iPad 1 crash files
Comments
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Anthony,
What were you doing when these occurred, fresh installs? The Mobile team is concentrating on iOS 8 fixes and might not be able to ship a build that never crashes on iOS 5.x.
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Both times I was in the app reading and switching to a new resource.
In Verbum I was using a passage guide and switched over to Haydock’s Catholic Bible Commentary.
In Logos I was using a passage guide and switched over to Black's Thess. commentary
The out of mem crash, I was trying to load Black's on a restart of the Logos app.
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Anthony,
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I'm guessing you're not going to have much luck getting the app to work 100% of the time on an iPad 1. The device is very old (in mobile device land, where 4 years is an eternity). Speaking as a mobile app developer myself, the cost associated for supporting these devices is ENORMOUS. Logos recently dropped support for Android 2.1 because it was taking full DAYS to support features on Android 2.1 devices that would have taken 10-15 minutes to write if they only supported newer versions. A new iPad might be the easiest solution here.
That being said, if money is too tight for a new iPad (which is totally understandable), a good option might be a refurbished Nexus 7 device (if you can stand using Android [:)]). You can frequently find them for as low as $129
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Anthony,
What were you doing when these occurred, fresh installs? The Mobile team is concentrating on iOS 8 fixes and might not be able to ship a build that never crashes on iOS 5.x.
"Never crash" is not my goal and I understand the time constraints and priorities. I also recognize the limitations of the available hardware of the iPad1
http://community.logos.com/forums/p/85945/602362.aspx#602362
The phrase "workable state" for those unable to run iOS 6 or above is a bit ambiguous though, as it implied that there was going to be some ongoing development for a least a few more month. The idea of just chucking it seems like a waste of the time and money invested in it. But I'm bias since I was planning on replacing my iPad for at least another year since I'm looking at purchasing a more powerful laptop...to handle Logos6 LOL [:P]
As goals go and the only reason I have been bothering with all the post is to provide logs so that the devs may come to some sort of fix, if perhaps my log files could provide any such insight.Mostly stable and predominately functional is my goal. If that's not in the cards so be it. I'm not upset, just disappointed... the app has been crash prone on iPad 1/iOS5 for what seems like almost a year for many users and if we are the small percent that you describe in some of your previous posts...well I would probably not justify the resources either. Apple appears to be setting the pace and the "disposable" mindset.
I understand the mindset and marketing situation is not the fault of Logos but rather customer demands, consumerism, distorted economics, revenue generation, a limit on where you can place your resource, etc., etc.. The marketing has created the market..newer, better, shinier, NOW. Welcome to the 24th and a half century, I'll take my jet pack now please. [:)]All the disappointments aside..I respect what Logos is doing. Logos has the right to do what they want and to stay ahead of the curve. In fact they better or my investment in my digital library could be at risk. Not to mention that all the improvements to the app are good and promote quality mobile Bible study and contribute to the spread of the Gospel. I do not fault Logos on any of that.If "workable state" meant "as is" then just say so and we'll all move on.
If a mostly stable and predominately functional version is not possible perhaps it might serve the iPad 1/iOS5 users better to have a rolled back version available that perhaps is somewhat disconnected from the newer bells and whistles. I recall a few previous iterations that were functional and stable on the first gen iPad, in fact if memory serves me correctly they were more so than the currently resource intensive version. Do you perhaps have any statistical data that might help choose that version and could you roll it out as the "Logos for iPad1"?
[;)]
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I can't answer your questions...you'll have to wait for someone more official. But I must say you have a refreshingly positive attitude about it. [:)]
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If a mostly stable and predominately functional version is not possible perhaps it might serve the iPad 1/iOS5 users better to have a rolled back version available that perhaps is somewhat disconnected from the newer bells and whistles. I recall a few previous iterations that were functional and stable on the first gen iPad, in fact if memory serves me correctly they were more so than the currently resource intensive version. Do you perhaps have any statistical data that might help choose that version and could you roll it out as the "Logos for iPad1"?
It is my understanding that Apple added the ability for developers to mark versions as the "latest compatible version" so that users would be able to download a usable version of the app... With that said... It is difficult to know if this issue occurs with few, some, or most users in your shoes. It might be detrimental to other users for Logos to retroactively designate an older version for iPad 1 users.
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Anthony,
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I'm guessing you're not going to have much luck getting the app to work 100% of the time on an iPad 1. The device is very old (in mobile device land, where 4 years is an eternity). Speaking as a mobile app developer myself, the cost associated for supporting these devices is ENORMOUS. Logos recently dropped support for Android 2.1 because it was taking full DAYS to support features on Android 2.1 devices that would have taken 10-15 minutes to write if they only supported newer versions. A new iPad might be the easiest solution here.
That being said, if money is too tight for a new iPad (which is totally understandable), a good option might be a refurbished Nexus 7 device (if you can stand using Android
). You can frequently find them for as low as $129Thanks Drew.[:)]
I am aware of the issues...I saw the drop of support for Android 2.1 which affected my phone, though I rarely used it on my phone. So knew it was inevitable. I also saw the same thing with Apple and iOS 4 and recognized the pattern and the pace Apple had in mind for their hardware/iOS.
