Logos 5 for Mac is OUT

Hello my fellow Logos Mac users. The new Logos 5 is out, and I am excited for the changes I have seen. Here is my video review and a first look at what Logos can do on Mac http://www.morethancake.org/archives/5580
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Haven't seen the video yet, but for the sake of forum readers (rather than video watchers), how does the performance compare?
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Anything specific?
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Just finished the video. Good overview, thanks for posting it.
I would like some more specifics on visuals and speed. It looks like they have moved away from trying to put things in the Mac toolbar, instead keeping it organized more like the Windows version? I think this is a good move, though in the video it looks like the PC version still has more flash to it: looks cleaner, works smoother.
How about scrolling responsiveness? Opening layouts? Running searches? Etc. You mentioned some issues continue with notes. General sluggishness?
One of my gripes here is that it seems the improvements to the Mac version in L5 should have been added to L4. These are bug fixes, not upgrade features, yet to get them we have to pay for them. But perhaps there aren't as many of those fixes as one might hope?
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Ok.... so when will the standalone mac app come out. I found out original languages is now only sold to students and schools; hence I can't upgrade. And I was told several years ago there might finally be a Jewish studies collection; thats still missing. How long will Logos support mac logos 4 while Apple radically changes OSX and changes whats kind of app can be installed on the mac?? Thanks.
{Choose Life, Create Hope, Nurture Love, Wrestle Faith...}
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This is how the industry works...squeeze you to upgrade if you want the bug fixes.
{Choose Life, Create Hope, Nurture Love, Wrestle Faith...}
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I only see upgrade options starting at over 500 bucks.
I can't afford 500 for the new interface/software to run my collection-sigh.
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
I only see upgrade options starting at over 500 bucks.
I called sales earlier and the guy I talked with said the crossgrade option will be offered once the introductory pricing period has ended. I've got my fingers crossed that Logos will offer the crossgrade sooner than that given all the user frustration on this issue.
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Crossgrade?I don't understand?
I can upgrade osx for a few bucks, Accordance the same way, most apps the same way.
I don't understand.
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What happened to all this talk about "The Logo's engine is free, you pay for resources " ?
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
What happened to all this talk about "The Logo's engine is free, you pay for resources " ?
That's just marketing, in my opinion.
Basic reasoning from Logos sees the crossgrade as paying for the minimum resources needed to make L5 run properly. Logos 5 includes several new databases that power its new features. You can use Logos 5 without those databases, but you won't be able to take advantage of the new features. The minimal crossgrade adds the databases, but nothing else. In terms of resources, you are buying only the "resources" (databases) necessary to give Logos 5 its bells and whistles.
Package upgrades include those databases, plus various additional resources.
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I decided to take a leap… I looked at the options and found i could purchase the starter upgrade for a little over $50, all I can say Logos has finally released a stable mac app.
-Dan
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
What happened to all this talk about "The Logo's engine is free, you pay for resources " ?
I don't know for sure, but I assume it will be the same. Another forum member, who remembers the L4 launch, said that something similar happened. Obviously Logos wants things to go as smoothly as possible for paying upgrade customers. Since there could potentially be quite a demand to download the engine, it makes sense that Logos would try to stagger things a bit… When the dust settles, I think you will be able to download the engine.
macOS, iOS & iPadOS |Logs| Install
Choose Truth Over Tribe | Become a Joyful Outsider!0 -
I can only compare what I had in L4 to what I have in L5 and it is much faster and smoother. There are some sluggish parts, but I am also on a 2007 Macbook Pro with a Core 2 so I recognize that people on newer Macs probably get better results than I do. Once I work with it for a week or two, I will know more.Chris Roberts said:I would like some more specifics on visuals and speed. It looks like they have moved away from trying to put things in the Mac toolbar, instead keeping it organized more like the Windows version? I think this is a good move, though in the video it looks like the PC version still has more flash to it: looks cleaner, works smoother.
How about scrolling responsiveness? Opening layouts? Running searches? Etc. You mentioned some issues continue with notes. General sluggishness?
