I'm blown away at the power of L4: a skeptic repents

Page 1 of 6 (109 items) 1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last »
This post has 108 Replies | 6 Followers

Posts 143
iamk | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:01 AM

Wow! I think an apology is in order on my behalf. I grumbled when I first tried L4, but after using it I now realize how much power has been packed into this program. 

Logos, I apologize for grumbling. :) Thanks for your efforts.

I would like to encourage other users who are struggling to press on in their efforts to learn the program. It really is an improvement.

I am especially excited about what improvements will be made in subsequent upgrades and releases. 

 

Posts 1706
LogosEmployee
Bob Pritchett | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:04 AM

Thanks for taking the time to post this -- it's a great encouragement. I'm glad you're finding it useful.

Posts 221
James Thompson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:10 AM

Amen! Luke 15:7!

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:17 AM

KevinJones:

Wow! I think an apology is in order on my behalf. I grumbled when I first tried L4, but after using it I now realize how much power has been packed into this program. 

Logos, I apologize for grumbling. :) Thanks for your efforts.

I would like to encourage other users who are struggling to press on in their efforts to learn the program. It really is an improvement.

I am especially excited about what improvements will be made in subsequent upgrades and releases. 

Praise the Lord for enriching us with such great tools!

 

Posts 350
Chuck P. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:41 AM

It's gettin' more gooderer and gooderer every time I use it and I know nuttin' but improvements are coming on down to us...

Chuck

Laptop: Lenovo P580 - 15.6" IdeaPad Laptop
 - 6GB Memory - 750GB Hard Drive - Windows 7
 Iphone5s            Logos 7, Bronze

Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 11:54 AM

KevinJones:
Wow! I think an apology is in order on my behalf. I grumbled when I first tried L4, but after using it I now realize how much power has been packed into this program. 
Beta testers had much the same feeling..  People have trouble adapting to a new workflow.  But with some effort, it is worth it!

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 18902
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 12:14 PM

Bob Pritchett just tweeted this: The case for un-perfected software: "if you aren't embarrassed by v1.0 you didn't release it early enough" http://bit.ly/7bHI4a

I read the article that link pointed to and was about to give a cheeky reply to Bob: "That's fine for v1.0, but not for 4.0..." But then read the article that article pointed to about interating rapidly based on real world feedback. And I can see how it's working here with Logos 4, so I'm more and more OK with them having released it in such an unfinished state. I am being dragged kicking and screaming into this era of the new software development methodology. The world at large hasn't bought into it yet, and a lot of unsuspecting users will not be happy with this model for the forseeable future, until we get a new generation of people who grew up with software being this way. I guess I'm dating myself. I'm one of the dinosaurs who cut my development teeth on The Mythical Man-Month and other such ancient classics.

But I still think Logos 4 is great and is only getting better with every release. So let's keep 'em coming. I'm still on SR7. When does 4.0a ship? I can't afford the time to be in permanent beta mode all the time so I'm not going to participate in the beta for that even though I did for 4.0.

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 12:18 PM

Rosie Perera:
I read the article that link pointed to and was about to give a cheeky reply to Bob: "That's fine for v1.0, but not for 4.0..." But then read the article that article pointed to about interating rapidly based on real world feedback.

Well, I didn't read the article but the thought that I've had in the past seems to be where this article might be heading. We could have it one of two ways. Logos could wait until add ducks are in a row and the product is finely tuned,  and we are left with whatever they give us for a long time. Or, they can release it early in the process, and give us a chance to help steer the ship so that in 6 months to a year we have a product refined significantly by real user feedback. I'll go for the later.

Posts 334
Paul Strickert | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 12:28 PM

The fact that (the unfinished) L4 was released just in time for Christmas, I suppose, is just a coincidence.  Wink

Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 12:36 PM

Personally, I like this development model as it fits with my Engineering background and leadership style.  I guess that is where the difficulty comes when some folks have a different personality, set of experiences and expectations.  Then again, as church leaders we are always working with people who have different learning styles so one would think there would be a more generous spirit toward accepting different approaches.

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 18902
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 12:54 PM

Philip Spitzer:

We could have it one of two ways. Logos could wait until add ducks are in a row and the product is finely tuned,  and we are left with whatever they give us for a long time. Or, they can release it early in the process, and give us a chance to help steer the ship so that in 6 months to a year we have a product refined significantly by real user feedback. I'll go for the later.

