Missing morph tagging in new Loeb volumes

I play a little game to see how quickly I can find errors in tagging, milestones, etc. on newly released Loeb editions. It took me about thirty seconds to notice problems in the recently released Medical Works of Antiquity series. (Which begs the question: if I can do it, why can't the quality control processes at Logos? ... anyway..)

The following volumes are missing the automatic morph tagging on the Greek side.

Galen's On the Natural Faculties: Greek Text

Heraclitus' On the Universe (the Greek and Latin quotes are sometimes tagged correctly later on, I think it's a language selection problem at the beginning)

Also, the Heraclitus book isn't marked as a separate book with its own milestones (?), meaning you can't link the English Heraclitus text with the Greek text. It would be much more helpful if each H fragment could receive its own milestone, so users could enter "Heraclitus 17" and be brought to the 17th fragment, with the matching English as well in the other panel.

I'll post more if I see problems in the Latin volumes.

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Comments

Greg F

Also, I just noticed that in the Index for the Hippocrates volume, the entries sometimes point to the Greek version, sometimes to the English version. See the first entry of the index on

ABDERA, I. 266, 268, 270, 274, 278; II. 187

The first five entries point to the Greek volume, the last points to the English volume. Same thing with "Amputation" etc.

This should be harmonized.

Greg F

The title of the Heracleitus volume is misspelled in Greek, the final sigma has been ocr'd incorrectly as a capital epsilon.

ΠΕΡΙ ΤΟΥ ΠΑΝΤΟΕ

should be:

ΠΕΡΙ ΤΟΥ ΠΑΝΤΟΣ

MJ. Smith

This particular error needs to be reported via typo to insure it is in the system when they update the book.

Butters

The Loeb volumes are nearly useless; there are simply digital texts that one can get anywhere - but with jumbled/incorrect/missing morphological information, etc.

For example, St. Augustine's Confessions - there are dozens of places I can get the digital text; some of the texts have oodles of information built into them.

So what exactly is Logos selling with these volumes? They have added very little value to them.

I gave up and walked away thinking that eventually Logos would fix these issues; a year or so later absolutely nothing has been done.

It honestly feels a bit fraudulent.

Very, very poor showing.

Kyle G. Anderson

Thanks for letting us know.

The following volumes are missing the automatic morph tagging on the Greek side.

Galen's On the Natural Faculties: Greek Text

Heraclitus' On the Universe (the Greek and Latin quotes are sometimes tagged correctly later on, I think it's a language selection problem at the beginning)

Morph tagging has been added and will be available next resource update.

Also, the Heraclitus book isn't marked as a separate book with its own milestones (?), meaning you can't link the English Heraclitus text with the Greek text. It would be much more helpful if each H fragment could receive its own milestone, so users could enter "Heraclitus 17" and be brought to the 17th fragment, with the matching English as well in the other panel.

I'll have to analyze this one further. It would require creating a new data type which is something that won't be able to happen immediately.

Also, I just noticed that in the Index for the Hippocrates volume, the entries sometimes point to the Greek version, sometimes to the English version. See the first entry of the index on

ABDERA, I. 266, 268, 270, 274, 278; II. 187

The first five entries point to the Greek volume, the last points to the English volume. Same thing with "Amputation" etc.

This should be harmonized.

This reflects the print. In the print, Greek and English are on opposite facing pages (which is why we had to split it into two resources). Since the print links to page 266 (which happens to be Greek) that is where we'll link.

The title of the Heracleitus volume is misspelled in Greek, the final sigma has been ocr'd incorrectly as a capital epsilon.

ΠΕΡΙ ΤΟΥ ΠΑΝΤΟΕ

should be:

ΠΕΡΙ ΤΟΥ ΠΑΝΤΟΣ

This has been updated and will be available next resource update.

Greg F

Thanks for the update Kyle, I appreciate it.

You can add the Celsus De Medicina volumes to the list of resources to be updated to add morphological tagging. The Latin missing tagging too.

