4.2 beta 3 INSTANT parallel resources

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Clinton Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 12:52 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:
Having been one of the biggest complainers about slow parallel resources

Hi Mark,

I don't know if you are the biggest, I have been complaining about this too and I am 6' 6" tall which makes me bigger than 99% of the population.

I too am grateful that this feature finally works the way it should have from the beginning.

Thanks Logos.

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Bradley Grainger (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:12 PM | Locked

Dave Hooton:

But not necessarily accurate. On a Strong's Number in type:lexicons (19 resources) I'll get 12 resources of which half don't have an index! On another occasion I'll see 6 resources in Lexicons.

Can you provide some details or a screenshot?

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Bradley Grainger (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:28 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:

Having been one of the biggest complainers about slow parallel resources, can I just say a very big thank you for quietly slipping out this improvement. Would you care to share what, technically you have done?

We started caching resource collections; collections are no longer re-evaluated every time the menu is dropped down. This will also help a lot for users with nested collections.

We also eliminated code that opens every resource in the "All Parallel Resources" collection and checks if it actually has the current reference; instead, we use metadata about the range of references that the resource contains to detect (much more quickly) if the resource is very likely to have the current reference. This logic was already being used for custom collections; we just extended it to All Parallel Resources.

Mark Barnes:

Some bugs do remain, however, seemingly with resources with an irregular coverage. For example, opening a commentary to 2 Corinthians 5:21 shows Harotounian's Calvin commentary whose index jumps about all over the place, and you just end up going to the title page.

This is a result of the less precise (but much quicker) verification that is happening in Beta 3. You would have experienced exactly the same behaviour in Beta 2 if Calvin: Commentaries (Haroutunian) was in a custom collection; in Beta 3, it's also now happening in "All Parallel Resources".

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spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:34 PM | Locked

Bradley Grainger:
This is a result of the less precise (but much quicker) verification that is happening in Beta 3. You would have experienced exactly the same behaviour in Beta 2 if Calvin: Commentaries (Haroutunian) was in a custom collection; in Beta 3, it's also now happening in "All Parallel Resources".

I'll take the compromise. Good choice in my book.

Posts 397
T Gerold Castle | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:38 PM | Locked

Philip Spitzer:

Bradley Grainger:
This is a result of the less precise (but much quicker) verification that is happening in Beta 3. You would have experienced exactly the same behaviour in Beta 2 if Calvin: Commentaries (Haroutunian) was in a custom collection; in Beta 3, it's also now happening in "All Parallel Resources".

I'll take the compromise. Good choice in my book.

 

Just so I understand... are you saying that because of the quicker verification process, that we may receive 'hits' in the parallel resource drop down that isn't applicable to our text? How is that helpful at all? I'd rather wait a few seconds and know that I'm getting what I'm looking for. If I save time on the search but waste time on looking through a resource that doesn't have my applicable text is not helpful.

Did I misunderstand?

In HIS Eternal Service,
Tom Castle
**If we will do God's work, in God's way, at God's time, with God's power, we shall have God's blessings!!**

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spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:43 PM | Locked

Tom:

Just so I understand... are you saying that because of the quicker verification process, that we may receive 'hits' in the parallel resource drop down that isn't applicable to our text? How is that helpful at all? I'd rather wait a few seconds and know that I'm getting what I'm looking for. If I save time on the search but waste time on looking through a resource that doesn't have my applicable text is not helpful.

Did I misunderstand?

I'm assuming its something along the lines of:

the current verse is 1 Cor 1:3, the parallel resource panel shows all commentaries that cover 1 Corinthians. One commentary may cover verses 2 and 4, but not three. It will be shown anyway.

I'd rather it show such a commentary. It may show me context that I would miss otherwise. I'm sure there will be differences of opinion, but this is mine.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 1:58 PM | Locked

Philip Spitzer:
I'd rather it show such a commentary.

I agree, but for it to be useful, it needs to take me to the nearest verse. Currently it just dumps me at the title page.

That said, in an ideal world, I'd like it to be accurate and fast. I hope this development is a step towards that, not a 'this will do instead'.

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spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 2:09 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:
I agree, but for it to be useful, it needs to take me to the nearest verse. Currently it just dumps me at the title page.

I didn't realize that. It does need to get you to the closest verse.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 3:26 PM | Locked

Bradley Grainger:

Dave Hooton:

But not necessarily accurate. On a Strong's Number in type:lexicons (19 resources) I'll get 12 resources of which half don't have an index! On another occasion I'll see 6 resources in Lexicons.

Can you provide some details or a screenshot?

Open DBL Greek and set the reference to G4033:-

Jump to Enhanced Strong's:-

Note 1. ESL initially showed the corresponding GK number, not the Strong's number.