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Dan- Did you "upgrade?" I am wondering if I upgrade will I lose my Silver resources? Len
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Leonard Calhoun said:
I am wondering if I upgrade will I lose my Silver resources?
You will keep all the resources you have already purchased. See the FAQ for more details: http://www.logos.com/faq
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Leonard Calhoun said:
Dan- Did you "upgrade?" I am wondering if I upgrade will I lose my Silver resources? Len
No! You can never loose your resources. You keep all your current resources and then add new ones when you upgrade.
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Joe Miller said:
There are some sluggish parts, but I am also on a 2007 Macbook Pro with a Core 2
Well it's encouraging to me that you see improvements on that machine since I'm also on a 2007 MBP, at least at home. My office computer is a newer (though not new) iMac, so I'll look forward to trying out the L5 improvements myself.
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Thanks. It's just strange going from "silver" to 2 notches below- "starter." Also- with over 700 books already purchased (old silver)- how on earth could I discern if I still "have" them all? Looking for some assurance here. But I think I'll take the leap.
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Leonard Calhoun said:
Thanks. It's just strange going from "silver" to 2 notches below- "starter." Also- with over 700 books already purchased (old silver)- how on earth could I discern if I still "have" them all? Looking for some assurance here. But I think I'll take the leap.
Well you could always check your Library count by clicking the Library icon and looking at the greyed out number before you type anything.
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you.
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Dan Francis said:
I decided to take a leap… I looked at the options and found i could purchase the starter upgrade for a little over $50, all I can say Logos has finally released a stable mac app.
You realize you probably paid almost as much as the crossgrade will cost, while getting almost none of the new databases/features? Essentially, all you got was the free engine plus some books you probably don't want. I can get the Starter upgrade for $25.81, but I still don't consider it worth the price. I'm hoping for a good upgrade to the Catholic packages, otherwise I'll go with the crossgrade, which will be much more worth the price.
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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Leonard Calhoun said:
It's just strange going from "silver" to 2 notches below- "starter."
Why would you want to do that? Much better to wait for the crossgrade. See my post above.
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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I'm sorry but, I still do not understand.
I have a pretty large library, I have the scholars library and added the Catholic collections and many other titles and packages.
Have a lot of money tied up.
The options showing for me start at over 500.00 and are mostly titles i already have or, a bunch of titles i have absolutely no use for at all.
Why would I want to spend 500.00 or more just to get what I have already paid for to work properly.
Cross grade? I don't understand.
Cross-grade from what , to what?
Would gladly pay a small fee to upgrade to Version 5 software, 30.00 bucks or so for handling, perhaps 50.00.
Just need Logos to work as it was advertised to me when I first bought. To this day, I still have not received the software that was advertised and I have been patient.
Perhaps I am a stick in the mud, perhaps I am dense.
Web-site says nothing about upgrading from version 4 to version 5 for small fee. They are just trying to sell me more resources that are not useful to me.
Not trying to be obstinate here, just really confused about Logos intentions and my options.
Will NOT give Logos any more money for resources until they finally give me what I ALREADY paid them for.
I don't think I am wrong in this, but certainly willing to be shown the error of my ways if I am wrong.
What am I missing on the web-site and options here?
Thanks so much.
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
Cross grade? I don't understand.
Cross-grade from what , to what?
Would gladly pay a small fee to upgrade to Version 5 software, 30.00 bucks or so for handling, perhaps 50.00.
That's exactly what a crossgrade would do: it will give you the free engine plus the databases etc to enjoy the new functionality.
Have joy in the Lord!
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The Minimal Crossgrade Package - once it's available - should give you access only those essential resources, databases, etc. that you will need to make your current library work with Logos 5 with all its new functionality. Essentially, you're not buying extra resources which you don't need to make Logos 5 work, like you would do if you bought one of the new base packages.
Check out this attachment - this is the Minimal Crossgrade package Logos released to help people upgrade from Logos 3 to Logos 4. ***DISCLAIMER [:)]*** Whilst any Logos 5 MiniMal Crossgrade package will be different, this might give you a little idea of what to expect when Logos finally do release the Logos 5 Crossgrade package.
