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This post has 72 Replies | 4 Followers

Posts 273
Rev. Kelly Todd | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:13 AM

Bob, I think that it is very important that we all realize that there is no one product that is a match for everyone.  I went to the ESV, and am happier than I was with the NIV.  there are even more tools for it.

Posts 11
John Williston | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:20 AM

Yup. That's exactly what I'm after. I'm not denying that there are other translations of merit or anything silly like that. It's just that the NIV is the devil I know; i.e., I know where it's not a great rendering from the Greek, so it's the version I want to carry with me to church and everywhere else. Logos on my iPad makes it easy to take every other version I don't need. I wish for it to provide me the one version I do need.

Posts 352
Mike & Rachel Aubrey | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:27 AM

Rev. Kelly Todd:

Bob, I think that it is very important that we all realize that there is no one product that is a match for everyone.  I went to the ESV, and am happier than I was with the NIV.  there are even more tools for it.

That makes sense. The RSV is a beautiful translation.

Posts 273
Rev. Kelly Todd | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:29 AM

Yet as you have seen for nearly 2 years it has not happened nor is it likely to happen any time soon from the looks of things.  Thus your choices are to...

1. complain about it.

2. change to a new translation.

3.  Change to a new app... 

The choice is an individual one, and likely to be different for each of us, however, the one option that has not worked for nearly 2 years now, is the 1 first one!  God's blessings on your personal search for a remedy.  

Posts 11
John Williston | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:36 AM

I'm going with a mix of (1) and (3). Companies don't change unless customers hold their feet to the fire, which motivates me toward (1). In the meantime, (3) is my only option to keep the NIV with me until Logos figures out how to do what virtually every other company has already accomplished.

Posts 251
Rod | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 8:42 AM

YouVersion is a free iPad/iPhone app and has the NIV (84 and current) available IF you are connected to a network BUT they do not permit you to download it to your iPad/iPhone.  As a result, you can use the NIV when you are on the network but not when you are off.

It would be nice if Logos on the iPad would allow one to read the NIV when one is on the network but that may have more to do with the functionality of the Logos iPad app (which is missing a lot of basic functionality) than it does about different rights given to one app provider over the other.

From the apps that I have seen it appears that Zondervan does not want to permit anyone to download the NIV to their mobile device at present.  Hopefully this will change.

Posts 41
RichGrif | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 9:03 AM

I believe there is another option that Logos should provide: offer the opportunity for those who so choose to pay for a liscense to use the NIV on their iPhone or iPad.  I know many people will not want to do this but a few crazies like me who are anchored in on the NIV will do so.  Reaching the twilight of my mediocre career I do not want to adopt another translation (even though there are several out there).

I have read the fears of some who say this would be disasterous as it would break down how the electronic publishing system works.  I'm sorry, I do not see that at all.  

I am sure Logos is actively trying to solve the problem and I respect their intentions.  I am also sure they would prefer not to offer the second purchase option but to just keep working on it to get the all-or-none result.  I believe offering the option to purchase the NIV on the iPhone and iPad is overdue.

Posts 11
John Williston | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 9:13 AM

Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! I'll happily fork over extra to have the NIV on my iPad. I don't mind paying for value; that's what capitalism is all about. I just want the option. Or any option with Logos for that matter.

Posts 273
Rev. Kelly Todd | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 9:14 AM

I do agree John, that unless we say something about our displeasure, nothing will change.  However, for nearly two years now, this same discussion has been going on, on a nearly weekly basis... it is not working and it has gotten very old.  Likely, for those who are needing the NIV, they will need a new app.

Posts 11
John Williston | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 9:18 AM

Have faith :)

Posts 273
Rev. Kelly Todd | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 9:35 AM

And I do have faith, that based on what God has set before me, using the intellect that He has given me, I honestly don't expect a NIV translation any time soon.... Logos will not allow a fee for use on the app, and Zondervan does not seem to want to budge either... so, in faith, I do not expect to see it until zondervan is shown that their model is not going to work for them.

Posts 1680
Jerry M | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 10:25 AM

Deleted, because of questionable source.

"For the kingdom of God does not consist in words but in power"      Wiki Table of Contents

Posts 1
Tim Giebelhaus | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 10:32 AM

Perhaps it would be helpful if we had an update on the discussion between Zondervan and Logos? Or, if that is contractually not possible, let us know what you can.

In Bible class at my church, we use the NIV84 which means I use the YouVersion. I'm wondering what the YouVersion did to get access that Logos does not have access to. Perhaps the difference is that YouVersion is free where Logos isn't? I even have an off line version of NIV2011 which they offered for a short time. I already had to pay a separate fee to Logos for the NIV84. I'll probably not pay again for the NIV2011 as long as I'm using an iOS device during Bible Class.

