irritating link action between Bible and commentary

Hi Greg

Now in v5 if the commentary covers a range of verses my Bible will jump to the entered verse and then adjust itself to the first verse in the corresponding commentary section. So irritating!!!

I can't see this (running on Windows and with 5.0b RC1) if I type the reference into th Bible panel. In the screenshot below I have just typed Heb 10:2 into the Bible window with the Bible linked to a commentary which has multiple verse ranges. As you can see the Bible position ends up where I asked it to be

If I type the verse into the commentary panel then both Bible and commentary end up at the beginning of the range of verses which include the verse I requested. This will be because the commentary will have verses set in groups and will navigate on that basis.

Are you seeing something different? If so, can you provide a few more details - Bible translations, commentary you are using, verse range?

Thanks, Graham

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456189#Comment_456189

Hi Greg

Now in v5 if the commentary covers a range of verses my Bible will jump to the entered verse and then adjust itself to the first verse in the corresponding commentary section. So irritating!!!

I can't see this (running on Windows and with 5.0b RC1) if I type the reference into th Bible panel. In the screenshot below I have just typed Heb 10:2 into the Bible window with the Bible linked to a commentary which has multiple verse ranges. As you can see the Bible position ends up where I asked it to be

If I type the verse into the commentary panel then both Bible and commentary end up at the beginning of the range of verses which include the verse I requested. This will be because the commentary will have verses set in groups and will navigate on that basis.

Are you seeing something different? If so, can you provide a few more details - Bible translations, commentary you are using, verse range?

Thanks, Graham

What you picture is what I use to get all the time in v4 when I entered a verse into the Bible panel. Now when I type a reference into the Bible panel, hit enter, it acts like I entered the verse into the commentary panel. It does exactly what you described for entering the verse into the commentary.

I just tried several combinations of Bibles and commentaries. It does what I described with different combinations most of the time. There are times when it acts like it's suppose to but more often than not it does what I've described.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456247#Comment_456247

Hi Greg

I just tried several combinations of Bibles and commentaries. It does what I described with different combinations most of the time.

Can you give a few examples of BIbles / Commentaries you have tried so I can see if I can reproduce it?

Graham

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456249#Comment_456249

I'm using a mac.
NIV / Bible Knowledge Commentary - I use this combo the most

ESV Bible

NAC Commentary

Tyndale Commentary

Thru the Bible Commentary

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456263#Comment_456263

Interesting

I don't see this behaviour when using ESV and NAC but I do see if when using NIV and BKC - an example which shows this is entering Acts 2:20 in NIV and you end up in Acts 2:16-21 which matches the range in the BKC.

Hopefully Logos will comment on this.

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456284#Comment_456284

Hey Guys,

I am unable to reproduce this behavior on Mac or Windows. The behavior you're describing sounds like it may be the expected behavior when scrolling through a commentary. Most commentaries have milestones for passage ranges (v1-3), not every verse (v1, 2 and 3). Without this 1-to-1 ratio, a linked Bible will appear to jump as you activate each milestone. This is because the commentary is essentially "driving" the navigation. Scrolling instead in your Bible, should operate more smoothly.

I tested this with the Bible Knowledge Commentary, linked to the NIV (2011) and NIV (1984) at Acts 2:10-30, both directions. I tried "driving" from each window, and only saw the jumping behavior when scrolling in the BKC.

If I'm missing a step, please let me know and I'll be glad to investigate further.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/456995#Comment_456995

It will jump when entering a verse in the bible that happens to be in the middle of a milestone in the commentary. The bible will then jump to the first verse of the commentary milestone.

If I restart logos then it will act like it's suppose to for a while.

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459554#Comment_459554

Hi Greg,

Are you using the "Columns" view for your resources? You can check this by clicking the panel icon (book cover).

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459561#Comment_459561

I checked it but how can I tell which is selected? It shows none, 1,2,3,4,5 and auto but it doesn't look like any one is selected.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459561#Comment_459561

Hi Mike

Are you using the "Columns" view for your resources?