I haven't seen any indication of when the Minimal Crossgrade Package will be made available (only once the "introductory period" for Logos 5 ends ( - whatever that means...)) or how much it will cost. I guess we'll just have to be patient, and watch this space.
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Paul,
the L4 Crossgrade page is still up: http://www.logos.com/minimalcrossgrade
Have joy in the Lord!
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NB.Mick said:
Paul,
the L4 Crossgrade page is still up: http://www.logos.com/minimalcrossgrade
Thanks Mick - I know. I made a pdf of the page just in case it was pulled for any reason!
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OK - so the 600lbs gorilla in the room for me is this. I love Logos, but all you have to do is browse this forum to see that the MAC version has been buggy, lacked feature parity, and even many of the features promised never materialized. Crashes, data loss and other problems have been met with "Please send us your log files and we will see what we can do." Now we have an entirely new version (5). For me the "upgrade" is over $600 to move from Platinum 5 to Platinum 5 after spending thousands of dollars over the years.
So here is my question - how do we know with certainty that the MAC version works and has the same features being promoted? We were told we would reach feature parity before. We didn't. We were told we were buying a stable finished MAC product. Arguably, we weren't.
Will my $600 upgrade finally get me a MAC product that works and is the same feature rich tool I had on Windows?
2015 13" MacBook Pro - 2 Ghz Intel i7 - 16 GB RAM - 500GB SSD - 2018 iMac Pro - 3.2GHz 8-core Xeon - both systems running OS 10.14.3 (Mojave)
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Michael Hite said:
So here is my question - how do we know with certainty that the MAC version works and has the same features being promoted? We were told we would reach feature parity before. We didn't. We were told we were buying a stable finished MAC product. Arguably, we weren't.
Will my $600 upgrade finally get me a MAC product that works and is the same feature rich tool I had on Windows?
Michael, I'm not a MAC guy but a few of the MVP's are. Here is what I KNOW.
- Every new feature in L5 is working on both platforms.
- There remain a few of the old L4 issues to clean up, except handouts which are deprecated.
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you.
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TCBlack said:
There remain a few of the old L4 issues to clean up, except handouts which are deprecated.
Now there is my concern.
PLEASE understand me. I teach a full course on Logos and have gotten the school where teach to require it for all students. I LOVE LOGOS! But more and more of my students are MAC users - and many have had ongoing issues since the bought it. With "a few things left to clean up" what are those things?
2015 13" MacBook Pro - 2 Ghz Intel i7 - 16 GB RAM - 500GB SSD - 2018 iMac Pro - 3.2GHz 8-core Xeon - both systems running OS 10.14.3 (Mojave)
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I'm afraid one of our MAC MVP's will have to answer that. (Or a programmer.)Michael Hite said:With "a few things left to clean up" what are those things?
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you.
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I found this from KS4J:
[quote]Wiki has list of know feature parity issues => http://wiki.logos.com/Mac_and_PC_User_Interface_Differences#Feature_Parity that reduced when Logos 4.6a was released.
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you.
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If you look, you will see many of those posts are from me. L4 was a mess to the end. L5 does solve most of those problems for me. You can watch it in action in my video http://www.morethancake.org/archives/5580Michael Hite said:OK - so the 600lbs gorilla in the room for me is this. I love Logos, but all you have to do is browse this forum to see that the MAC version has been buggy, lacked feature parity, and even many of the features promised never materialized. Crashes, data loss and other problems have been met with "Please send us your log files and we will see what we can do." Now we have an entirely new version (5). For me the "upgrade" is over $600 to move from Platinum 5 to Platinum 5 after spending thousands of dollars over the years.
So here is my question - how do we know with certainty that the MAC version works and has the same features being promoted? We were told we would reach feature parity before. We didn't. We were told we were buying a stable finished MAC product. Arguably, we weren't.
Maybe that will give you some help in your upcoming decision.