I can't understand Zondervan's issue with the mobile device. If it were a book I could carry it anywhere. It is difficult to carry my desktop machine anywhere, but I could carry my iPad or iPhone. Some information that helps me understand why this is an issue, would help me understand why this is difficult to have NIV under Logos on my iOS devices.

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 12:01 PM

John Williston:

Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! I'll happily fork over extra to have the NIV on my iPad. I don't mind paying for value; that's what capitalism is all about. I just want the option. Or any option with Logos for that matter.

I'm glad Logos isn't giving in to this. Next thing you know, other publishers would insist on the same terms and we'd be paying double for all the resources we want offline. I'd prefer no NIV, and get the other resources accessible in mobile form at no extra cost.

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 12:03 PM

Jerry M:
What I did was download the NIV PDF from here.

There is no way that is being distributed legally.

Posts 1680
Jerry M | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 12:57 PM

Chris Roberts:
There is no way that is being distributed legally.

Perhaps, I deleted my link.

"For the kingdom of God does not consist in words but in power"      Wiki Table of Contents

Posts 32
Richard Stimson | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 1:07 PM

There seems to be a number of publishers that have these issues.  I know I had an issue with BKC from David C. Cook on my iPad.  It appears to me that publishers make this an issue on their more popular items (NIV, BKC, etc).  I really think it is a fairness issue.  Back in the days of regular books.  If I bought a book I could use it at home, at church or on a trip.  Now we have digital books.  I had Logos on my computer and Olivetree on my Palm.  I had to buy the book twice.  If I wanted NIV on both my Palm and computer I paid for it twice.  I did not like that, but I lived with it.  Olivetree and Logos were different platforms.  But now they are wanting me to pay for it a third time to use it on my iPad.  I think it is just wrong.  I do think it is a publisher issue.  David C. Cook as much as told me so (unless I miss understood them).  I do not think it is a Logos issue at all.  It is behavior like this that causes governmental regulation and intervention.  Everything on my systems is legal, that being said, it is also behavior like this that causes people to figure out how to get stuff onto their computers anyway they can.

Posts 1228
Ron | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 3:43 PM

Chris Roberts:

John Williston:

Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! I'll happily fork over extra to have the NIV on my iPad. I don't mind paying for value; that's what capitalism is all about. I just want the option. Or any option with Logos for that matter.

I'm glad Logos isn't giving in to this. Next thing you know, other publishers would insist on the same terms and we'd be paying double for all the resources we want offline. I'd prefer no NIV, and get the other resources accessible in mobile form at no extra cost.

Yes

Posts 27542
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 12 2011 4:45 PM

Timothy R. Giebelhaus:
I'm wondering what the YouVersion did to get access that Logos does not have access to.

YouVersion is a non-profit organization run by a church (lifechurch.tv). Actually, Zondervan gave YouVersion the ability to allow anyone (within a short window of time, which has already passed) to download the NIV2011 for offline use for free. I am guessing it was 1) a big tax write off and 2) free publicity. 

Timothy R. Giebelhaus:
I can't understand Zondervan's issue with the mobile device. If it were a book I could carry it anywhere. It is difficult to carry my desktop machine anywhere, but I could carry my iPad or iPhone. Some information that helps me understand why this is an issue, would help me understand why this is difficult to have NIV under Logos on my iOS devices.

Zondervan basically has the idea (as do some other publishers) that you purchase a license for a single device. An analogy would be that just because you bought a book last year, does give you the right to walk into Barnes & Noble and take a new copy home with you free of charge. Of course, Logos sees things differently, and works hard to allow you to use your license on any device. I agree with their position. 

Another thing to note: Logos is primarily in the business of selling resources for a desktop Bible software program - the mobile devices are a bonus. Perhaps this will change with Vyrso. 

OSX & iOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 32
Richard Stimson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 13 2011 8:52 AM

alabama24:

Zondervan basically has the idea (as do some other publishers) that you purchase a license for a single device. An analogy would be that just because you bought a book last year, does give you the right to walk into Barnes & Noble and take a new copy home with you free of charge. Of course, Logos sees things differently, and works hard to allow you to use your license on any device. I agree with their position.

 

I do not see it like I buy a book one year and have lost that book so I want to go to Barns and Noble and get a second book for free.  I see it like I want to change what bookshelf i put the book on.  The up side of digital books for publishers is unbelievable.  No inventory, no printing cost, little need for retail stores.  I think publishers are taking advantage of us.

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