I see the jumping behaviour described above with Columns set to "Auto" - I do not see it with Columns set to "None"

Graham

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459625#Comment_459625

Hi Greg

I checked it but how can I tell which is selected? It shows none, 1,2,3,4,5 and auto but it doesn't look like any one is selected.

With columns set to "none" you have a slider on the right-hand side of the resource

With columns set to "auto" you have no scroll bar but you do have left/right buttons at the bottom-right of the resource

I agree it would be good if these were shown clearly in the selection box

Graham

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459716#Comment_459716

I think I got it guys. Thanks for the additional info. This only occurs in columned view where more than 1 column is visible, or so it seems. Can you confirm on your end? I'll report a bug on it.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459823#Comment_459823

Hi Mike

I think I got it guys. Thanks for the additional info. This only occurs in columned view where more than 1 column is visible, or so it seems. Can you confirm on your end? I'll report a bug on it.

That seems to be right.

Thanks, Graham

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459838#Comment_459838

I just turned columns to none in both my bible and commentary. I'll see how that goes. Thank you.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/459922#Comment_459922

Now it's doing it all the time. Turning columns to none doesn't doesn't help.

SWSovereign

This wouldn't happen if Logos were to implement an option for parent/child (or master/slave) linking as is found in competing products. What I mean by this is that the behavior would be that the "child" resource (in this case the commentary but could be any type of resource) would follow the position of the "parent" resource (in this case the Bible) but changes in position of the "child" resource would have no effect on the position of the "parent" (or other linked) resource. Of course, you would be limited to having only one "parent" resource for each link set.

Logos is a great product and there aren't very many things that I would change if I could but implementing would be #1 on my list. I can't believe that Logos hasn't already thought about doing this and that more people aren't clamoring for it.

SWSovereign

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471113#Comment_471113

I meant to include that while a user would be limited to only one "parent" resource, there could be multiple "child" resources.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471115#Comment_471115

We clamoured for it. In fact there's a whole vocabulary (yours additing to it). Bob doesn't like it.

So smart Logos users don't link their commentaries to their Bibles. Or put scotch tape on the computer screen over the commentary scroll bar.

SWSovereign

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471131#Comment_471131

I've posted several other times about this request and had previously searched the forums for a discussion about it and didn't see much about it, but if Logos has already considered this, I find it a little disconcerting that it hasn't been implemented because Bob doesn't like it. If his concerns are because it would somehow degrade performance that might be understandable, but since competitors have long since implemented it, I don't understand how it couldn't be implemented efficiently. On the other hand, if he just doesn't care for that functionality personally, I am only suggesting that it be optional on a link by link basis, so users would be free to use it or not, so that objection doesn't make sense to me either.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471113#Comment_471113

This wouldn't happen if Logos were to implement an option for parent/child (or master/slave) linking as is found in competing products. What I mean by this is that the behavior would be that the "child" resource (in this case the commentary but could be any type of resource) would follow the position of the "parent" resource (in this case the Bible) but changes in position of the "child" resource would have no effect on the position of the "parent" (or other linked) resource. Of course, you would be limited to having only one "parent" resource for each link set.

[Y]

Here's more clamor in the echo chamber.......

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471162#Comment_471162

In version 4 I never had this problem. In version 5 it's a real pain to have the text jump as you start to read it and then have to find where it decided to move to.

This makes me want to go back to version 4. I should be able to enter a verse and have it come up at the top of the screen with the linked commentary matching as close as it can.

It worked like that every previous version!!!

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471113#Comment_471113

This wouldn't happen if Logos were to implement an option for parent/child (or master/slave) linking as is found in competing products.

Go vote for Linked Commentaries The current implementation of linked commentaries has some difficulties.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471239#Comment_471239

Go vote for Linked Commentaries The current implementation of linked commentaries has some difficulties.