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fgh said:Dan Francis said:
I decided to take a leap… I looked at the options and found i could purchase the starter upgrade for a little over $50, all I can say Logos has finally released a stable mac app.
You realize you probably paid almost as much as the crossgrade will cost, while getting almost none of the new databases/features? Essentially, all you got was the free engine plus some books you probably don't want. I can get the Starter upgrade for $25.81, but I still don't consider it worth the price. I'm hoping for a good upgrade to the Catholic packages, otherwise I'll go with the crossgrade, which will be much more worth the price.
Perhaps i didm;t understand things close enough…. I do have the catholic scholars package already, I just assumed all base databases would be included the sameway 4 included all base databases. After the dust settles I can always call customer service and straighten things out but for now I have a logos that works smoother for me for not too much money.
-Dan
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Joe Miller said:
f you look, you will see many of those posts are from me. L4 was a mess to the end. L5 does solve most of those problems for me. You can watch it in action in my video http://www.morethancake.org/archives/5580
Maybe that will give you some help in your upcoming decision.
Thanks Joe - I actually found your video yesterday - it was very helpful. I remain the perpetual optimist as I think LOGOS is the best product of its kind on the market. I look forward to the new features and maybe even some repaired older ones
2015 13" MacBook Pro - 2 Ghz Intel i7 - 16 GB RAM - 500GB SSD - 2018 iMac Pro - 3.2GHz 8-core Xeon - both systems running OS 10.14.3 (Mojave)
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It is pretty uncool that people have have to pay $$$$$ forced upgrade if they just bought their software let alone buggy Logos 4 software - This was foreseeable ( reason why I held off from buying......)
Someone very wise one said "do unto others as you would like them to doing to you" (for they surely will).
Real "Christian Disciples of Jesus" are noble and "show class" in their conduct - this cannot be denied.
Shalom
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Mike Singer said:
It is pretty uncool that people have have to pay $$$ forced upgrade
Who is being forced to upgrade? I think you have misunderstood something along the line. Read Bob's post HERE.
macOS, iOS & iPadOS |Logs| Install
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Logos 5 for the Mac has full screen support, which works nicely on OS X 10.8.2
Logos 5 has substantial feature parity between Mac and PC.
New Logos 5 features have parity between Mac and PC.
Keep Smiling [:)]
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I appreciate the reply's but am still totally confused, I mean really confused.
They want me to spend more money when they have not yet fixed what I already paid for?
Look, I buy a car, it does not run well, parts of it don't work at all, it keeps leaving me stranded at times, it is unreliable and the shop can't fix it.
Then the manufacturer tells me hey: Spend some more money, but our newest one, that will fix all your issues, we think.
You mean you want me to but yet another car?
Yep.
What about all the money I already spent?
Sorry about that, but you will really like it this time, now please give us some more of your money.
So guys, is this what I am hearing/seeing?
Does this sound right to you?
I kinda feel like Logos is saying : Hey, your really stupid, but , we like you , now write us a check.
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
I appreciate the reply's but am still totally confused, I mean really confused.
Have you read http://community.logos.com/forums/t/58259.aspx?
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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Thank Fgh. No , had not seen that and did not see a link to it on any of the Logos pages talking about 5.
Now I understand. ( Not sure I agree with everything stated, but do understand ).
I can certainly understand the bandwidth, staffing, phone issues etc.
Thanks again, I really appreciate the link and info.
Blessings all.