Yeah, me too. But I do hope that after 6 months to a year of constant changes it settles down for a couple of years so we can use it productively without having to keep adapting to it as it changes out from under us. Then in a few years, I'll be willing to go through another 4-week learning curve. But I'd rather do the adaptation to change in big chunks like that than have a new surprise every two weeks. It gets overwhelming, the amount of change we have to deal with these days...in everything! I don't think it's good for our souls, as we can never rest. Isaiah 30:15

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 1:02 PM

Rosie Perera:
It gets overwhelming, the amount of change we have to deal with these days...in everything! I don't think it's good for our souls, as we can never rest.

as much as I love change and trying out new software I must confess I think there is a lot of truth in what you've said. Wise guy say "He who tries many ways to do things does nothing well one way."

Posts 1357
Edwin Bowden | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 1:25 PM

Rosie Perera:

Philip Spitzer:

We could have it one of two ways. Logos could wait until add ducks are in a row and the product is finely tuned,  and we are left with whatever they give us for a long time. Or, they can release it early in the process, and give us a chance to help steer the ship so that in 6 months to a year we have a product refined significantly by real user feedback. I'll go for the later.

 

Yeah, me too. But I do hope that after 6 months to a year of constant changes it settles down for a couple of years so we can use it productively without having to keep adapting to it as it changes out from under us. Then in a few years, I'll be willing to go through another 4-week learning curve. But I'd rather do the adaptation to change in big chunks like that than have a new surprise every two weeks. It gets overwhelming, the amount of change we have to deal with these days...in everything! I don't think it's good for our souls, as we can never rest. Isaiah 30:15

I bought my first personal computer in 1982. Things were in constant change way back then.

One of the first things that I learned in my research the year before I bought that computer (Osborne 64K 28 lb. portable computer for $1895.00), was never buy version 1.0 of anything. That is why dBase II never had a dBase 1.0.

I have been following the forum discussions since the release of L4.

This forum has provided the "refining" of FAQ's and techniques as well as identified problems and strengths. I will soon be ready to jump into the cold water of a new version of Logos after observing the discussions.

One of the other phrases I learned in researching my first computer purchase is "cutting edge is bleeding edge."

Posts 3705
BillS | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 1:49 PM

Philip Spitzer:
Or, they can release it early in the process, and give us a chance to help steer the ship so that in 6 months to a year we have a product refined significantly by real user feedback. I'll go for the later.

Yes +1

Bill

Grace & Peace,
Bill


MSI GF63 8RD, I-7 8850H, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, NVIDIA GTX 1050Max
Samsung S9+, 64GB
Fire 10HD 64GB 7th Gen

Posts 273
Ken Avery | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 1:54 PM

Being one of the complainers; I would be happy if L4 would stop crashing Hmm

Posts 3863
Forum MVP
Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 2:10 PM

You know, I haven't had that happen yet.  Are you talking PC or Mac?  I run PC.  I have noted when others have talked about crashing (like dragging to shortcuts) and I avoided that.  But generally I just muddle through L4 and nothing crashes. Sorry you are going thru that.

 

Btw, anyone know if the "drag to shortcuts" still causes crashes?

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

Posts 65
Arthur Balis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 2:10 PM

I never really enjoyed being a guinea pig.  I like it a lot less when I unknowingly pay for the experience.

-my 2 cents.

 

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 2:14 PM

Arthur Balis:

I never really enjoyed being a guinea pig.  I like it a lot less when I unknowingly pay for the experience.

-my 2 cents.

I can certainly understand and sympathize with the other side of the coin.

Posts 634
Bill Shewmaker | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 2:19 PM

Daniel DeVilder:

Btw, anyone know if the "drag to shortcuts" still causes crashes?

Daniel,

I'm not sure if it has been officially fixed or not, but you can copy shortcuts now. You can even launch programs from the computer desktop by dragging and dropping a shortcut to L4. I have an L3 shortcut in L4 temporarily (I hope), so I can do my prayer journaling and stuff like that.

Posts 285
David Gullick | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2009 2:23 PM

I did some dragging just now and it didn't crash = )

Logos Platinum

Windows 7 - 64 Bit
Lenovo laptop E520 i7-2640M, 2.8GHz 8G Ram, 2G Graphics

Australia

Page 1 of 6 (109 items) 1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last » | RSS