Theological Journals Update

Mark Barnes said:

• It's a real shame that these important journals are no longer available in Logos. I want those journals!
• As I understand from previous posts, this loss is a consequence of Logos wanting to ensure high-quality tagging for all their resources, and Galaxie not being able/willing to agree to the Logos policies that ensure that happens. That's a shame too. I want that high-quality tagging!

Also received the eMail. Agreed! I started this whole process because of the Journals and the great research abilities through the software . . . They still are at the core of my research, writing, and teaching . . . REALLY wish Logos still provided them! Looks like it may well be time to add another software resource as just don't want to work without the Journals!

I received the note as well. It has me considering the options.

I am very afraid that the recent directions of LOGOS will end of with very adverse effects. The primary reason LOGOS has prospered is that they have had the premier resource offerings. Three recent examples have me concerned. The loss of these journals while all the competitors are taking them on. The loss of Moody Publishing. The slowness of providing recent publications like NA28 apparatus, and others.

The incremental improvements in LOGOS software will not overcome the unavailability of key resources. I understand pursuing high profit margin public domain resources, but if the key resources are delayed or are missing because they don't offer the same margins, the result will be lost market share. Many companies that have dominated the market have lost their lead, because they lost focus on the desires of their customer base. A long time LOGOS user and one who has avoided other software companies in the past is concerned. I am feeling compelled to look to other sources. A direction I personally do not desire, nor do I desire others to head this path.

My ramblings.

Mark Smith said:

I still want a fully searchable Logos version. We HAD that and COULD have it. Logos may have had issues with what was being provided but I didn't hear any users complaining about what they were getting. (Did you?) The complaining now is that we can't get what Logos seemingly rejected but we still want. So Logos now offers a high-quality tagged version of nothing. Users of other software will be able to get what we can't. I'll bet they will be complaining like crazy about how defective this product is.

Yes! Please sell me the low-grade, inadequately tagged software which I've used for years and found very acceptable! Or, as mentioned earlier, maybe it's time to settle for the low-grade software from the other suppliers! I too am much put out with this . . .

I just read that email myself. I am bummed out.  Easily a goldmine of information, those journals are going to be missed in future iterations. 

I agree with Jerry.  This and the Android App are what I have been most vocal about.  I would much prefer to go back to Galaxy than to continue with the current Logos TJL publishing, or rather lack thereof.  While I admit that I do not have all the information, based on what I do have and from repsonses I have requested and received from Bob, this is more than frustrating.  It makes me rethink the $6,000 I have invested.  

On the Galaxie web site, you can search ALL of the journals, both by keyword and by verse, and access the articles for $5 a month, or $50 a year. This seems to me to be a much more cost-effective way than paying a huge sum of money to have them in Bible software, whether Logos or elsewhere.

I'm just curious, why is it so important to have in Logos, and why are people planning to switch to other Bible software, instead of just using the web site to access the articles? It has all the search features that I need.

Please can Logos and Galaxie find a solution - I bought Logos SPECIFICALLY for the quantity of Journals available.

If we can't have the high quality taging - can we have something - please

This is most disappointing.

Sigh Kevin

Received the same email too. Very disappointed. As a student, those journals were primary resources....

Very bad decision...

Gilles

Mark said:

But as Logos changes over the years (for a variety of reasons), so also the consumer changes.  Logos needs to always be rethinking their business model just as the consumer needs to always be rethinking his purchasing options.

This is a reality. Loyalty to a product/company only goes so far. In the end consumers will go where their needs are met. I am rooting for LOGOS, but it remains to be seen what is delivered and at what price. I foresee more and more competitive pressure from others, and hope that it results in continuing competitive responses from LOGOS.

Don't forget BAR and similar.....

Mark Barnes said:

Bob Pritchett said:

GregW said:

None of us actually knows what Logos is planning on the Journals front.

Journals are very important to us, and we're working to get more of them into the system. Over the years we've been enhancing our special support for journals (adding the ability to correctly cite a specific article within a volume, for example, at copy and paste -- if the article is correctly tagged with our latest metadata standards, adding the biblio data type, which lets us tag bibliographic entries long before the destination is available, and which will work once it is, etc.). 

I would love to offer access to ATLA's ATLAS content; much of that was licensed exclusively to ATLA, and at the moment appears to only be available through institutional licenses to libraries, etc. I hope we'll either be able to hook into that -- connecting you directly through your institution's license -- or to convince them to offer access direct-to-consumer through Logos.

For a few years now I've subscribed to 'ATLASerials, Religion Collection' (ATLAS), not through an academic institution or library, but through their subscription service to: 'Clergy and Church Administrative Staff'.  This helps when searching through the latest journals, while I wait for them to be made available in Logos. 

I look forward to when the new arrangements with individual publishers will make journals available in Logos directly and hopefully more quickly than has been possible recently. 

Or, better still, access through Logos under a similar scheme to that which I subscribe to at the minute, in line with Bob's hope.

This is VERY disappointing. Logos is a major step toward losing me. And yes, I've read the entire thread. The replies from the Logos reps are actually disconcerting, not comforting. They use sales words like "hope," "our plan," and "great journal content." When I read the phrase, "There's no need to move to another platform," all I could think of was Kevin Bacon in Animal House exclaiming, "Remain calm! All is well!" as he is flattened by a panicked crowd.

IF I were wanting to make a larger profit from a very popular product in my line (notice I said "IF, so please don't threaten me with libel, Bob), here's what I would do:

1. Create a reason to be dissatisfied with the service of the middle man (even though my customers were perfectly happy.)

2. Cancel my contract with the middle man.

3. Tell my subscribers that I HOPE to offer them the same product, that MY PLAN is to satisfy their needs, and that my future product will be GREAT. Just be patient. THERE'S NO NEED to leave.

4. Offer as many of the same journals (oops, I mean "products") as I can individually, not as a package deal. ("New volumes from existing journal series you own will be available on prepub soon.") If they are grouped together as a package, include new "products" that allow me to sell my customers on the idea that it (and the increased cost) is good for them.

Logos is a great product, but the more I feel like they're selling me elephant repellent, the less satisfied I am.

The reality is that I just want updated TJL, even if it has the unconscionable flaw of low-quality tagging.

I will be waiting to see how this pans out- the deciding factor- the $$$$! I have a feeling the days of the $49 upgrade are long gone, and the days of the $100-$200 journal are here.

[:(]

Phil Gons said:

Mark Barnes said:

how long will we have to wait? There's nothing even on prepub, yet...

There's naturally a wait time right now, because we're playing catch-up and establishing direct relationships with each of the journal owners, which takes some time. But we should be able to start delivering new journals to you even sooner than you got them before. We'll probably not hold them up and release them once a year.

Mark Barnes said:

And another question: how much will we have to pay? $1 per volume like TJL and Themelios? $1.50/journal like the Journal of Biblical Counselling, or $6/journal like JBL?

I can't give any detailed commitments on pricing yet, but we definitely want to make them affordable, while covering our costs to produce them. It will likely vary a bit from journal to journal based on complexity, interest, etc.

i am not convinced this is going to be a good outcome for customers. 

I've read the whole forum discussion on this matter, also truly disappointed in the loss of TJL. I was getting ready to purchase the most recent edition of TJL when I received the email from Galaxie. Need to research options at this point.