The thing is if you have to dropped support for Android 2.1, leave a stable and functioning version viable and available.
The same can be said for iPad1/iOS5. If you have to dropped support for it, leave a functioning version viable and available. Apple made it so older hardware/iOS could download a viable (previous) version for a reason.
I download and use those older viable versions all the time now. Guess what, they crash ways less the Logos, Verbum, and Vyrso (yes, I know they are the same engine/app with only a few cosmetic changes)
All this aside, I'm not quibbling on the age of the iPad, support issues, Logos resources, development, cost, or any of those sort of things, etc..
The quibbling part is probably leaning more toward the definition of "workable state" or stable, functioning and viable.
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I can't answer your questions...you'll have to wait for someone more official. But I must say you have a refreshingly positive attitude about it.
Thanks drew. It certainly is not my intentions to stir up a hornets nest. I can adjust my expectations pretty easily. Logos adjusting their budget/resources to accommodate an iPad1/iOS5 hold-out is not realistic.
[:D]
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If a mostly stable and predominately functional version is not possible perhaps it might serve the iPad 1/iOS5 users better to have a rolled back version available that perhaps is somewhat disconnected from the newer bells and whistles. I recall a few previous iterations that were functional and stable on the first gen iPad, in fact if memory serves me correctly they were more so than the currently resource intensive version. Do you perhaps have any statistical data that might help choose that version and could you roll it out as the "Logos for iPad1"?
It is my understanding that Apple added the ability for developers to mark versions as the "latest compatible version" so that users would be able to download a usable version of the app... With that said... It is difficult to know if this issue occurs with few, some, or most users in your shoes. It might be detrimental to other users for Logos to retroactively designate an older version for iPad 1 users.
I would be interest in knowing that number. I thought I saw something like 2.5% are iOS5 (or maybe it was iOS6) posted somewhere.
But 2.5% of what? 10,000? 50,000? 20,000?[:)]
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I don't know hard numbers. What is impressive is the iOS 8 adoption rate, which is close to 50% in under a week: http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/23/ios-8-adoption-nearing-half/
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Logos recently dropped support for Android 2.1 [...]
Oops, that definitely should have been "Android 2.3". [:P]
The thing is if you have to dropped support for Android 2.1, leave a stable and functioning version viable and available.
The same can be said for iPad1/iOS5. If you have to dropped support for it, leave a functioning version viable and available. Apple made it so older hardware/iOS could download a viable (previous) version for a reason.
In thinking about this, I'm wondering what would be the best way to do this? I imagine Logos could have dropped support for iOS 5 (and similarly Android 2.3) much earlier, but at that point there would have still been a larger percentage of users on those devices. Should they wait until the number of users falls below 5% (or some other arbitrary number)? If that's the criteria, it's easy to see how performance can degrade on those devices despite them still having a large number of users.
Another "issue" I see, from a developer's perspective, is that it feels a bit weird to release a new version of an app that drops support for iOS 5 or Android 2.3 (etc) without any real reason other than "we want to leave those users with a stable version". The new version isn't necessarily unstable/unusable, so it feels like you're cheating the users out of new features and fixes. The unstability creeps in over time and is hard to notice until it's already too late to go back.
Objectively speaking, setting an earlier and arbitrary cutoff point for dropping support for an old operating system is probably best, but at the time, it leaves both developers and users unhappy.
Anyway, I don't know if that's helpful or not. Just musing. Must be time for bed. [:)]
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I don't know hard numbers. What is impressive is the iOS 8 adoption rate, which is close to 50% in under a week: http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/23/ios-8-adoption-nearing-half/
That is impressive.
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Logos recently dropped support for Android 2.1 [...]
Oops, that definitely should have been "Android 2.3".
The thing is if you have to dropped support for Android 2.1, leave a stable and functioning version viable and available.
The same can be said for iPad1/iOS5. If you have to dropped support for it, leave a functioning version viable and available. Apple made it so older hardware/iOS could download a viable (previous) version for a reason.
In thinking about this, I'm wondering what would be the best way to do this? I imagine Logos could have dropped support for iOS 5 (and similarly Android 2.3) much earlier, but at that point there would have still been a larger percentage of users on those devices. Should they wait until the number of users falls below 5% (or some other arbitrary number)? If that's the criteria, it's easy to see how performance can degrade on those devices despite them still having a large number of users.
Another "issue" I see, from a developer's perspective, is that it feels a bit weird to release a new version of an app that drops support for iOS 5 or Android 2.3 (etc) without any real reason other than "we want to leave those users with a stable version". The new version isn't necessarily unstable/unusable, so it feels like you're cheating the users out of new features and fixes. The unstability creeps in over time and is hard to notice until it's already too late to go back.
Objectively speaking, setting an earlier and arbitrary cutoff point for dropping support for an old operating system is probably best, but at the time, it leaves both developers and users unhappy.
Anyway, I don't know if that's helpful or not. Just musing. Must be time for bed.
This does bring up some really hard questions and somewhat elusive answers going forward for Logos. I wouldn't want to be the one that has to answer for the final decisions on many of them because it's not likely going to please everyone. [:^)]
Morning came way to quickly...[|-)]
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