2LCF & Reformed Baptist Theology

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Milkman | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Feb 5 2020 2:08 PM

I'm just beginning to learn about the Second London Confession and I need some direction.

I know that it's a bit different from the Westminster Confession but I'm not sure in what areas they differ significantly.

I'm assuming that the doctrines such as God, Christ, the Holy Spirit, Sin Providence, Scripture etc., are essentially the same with both reformed Presbyterian and Baptist churches. From what I've read so far there seems to be some disagreement on baptism, the covenants maybe church membership.

I just picked up a few on Amazon:

  1. The Distinctiveness of Baptist Covenant Theology: A Comparison Between Seventeenth-Century Particular Baptist and Paedobaptist Federalism
  2. Faith and Life for Baptists: The Documents of the London Particular Baptist General Assemblies, 1689-1694
  3. Covenant Theology: From Adam to Christ
  4. The Fatal Flaw: The Fatal Flaw of the Theology Behind Infant Baptism

Does anyone know of a theology that somewhat aligns itself with the Second London Confession of Faith (1689)?

It doesn't matter if it's an older print or newer one. 

Or is there an in-depth catechism on the Confession? (LCF)

Pipa has a study book on the Westminster Confession in Logos but once again I'm not too sure what the major differences are between the LCF and WCF. I suppose I could go through Pipa's study and when he touches on those areas of differences between both Confessions I'd simply be mindful of the differences and read on.

So far I've found that there are two differences between the Confessions.

  • the Covenants
  • baptism.

Sam Waldron has, A Modern Exposition of the 1689 Baptist Confession of Faith 5th Edition on Amazon and it seems like a good book to purchase. However, I'd like to see if Logos has any systematic that once again aligns itself with the LCF or even a catechism on it.

Any help/suggestions/advice would be much appreciated!

mm. 

mm.

Posts 3148
David Taylor Jr | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 5 2020 4:43 PM

Benjamin Keach, a signatory of the 1689 London Confession, wrote a catechism.

https://www.logos.com/product/161139/the-baptist-catechism-commonly-called-keachs-catechism-or-a-brief-instruction-in-the-principles-of-the-christian-religion 

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Posts 237
Kevin Olson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 5 2020 7:13 PM

Milkman:

I'm just beginning to learn about the Second London Confession and I need some direction.

I know that it's a bit different from the Westminster Confession but I'm not sure in what areas they differ significantly.

Here is a handy side by side comparison: 

https://www.proginosko.com/docs/wcf_lbcf.html

Posts 3455
Milkman | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 5 2020 8:19 PM

Thanks David. And Kevin that side by side was something I had been hoping to find. Where did you get it? 

mm.

Posts 3455
Milkman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 6 2020 9:11 AM

Could somebody explain the covenant of works and Jesus? Never heard that before. Did He have a covenant with the Father prior to His incarnation??

I just read this from founders dot org

For our Baptist forefathers, an alteration of the doctrine of the covenants is an alteration of the gospel of Jesus Christ. The gospel, in its broader context, includes the fulfilling of the covenant of works by the Second Adam, Jesus the Christ, that was broken by the first Adam; the Second Adam endured its curses and established its blessings for all those who are chosen by God to be represented by the Second Adam in the covenant of grace.

mm.

Posts 3148
David Taylor Jr | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 6 2020 9:14 AM

Milkman:

Could somebody explain the covenant of works and Jesus? Never heard that before. Did He have a covenant with the Father prior to His incarnation??

I just read this from founders dot org

For our Baptist forefathers, an alteration of the doctrine of the covenants is an alteration of the gospel of Jesus Christ. The gospel, in its broader context, includes the fulfilling of the covenant of works by the Second Adam, Jesus the Christ, that was broken by the first Adam; the Second Adam endured its curses and established its blessings for all those who are chosen by God to be represented by the Second Adam in the covenant of grace.

Just remember we can discuss resources, but we aren't supposed to have theological discussion on this particular forum.

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Posts 1937
Donnie Hale | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 6 2020 11:02 AM

Milkman:
Could somebody explain the covenant of works and Jesus? Never heard that before. Did He have a covenant with the Father prior to His incarnation??

I'm reluctant to directly answer your question since it strays into violation of forum rules. But you can find answers to your questions if you read up on the "covenant of redemption" (intra-trinitarian "covenant" prior to creation) and the "covenant of works". P&R and covenantal Baptists agree (generally speaking) on covenant of redemption, covenant of works, and covenant of grace (as reflected in WCF and 2LCF).

Donnie

Posts 3455
Milkman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 6 2020 12:05 PM

Fair enough. Although I wasn't looking for a debate. I think those rules don't apply when asking for any helps in Logos products. Besides I couldn't carry on a debate about this subject anyway Tongue Tied

So if you or anyone else knows of any resources that would be helpful I'm all ears.

PS. Thanks for the your answer.

Donnie Hale:

Milkman:
Could somebody explain the covenant of works and Jesus? Never heard that before. Did He have a covenant with the Father prior to His incarnation??

I'm reluctant to directly answer your question since it strays into violation of forum rules. But you can find answers to your questions if you read up on the "covenant of redemption" (intra-trinitarian "covenant" prior to creation) and the "covenant of works". P&R and covenantal Baptists agree (generally speaking) on covenant of redemption, covenant of works, and covenant of grace (as reflected in WCF and 2LCF).

Donnie

mm.

Posts 660
Michael S. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 1 2020 9:42 AM

As I am sure you know by now, chapter 7 is the largest difference between the 2 confessions.  I have found the 1689 Federalism site to be most helpful.  Any lectures by Brandon Adams, Richard Barcellos, Sam Renihan and Samuel Waldron are helpful.  Logos has a Reformed Baptist collection that has good material... we have asked for new materials in this theological vein to be added, but so far not much luck.

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