I cast a few votes for this. This is something that is greatly needed in Logos! Most users do not need dual linking but rather one way linking from Bible to commentary instead of both Bible to commentary and commentary to Bible. One way linking should be the standard and then an option could be included that would allow someone to choose 2 way linking. Many other Bible software has this ability, and it would be greatly helpful in Logos as the leader in Bible software. It doesn't seem like it would be that difficult of a thing to implement. -Then again, I'm no programmer.

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471353#Comment_471353

Most users do not need dual linking

Whatever makes you say that? I use 'dual' linking all the time, but have never felt any particular need for your kind. I don't link between Bible and commentary, I link between Greek/Hebrew and English/Swedish. I need all texts to be at the exact same spot.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471466#Comment_471466

I link between Greek/Hebrew and English/Swedish.

Whatever makes you say that?

Hey FGH, I guess I wasn't thinking of the original language users! (probably because I can't read the original languages!). That makes sense that it would work well for what you are doing. Now I see the use for the dual linking! I mostly use Logos for reading commentaries on the passage that I'm studying.

When I first got Logos I was really disapointed about the inability to one way link because whenever I scrolled my commentary it would lose my spot in my Bible. Since then I keep all my commentaries that aren't verse for verse (but section by section) unlinked, because it ruins linking on my Bible and all my linked commentaries if I have several open. I had the olive tree app on my phone before I purchased a Logos base package and was used to the one way linking from that app. It seems to me though, for reading commentaries, one way linking would be much much better than the current dual linking system.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471729#Comment_471729

That's an interesting point, Liam. I suspect you're probably in the sizable majority (all users; not just forum). But the linking only works well for the minority. Actually the latter isn't quite true entirely. I keep a string of hebrew lexicons linked and similarly greek. But when I 'touch' one that doesn't have the lemma, everybody looses their place! Grrrrrr.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/471770#Comment_471770

Is this ever going to get fixed? I can't use the link function because when I scroll my bible plane and start reading a few seconds later the linked commentary will make the bible text jump to match the commentary. This is so frustrating. I wish I could go back to Logos 4!!!!!!

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528411#Comment_528411

I wish I could go back to Logos 4!!!!!!

You can. http://community.logos.com/forums/t/75016.aspx

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528413#Comment_528413

I thought once your library was updated to 5 then you couldn't go back to 4?

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528415#Comment_528415

Also will I loose the books I got with 5 upgrade because they're not 4 compatible?

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528415#Comment_528415

I thought once your library was updated to 5 then you couldn't go back to 4?

You can't "update" to L4, but you can certainly go back to L4. You will have to do a clean install. I believe this would include redownloading all resources.

Also will I loose the books I got with 5 upgrade because they're not 4 compatible?

You will lose the new features of L5, but certainly many/most of the resources purchased with an L5 base package would be compatible with L4.

[I'm not really suggesting you do this, but you can.]

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528417#Comment_528417

I thought once your library was updated to 5 then you couldn't go back to 4?

You can't "update" to L4, but you can certainly go back to L4. You will have to do a clean install. I believe this would include redownloading all resources.

Also will I loose the books I got with 5 upgrade because they're not 4 compatible?

You will lose the new features of L5, but certainly many/most of the resources purchased with an L5 base package would be compatible with L4.

[I'm not really suggesting you do this, but you can.]

The resources will be compatible as Logos 4 is maintained that way and also to sync with Logos 5. But there might be issues with Logos 4 that can only be resolved by going to Logos 5!

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528411#Comment_528411

I wish I could go back to Logos 4!!!!!!

Greg, I haven't noticed any difference between the linking in L4 and L5. In my experience they both have 2 way linking (each resource links to the other and changes the position of the other to it's location when moved). What was it in L4 that was different for you?

...I would much prefer one way linking where only a primary resource would determine the location of the other secondary (slave) resources (as in the case with a Bible and commentaries).

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/528526#Comment_528526

Hey Greg, I just reread the first page of the post and found that you were refering to something else entirely. I haven't ever had this problem in L5, but I typically use the ESV. Maybe the problem only occurs in particular Bible translations? Hopefully Logos will find what is causing the problem for you.

(.. of course they could just implement one way linking and solve the whole issue for everyone...?)