And please do consider adding a new data type for Heraclitus. He's a major Greek Pre-Socratic philosopher, quoted by Luther and particularly important for the early church fathers (my library shows him being quoted by Justin Martyr, Tatien, Clement of Alexandria, etc.) Then, of course, there are all the references in secular literature: Dante, Lucretius, Marx, Francis Bacon, Marcus Aurelius, Plutarch, Hegel, etc.

Kyle G. Anderson

You can add the Celsus De Medicina volumes to the list of resources to be updated to add morphological tagging. The Latin missing tagging too.

I didn't mention it earlier but it was also updated. Thanks for pointing it out though.

And please do consider adding a new data type for Heraclitus. He's a major Greek Pre-Socratic philosopher, quoted by Luther and particularly important for the early church fathers (my library shows him being quoted by Justin Martyr, Tatien, Clement of Alexandria, etc.) Then, of course, there are all the references in secular literature: Dante, Lucretius, Marx, Francis Bacon, Marcus Aurelius, Plutarch, Hegel, etc.

I have a case in for Meraclitus for work on a data type. It'll probably be a couple of months before I'm able to get to it.

Greg F

I have a case in for Meraclitus for work on a data type. It'll probably be a couple of months before I'm able to get to it.

I noticed that a data type has been added for Heraclitus' fragments. Now books can point to individual fragments (Fragmentum 15, for example), rather than just the book as a whole. A big improvement, thanks Kyle!

However, I noticed that the data type is misspelled as "Heraclides", one of the legendary descendants of the Greek hero Heracles, and not "Heraclitus" as the philosopher's name is generally spelled (though it is "Heracleitus" in the Loeb edition).

Sorry to nitpick, but it's pretty important...

gregory barton

Well, it gets worse. The web site that sells this as logos has pictures of the volumes, publication dates, name of the publishers, qoutes from the publisher, the number of volumes you will recieve etc etc. Only in small print, in light faded grey text, does one read "this is a download". Alas I ordered a "set" expecting to be shipped 166 volumes. I realized my mistake when I saw no shipping charge. That sounded suspicious, so I studied the page again--but it was clearly 166 volumes. I am a professor of history and have ordered for years from all over the world. Never a scam. Then at this same site I see to my horror, in small print, and in faded gray type (quite easy to miss because the rest of the page is in clear type) that "this is a download." Jeez. I have canceled my order ans we shall see if I get a refund. But this is a site I will never, ever trust. Worse that any publisher I have seen. Why cant they be honest and upfront? At least as honest and upfront as the secular sites? If its an ebook then for heaven sakes, say it !! Loud and clear! And cut the whole layout of information that looks like hard copy volumes. Be honest!

MJ. Smith

Be honest!

Given that it is a software firm that offers resources to work in that software, Faithlife is normally very clear on resources that are physical and require shipping. In my decade in the forums, I can assure you that Faithlife had no intent to fool you into thinking they provided a physical book. I understand that you would be frustrated at the miscommunication but I am confident that your refund will be processed promptly.

But this is a site I will never, ever trust. Worse that any publisher I have seen.

Please don't be so severe - it is a software firm not a publisher as most of the routes into the site make clear. You obviously entered the site from a route that bypassed the software aspect.

gregory barton

Dear Mj Smith,

Thank you for your polite response. Yes perhaps I have been severe. If I get a refund I will be happy. To explain, I did indeed enter the forum from a google search, looking for Loeb library books. But to give me some credit, look at the website in question.

https://www.logos.com/product/55968/loeb-classical-library-builder

You can see, that it certainly looks like like physical volumes from top to bottom, except for the small print, in faded gray. The books are even listed as "owned" which would clearly indicate used books. I am sure coming from the outside made the web page all the more convincing that these were....well...books.

Warm Regards.

PS so you know Im not a crank and that I order constantly, you can check my own books online under Gregory A. Barton and see that I would indeed order quite a bit for my own research. I am not easily mistaken on book ordering. I just think the page could be clearer. Thanks again for your kind response.