        2. If i jump back to DBL Greek it shows the same Lexicon list as ESL!

        3. A similar case is G4100, but when it goes back to DBL Gk the list is the same 6 as ESL

        4. It does not occur for all references in DBL Gk, nor is it repeatable for the ones I've shown here.

        5. The story is the same for DBL Hebrew to ESL and back.

        6. ESL can also give a verbose list & jumping to DBL provides the shorter list!

Dave
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PL | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 4:47 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:

I agree, but for it to be useful, it needs to take me to the nearest verse. Currently it just dumps me at the title page.

 

I agree.  

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Bradley Grainger (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 6:00 PM | Locked

Tom:

I'd rather wait a few seconds and know that I'm getting what I'm looking for.

To wait (more than a few seconds), click the + sign (in the tab bar) to add a new tab; it still performs an precise search for parallel resources (and shows the results as they arrive).

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 6:20 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:

Philip Spitzer:
I'd rather it show such a commentary.

I agree, but for it to be useful, it needs to take me to the nearest verse. Currently it just dumps me at the title page.

That said, in an ideal world, I'd like it to be accurate and fast. I hope this development is a step towards that, not a 'this will do instead'.

Look at The New Manners and Customs of the Bible. In Romans it has articles for:-

  • 7:24
  • 8:15
  • 16:16

The result from Parallel Resources for verses in Ro 1-6 incl. will be the front page, but the result for chapters is 7:24.

  • Verses in ch 7 go to 7:24.
  • Ro 7:25 will go to Ro 7:24.
  • Verses in ch 8 go to 8:15.
  • Chapters 9-15 go to 8:15
  • Verses in ch 9-15 go to the front page
  • etc.

PG works similarly, but does not list the commentary when Parallel Resources will dump you at the front page. Therefore Parallel Resources is just as accurate as PG!

Dave
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David McAllan | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 20 2010 9:18 PM | Locked

I also want to say thank you to Logos for the speed improvement on parallel resources. I'm now using this feature. Great job!

David
https://www.echucacommunitychurch.com

Specs: HP Pavilion dv6-6137tx ; i7 2 GHz; 8 gb RAM; 2 gb Graphics; 750 Gb HD; Win 10; Bitdefender Antivirus.

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Bradley Grainger (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 21 2010 9:50 AM | Locked

Dave Hooton:

Open DBL Greek and set the reference to G4033:-

[snip]

OK, I see the problem here, but I'm pretty sure this is exactly how 4.1 behaved. (The optimisation only changed how the "All Parallel Resources" list was created, it didn't change how the list for a custom collection is created, what happens when you jump to a parallel resource, etc.) I'll file bugs on the issues you've raised.

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Bradley Grainger (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 21 2010 9:59 AM | Locked

Mark Barnes:

I agree, but for it to be useful, it needs to take me to the nearest verse. Currently it just dumps me at the title page.

That said, in an ideal world, I'd like it to be accurate and fast. I hope this development is a step towards that, not a 'this will do instead'.

This is exactly the same behaviour as 4.1 for resources in a custom collection; in 4.2 Beta 3, that behaviour is now exposed from the "All parallel resources" menu. So this has been a longstanding bug; on the bright side, if we fix it, it fixes both custom collections and "All parallel resources".

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 21 2010 10:02 AM | Locked

Bradley Grainger:
This is exactly the same behaviour as 4.1 for resources in a custom collection;

Strange we didn't spot it before. I guess that's because almost all of our commentaries do comment on every passage at some level or other.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 21 2010 4:31 PM | Locked

Bradley Grainger:
OK, I see the problem here, but I'm pretty sure this is exactly how 4.1 behaved.

Yes. I'd reported this behaviour some time ago, but hopefully we are now moving toward similar results for custom collections.

Dave
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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 21 2010 5:00 PM | Locked

Mark Barnes:
Strange we didn't spot it before.

It used to crash for custom collections and now we get the front page for custom + All Parallel! The additional issue for custom collections is inconsistently displaying a resource when it has no index for the required data type (my reply to Bradley).

Mark Barnes:
I guess that's because almost all of our commentaries do comment on every passage at some level or other.

The algorithm for matching passages gives a very good chance of getting a hit in a half-way decent commentary (unlike New Manners and Customs of the Bible!).

Dave
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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 16 2010 4:54 PM | Locked

Bradley Grainger:

Dave Hooton:

Open DBL Greek and set the reference to G4033:-

[snip]

OK, I see the problem here, but I'm pretty sure this is exactly how 4.1 behaved. (The optimisation only changed how the "All Parallel Resources" list was created, it didn't change how the list for a custom collection is created, what happens when you jump to a parallel resource, etc.) I'll file bugs on the issues you've raised.

Thank you. 4.2 Beta 7 has stabilised the tracking of data type in resources with multiple indexes {Active reference data type is reserved when switching parallel resources}.

Dave
===

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