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I am on the fence at this point about just upgrading from L4 Platinum to
L5 Platinum still. Are there any Mac users that have done this
upgrade? I would like to hear some feedback as to your experiences
using the new L5. I bought into Accordance because it was fast and
light but it doesn't have a huge wealth of resources. Logos, to me, is
like the research library. It's large and cumbersome and every time it
adds updates or materials, it brings my system to its knees. I only
have 12 gigs of ram and indexing eats the 4 or 5 gigs I have free. When
you want to find something and find it quickly across a vast and huge
library, Logos can most certainly deliver that. I really would love to
hear from somebody that has done this upgrade and has comments on the
ease of searching and overall how the speed is compared to 4. Part of me wants to love this thing to death and pour more money in it and part of me wants to sell the resources for what I can get and just go with Accordance. I've got 4k wrapped up in Platinum and several other resources and am not sure about paying over 700 with taxes to keep me in the game. Right now, there is a 15 percent discount to do that but next week, it might be gone. If I wait for the crossgrade, and I come to figure out that none of my current resources can utilize all this new flashy bells and whistles stuff in 5 and they have yanked the upgrade discount..... I also know that you can't go back. Once you upgrade, it's a one way street. There is no turning back and you have to live with your choice be it good or bad. Right now, I am out a huge chunk of change and am seriously wondering if perhaps I have got myself in the mud up to the axles or not.....0 -
Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
No , had not seen that and did not see a link to it on any of the Logos pages talking about 5.
Actually, it's in Alabama's post two post's before yours, as well as in numerous others elsewhere. Plus it's the third thread from the top in the L5 forum, and the second in General. [;)] But I suspected you hadn't seen it.
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
They want me to spend more money when they have not yet fixed what I already paid for?
Putting on my IT retiree hat, I think the easiest way to explain one of the major forces behind L5. In L4, Logos assumed that they could write for one platform (PC) and if they used the right technology, they could port it easily to a second platform (MAC). That doesn't work regardless of what the people who write development tools say. At some point, Logos probably considered the costs and decided it was cheaper and would provide better user satisfaction if they re-engineered the project planning and testing multiple platforms at the same time. Hence, it was cheaper to provide L5 which works well on both the PC and the MAC than to continue to muddle through L4. I have no inside information and I'm not saying this was the only force, but from my experience ... that's the view from here.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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FGH: I was speaking of the Logos pages about 5. Nothing there but upgrade info as far as I can see, nothing about Crossgrade or free engine.
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Still don't think something is right. If 5 will not work/perform correctly without buying new resources, then I am still having to pay again to get the first purchase to work correctly.
It is what it is.
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Fr. Charles R. Matheny said:
Still don't think something is right. If 5 will not work/perform correctly without buying new resources, then I am still having to pay again to get the first purchase to work correctly.
To effective use new features in Logos 5 needs new content, which has a cost. New content purchase options will range from minimal cross grade to a revamped package purchase. Thankful for dynamic upgrade pricing => http://www.logos.com/upgrade along with option to choose which Logos 5 package. Likewise Thankful for a line indicator on upgrade page to indicate new resource(s), which ranges from 1 to many. The Logos 5 packages have substantial content revision; the difference between a Diamond and Portfolio upgrade for my Logos library is less than 9 % of the regular prices for a number of new interesting resources, which is awesome.
To get the first purchase to work correctly, wonder about opinion of continuing Logos 4 Mac development ?
Personally Thankful for Logos 5 full screen capability on OS X 10.8.2
Keep Smiling [:)]
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alabama24 said:
Who is being forced to upgrade? I think you have misunderstood something along the line. Read Bob's post HEREMike Singer said:
It is pretty uncool that people have have to pay $$$ forced upgradeA reasonable price to upgrade (software) I don't mind. At the same I don't think there is one person in the Logos 4 Mac forums who would willingly stay with version 4.
I would be interested to know what 'underneath the bonnet' changes Logos has made. Is the L5 platform better, and more specifically is the Logos 5 platform/engine better and not as technically hampered as L4 was.
Also - having read Bob's posting - I still have a question about 'upgrading'. When I go to the upgrade page (http://www.logos.com/upgrade) while logged in, it has specific pricing for me, so far so good, and I understand about resources carrying over. However... when I look at the different packages it says, next to Books, the word 'Features'. Under that there is a number of 'features', and the lower packages have significantly less features. Starter has 25, Bronze has 46 and it is not until you get to Platinum that you get all 'Features'. What are they, and do you get a less capable (feature wise) piece of software if you get the lower priced package — because you already have all the content you need at this time."I want to know all God's thoughts; the rest are just details." - Albert Einstein
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