Also, "seventy" is a kind of perfect number in Biblical ideology, so it isn't necessarily to be taken as literal. Btw, if you haven't heard me or anyone else say it, the supposed "613 laws" of the Tohraah is a made up number as well. Not saying it isn't arrived at by counting; it's just that there are many different counts and lists of 613, and there are some really obvious discrepancies in what is found in the raw data of the Book and the various numbered breakdowns of the laws.
Just a bit of suggestive insight to keep in mind while you study. Keep that salt shaker you use for Barker's stuff handy when reading the Jewish works. They do occasionally have insights that are valuable, but at pretty much the same rate as any other set of humans who say stuff about Scripture--in other words, not all that often.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Thanks David. I have much to learn about the Jewish way. At times it's a bit too overwhelming what with all the study. At times I do not know which way to turn my attention which frustrates me. But, a little at a time, eventually turns into something larger.
yes I have had some very good suggestions about books. Most I have bought. So I guess this will take time.
Btw does it offend to write out Yahweh name in the three letters?
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Milkman said:
Btw does it offend to write out Yahweh name in the three letters?
KS4J's excerpt indicates that the ever expanding hedge around the law appears to have encompassed this as well, at least for some Jews. I don't consider myself a deliberate nose tweaker, but I do believe it is inevitable that others will feel tweaked by things I say from time to time. I have read a few spirited defenses as to why the Name is given this kid glove, euphemistic treatment, and they all tend to revolve around the idea of honoring the Name as being holy. That is an honorable gesture...and on some levels it can even be wise...even life preserving. However, not all efforts to maintain holiness are appropriately dutiful. I think being cautious regarding YHWH's Name is wise. I think not using His Name in the ways He intends for it to be used is something less than wise. I think the hedges of Jewish oral law, including much related to the Name, are a violation of Deut. 4:2 and Deut. 12:32. I think that using the Name to encourage human obedience to the One to whom it refers is an appropriate use of the Name. Just be careful.
Boaz used the Name to great his workers, and they returned the greeting. Ruth 2:4 That isn't exemplary of fastidious non-use for considerations of holiness. It is rather using the Name to bless others...by showing oneself to be considerate of Him in one's dealings.
By the way, I am working on a book right now about the Name, and the main consideration isn't about how it is pronounced. It is about what the Name means. It is a prophetic Name that reveals (will reveal) aspects of Him and His work and His methods and the certainty of His victory. It also reveals things about Him that are virtually unknown, mainly because that is just how He has chosen for His plan to prophetically play out. Jer. 23:20; Jer. 30:24. In the end, all understand precisely what it means to fear His Name.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Milkman said:
...if one wanted to find out what some/many/all Jewish interpretations of Genesis 1.1 was, is there a book or something that combines all interpretations into a set of books?
Hello Milkman,
Yes, what you want is the, Mikraot Gedolot
Check the following out at link below (click on 'Look Inside' to preview)
http://www.mysefer.com/prodtype.asp?cookiecheck=yes&PT_ID=81
Here is some information about what the Mikraot Gedolot is:
(1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikraot_Gedolot
(2) http://people.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/TalmudMap/MG.html
Now, there if a the full Mikraot Gedolot is a little much for you and if you find Rashi script difficult you will simply love:
The Chumash Chorev Full Set Ha-Menukad. It was the a few commentaries and a Targum.
http://www.judaism.com/chumash-chorev-full-set-ha-menukad/dp/BCJDA/
חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי
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BKMitchell said:
Hello Milkman,
Yes, what you want is the, Mikraot Gedolot
Check the following out at link below (click on 'Look Inside' to preview)
http://www.mysefer.com/prodtype.asp?cookiecheck=yes&PT_ID=81
Here is some information about what the Mikraot Gedolot is:
(1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikraot_Gedolot
(2) http://people.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/TalmudMap/MG.html
Now, there if a the full Mikraot Gedolot is a little much for you and if you find Rashi script difficult you will simply love:
The Chumash Chorev Full Set Ha-Menukad. It was the a few commentaries and a Targum.
http://www.judaism.com/chumash-chorev-full-set-ha-menukad/dp/BCJDA/
Brian is right Miqraot Gedolot is the place to start. You'll need a translated edition:
http://jps.org/about/news.php?id=141
However Genesis isn't out yet. How is your German?
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Reading this thread cost me $48
Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 11
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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David Paul said:What did you buy?
Torah Through Time
Jewish Interpretation of the Bible: Ancient and Contemporary
Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 11
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Two good choices...enjoy!
ASUS ProArt x570s Creator, AMD R9 5950x, HyperX 64gb 3600 RAM, ASUS Strix RTX 2080 ti
"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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I ended up getting one of the two books suggested here. Glad for this thread.
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I have copies of Umberto Cassuito's Genesis (2 vol.) and Exodus in hardback. They are excellent.
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Gary Butner said:
I have copies of Umberto Cassuito's Genesis (2 vol.) and Exodus in hardback. They are excellent.
His books are available in Logos
I agree. He is highly regarded
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If Logos ever gets around to developing my deeply longed-for Biblical Studies base package and/or Unobtanium package, I hope they will include the Magnes Press collection in it. I was really kinda ticked that it wasn't included in the latest Portfolio version...they had plenty of room for it.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Gary Butner said:
I have copies of Umberto Cassuito's Genesis (2 vol.) and Exodus in hardback. They are excellent.
I have been comparing many Genesis commentaries over the last few months.
Cassutto in his attention to literary and artistic details is by far the best commentary available. However it should be noted that it doesn't cover even a quarter of the book and that the scholarly references are outdated.
Benno Jacob's commentary in German is also a very good modern Jewish commentary (Sarna is very brief).
Of the non-Jewish commentaries in English Hamilton is probably the best.
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