Looks like the price is going down currently the bid is at 30$. I bid 35, the more people the more the price goes down correct ?
Barnes is languishing and will probably never be published. The graph is just the number of pre-orders at each price as a percent of the total needed. Right now there are not enough pre-orders (not bids) to come even close to the cost of publication. Enter the price you are willing to pay and try to drum up support. Barnes has been on this list for a couple of years at least, and is going no where.
you know, i wonder if Logos might help the interest by giving some examples/excerpts. If he is good at illustrating, (like Barclay), give us an example. If he has keen insight, give one of those.
I frankly just think of Barnes as a thick book on my dad's shelf that probably says stuff many other commentaries I have says. Certainly it doesn't interact with current discussion.
That said, a) I have placed a bid, b) just because he is not current doesn't mean he isn't relevant. Still, I want to know (and other non-bidders do too) WHY we should care about Barnes. Just having people say "Oh, I like him", or "his writings are beloved by many" doesn't really help.
Peace!
I don't have nor have I ever used Barnes. He is available in e-sword for free which may be one reason there is little interest in paying as much as Logos would need to publish him. You can download e-sword and Barnes and check him out if you want.
you know, i wonder if Logos might help the interest by giving some examples/excerpts
There are some sample pages from the print edition at the resource's web page here
It would be nice to have Barnes keyed to my logos. Don't know if it will ever happen though.
Don't know if it will ever happen though.
You didn't say, but have you submitted a pre-order for this on the Community Pricing listing for the resource? Unless a bunch of new people do this, it isn't going to make it into Logos. Here's the link for anyone who wants to 'vote' with their pocketbook.It is at the very bottom of the page.
http://www.logos.com/communitypricing
Mark,
What happened to the graph ? The production line is alot farther away then it was ?
I don't think it is any farther away. Please note that the cost of producing this resource will be very high. $30 bids will never get it into Logos (Blair, I don't know how much you or anyone except me have bid, so this is not aimed at you).
you know, i wonder if Logos might help the interest by giving some examples/excerpts There are some sample pages from the print edition at the resource's web page here
[:$] and so there is . . . [:$]
. . . . i wish more posters would be more informed before the post. <note to self>
I've been there several times. . . .
Don't know if it will ever happen though. You didn't say, but have you submitted a pre-order for this on the Community Pricing listing for the resource? Unless a bunch of new people do this, it isn't going to make it into Logos. Here's the link for anyone who wants to 'vote' with their pocketbook.It is at the very bottom of the page. http://www.logos.com/communitypricing
Yes I have submitted the pre-order for this. Its not a big deal it would just be cool.
Old school now with V4 out but it is available in a PBB for V3. (I believe it is complete)
http://www.stilltruth.com/blog/joekreif/albert-barnes-notes-old-testament-now-available-pbb-format
I guess I missed that the other day when I was on the site... God Bless
How does the graph work? I don't see how the dollar amounts on the bottom reconcile with the percentage required for production on the left of the graph. For Barnes it shows $30 at 40%, but it shows $65 at 20%. I don't understand the math. How do you tell if one is getting close to enough bids to go in production?
The production cost is the same across the board. The graph shows the total amount bid at the various levels against what it would cost to produce the resource. In other words, a great number of $30 bids have been submitted, but very few $65 bids.
I'm not sure I understand how the chart works, though. Surely all the people who have bid over $30 would be willing to buy it for $30 too, if it were ever produced for that value. So if the people who bid exactly $30 on it amount to only 40% of the production cost, shouldn't the chart also include all the people who have bid more than $30 for computing that point? I might have expected it would automatically, but it clearly doesn't do that, since you can see (currently) a blip in the chart where more people would pay $70 for it than $65. If all the people who would pay > $65 are factored into the chart's point at the 65 level, then you'd expect a continuously declining line.
So I really don't understand how this chart can help Logos determine when they've got enough support from the community to go ahead and produce the thing.
