I Love the new Datasheet view - a couple ideas . . .

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Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 24 2009 10:01 PM | Locked

Bob Pritchett:

When there are two things in a single labeled field the row is duplicated, so each instance can be sorted/grouped on its own. 

It isn't ideal, but the other solutions are even worse (not being able to find/sort on the second item?), so this is how the problem is typically handled in database displays of this sort.

We're open to alternate suggestions.

OK, now I see what you guys are doing. The datasheet on that search was based on the database from the ESV interlinear with has the article and the inifinitive in the same record as the English word propitiation.

You get different results when you do a morph search in a Greek text.

Very important to realize the difference when you are setting up your search. There are obviously strengths and weaknesses to searching an interlinear database.

Maybe there needs to be more work done on the interlinear database itself. Particularly with the articular infinitive when the article is tied more to the syntactical function than to the meaning of the word.

Interesting problem with results from interlinear databases . . . I'll have to think about this more.

Posts 687
Jon | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 24 2009 10:59 PM | Locked

I think I can handle a couple of hits being duplicated because of this but it really breaks down in the Septuagint...

Try for example, searching for βασιλευω in just one verse: Esther 4:14

4 forms x 5 lemmas x 4 parts of speech x 2 strong's numbers x 5 ?identical hits for each one? = 800 results in the Datasheet from one occurence of βασιλευω in one verse! Big Smile

I think there may be other problems there, but can I suggest that after the hits have been sorted by the users's selected criteria; that the multiple hits for an individual verse thereafter are automatically clumped together and collapsed down.

 

Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 25 2009 8:46 AM | Locked

Jon Rumble:

I think I can handle a couple of hits being duplicated because of this but it really breaks down in the Septuagint...

Try for example, searching for βασιλευω in just one verse: Esther 4:14

4 forms x 5 lemmas x 4 parts of speech x 2 strong's numbers x 5 ?identical hits for each one? = 800 results in the Datasheet from one occurence of βασιλευω in one verse! Big Smile

I think there may be other problems there, but can I suggest that after the hits have been sorted by the users's selected criteria; that the multiple hits for an individual verse thereafter are automatically clumped together and collapsed down.

There is not a bug in the datasheet or the search. It is a function of how the interlinear resource has been designed.

The datasheet is pulling every possible combination of the many fields that are in that lemma's entry in the LXX with Logos Morphology.

Notice that a search on a non-interlinear morphologically tagged text yields the expected results:

I think that once you understand how the different resources will produce different results, this becomes manageable . . . maybe even useful for some things, maybe?

You have to use interlinear texts for certain applications and non-interlinear texts for others.

This is not the most user friendly approach IMHO because it requires a lot of understanding of the different resources that is not necessarily self-evident.

I'm afraid I don't have any suggestions right now about how to improve it. I really haven't determined (in my understanding) if this is a feature or a weakness.

Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 25 2009 8:52 PM | Locked

One idea I've had for making the results of the Datasheet report a bit more useful is to allow deletion of duplicates and false positives after the report has been generated.

Maybe you could select rows (better yet multiple rows) that you know are irrelevant to your purpose and delete them?

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 2:16 AM | Locked

Russ,

that's a great idea!

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 4:49 AM | Locked

Russ Quinn:
One idea I've had for making the results of the Datasheet report a bit more useful is to allow deletion of duplicates and false positives

This could also be done automatically:-

The Noun results were not requested and should not be presented.

Dave
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Windows 10 & Android 8

Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 8:44 AM | Locked

Hey Dave,

Is there a listing of morphological query syntax operators anywhere?

I am trying to build a query to find all occurences of εἰς and an infinitive within 3 words.

So far I've got lemma:εἰς AND @V??N but I'm not sure how to limit within 3 words.

Thanks,

Russ

Posts 2548
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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:18 AM | Locked

Try:

lemma:εἰς WITHIN 3 WORDS @V??N 

Posts 26952
Forum MVP
Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 1:57 PM | Locked

Russ Quinn:

Hey Dave,

Is there a listing of morphological query syntax operators anywhere?

Look at http://wiki.logos.com/Search_HELP The lemma format has changed for Bible Search in 4.0a, but you should be OK formatting in Morph Search as it converts when you switch to Bible Search. There was a hint of a wildcard format for Morph Search in B1 changes but i haven't seen anything beyond that!

John has the solution!

Dave
===

Windows 10 & Android 8

Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 26 2009 7:43 PM | Locked

Thanks, Dave and John. That did it.

I'm used to doing most of my morphological searching in Accordance where I usually use the Construct tool for this type of thing.

I'm trying to get my head around how to do what I need to do in Logos.

I appreciate your help.

Russ

Posts 236
Bruce Junkermann | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2009 1:20 PM | Locked

Cited by improvements...Love it! Thanks Logos!

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