If you don't want to download e-Sword to see the whole thing in digital form, you can also see lots more of the print edition by poking around in the "Search Inside this Book" feature on Amazon.com:
http://www.amazon.com/Barnes-Notes-Testaments-Fourteen-volumes/dp/0801008344#noop
Surely all the people who have bid over $30 would be willing to buy it for $30 too, if it were ever produced for that value. So if the people who bid exactly $30 on it amount to only 40% of the production cost, shouldn't the chart also include all the people who have bid more than $30 for computing that point?
You caught me again. [8-|] As I understand the chart, all orders over $30 would be included in the level of the graph at $30. For instance, I bid $95, so my bid counts there and at even increment down the line.
Granted that PBB functionality in v4 is unknown, but could someone explain what advantage would a Logos produced version have over the PBB version that I use in v3 (and hopefully will be able to use in v4 soon)? The PBB shows up as a commentary and the verses are hyperlinked. What additional tagging could be added to this resource that I'm missing out on?
I am aware of this blog post covering the advantages of Logos produced resources over PBBs but its not clear which of this apply in the Barnes Notes case.
http://blog.logos.com/mt-cgi/mt-search.cgi?IncludeBlogs=1&tag=PBB&limit=20
Look at it this way. Suppose for example you had 10 people willing to pay $100 for the resource. That of course would result in $1000. If there were fewer bids at $30, say 3 that would be $90. Now factor in the 10 willing to pay $100, but now you can only count them as $30s so now you have 13 at $30 which is only $390, hence the chart at $30 is lower than the chart at $100.
This item says "CD-ROM only" -- if they were to make it DOWNLOAD, I might order it. Why is there any reason to do CD-ROM only versions of things anymore when most of us have high-speed Internet these days? It's a pain to have to wait for the thing to ship, and then open the CD and put it in and install of it. I don't order any items from Logos anymore that come on CD only. I'm waiting for them to make downloadable versions available, which I presume they will in due time.
I am willing to bet that the page has not been updated since the L4 was released and this, if ever produced, would be a download like all other future resources. I think you can bid with confidence. :-)
So I really don't understand how this chart can help Logos determine when they've got enough support from the community to go ahead and produce the thing. Look at it this way. Suppose for example you had 10 people willing to pay $100 for the resource. That of course would result in $1000. If there were fewer bids at $30, say 3 that would be $90. Now factor in the 10 willing to pay $100, but now you can only count them as $30s so now you have 13 at $30 which is only $390, hence the chart at $30 is lower than the chart at $100.
Oh, of course. My math was muddled. Thanks for clearing it up.
How much would you be willing bet for that? Shall we do it kind of like community pricing? The more you're willing to bet, the more likely I will be to go ahead and order it? :-)
I am willing to be the price of a cup of coffee and if you ever make it to the Seattle area, you can collect if I am wrong :-)
I’m probably not the person to ask if you want every aspect of the differences but one of the main ones is integration with the engine, limiting search abilities. PBB are only “surface searchable”, I believe that’s the term. But someone like Mr. Thomas Black (http://community.logos.com/user/Profile.aspx?UserID=5581) or http://www.stilltruth.com/ should be able to accurately and more fully answer.
OK, sold. I've just bid on it.
Linden emailed me and asked me to weigh in on this.
In brief, Anthony has adequately stated the problem in that we don't know what L4's version of PBB will bring.
In L3, PBB's were only surface text searchable. You could not do markup, and there were a few other significant missing features. One of the key ones is datatyping. We could not mark a PBB as a Bible for instance under L3.
Now then, we have been assured that in L4 the PBB's will fully integrate with Logos. That means indexing at minimum, and I'm almost certain I read that Markup will be permitted. In fact My understanding is that PBB's will be very like regular books under L4.
That said I can GUESS at a few issues which will doubtless crop up. In no particular order....
Those are a few issues that readily come to mind. They can either remain issues or disappear as issues.
All of this is guesswork because we just flat out don't know what will happen with PBB under L4 until it at least enters the beta stream.
That said I can GUESS at a few issues which will doubtless crop up. In no particular order..
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this issue.
Thomas,
Thanks for the detailed reply. I guess we will be in a holding pattern until 4.x PBB support is available to test.
with Gephartr's most excellent PBB updater (YAY Gephartr!)
I didn't even know about the update and have been downloading the PBBs by hand. Wow, you're right this is cool.
