Warning Label for Non-Christian Stuff
Hi have been making a couple of PB's which are definitely from a Non-Christian point of view, but useful for quoting whien refuting their viewpoint/message.
Have made a warning label, which I put on the first page of the document, which may be useful to some of you
or maybe not
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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DominicM said:
Have made a warning label, which I put on the first page of the document, which may be useful to some of you
Interesting. I personally have no problem with adding labels to works we create as Personal Books, Many people consult with trusted friends and Pastors when they seek out books to read. Our local Bible college puts these type of labels in books they deem heretical or contain doctrinal error.
All that being said I do not want Logos making judgemental calls on what resources are trustworthy.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Super Tramp said:
I do not want Logos making judgemental calls on what resources are trustworthy
[Y] That is why I a six point Calvinist[;)] want to see this make it into production ASAP. [<:o)]
Right: Let the reader beware! Logos should let the reader decide in their own mind if something is "Heresy"
As far as personal books, if someone want to put a warning in some PB, so be it, some of us may look upon it as badge of honer or a "selling point" . [:D]
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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"Yesterday's heretics are today's saints." (think of all who were burned at the stake or otherwise dispatched for their supposedly heretical views whom we now revere)
He drew a circle that shut me out —
Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout.
But Love and I had the wit to win:
We drew a circle that took him in.-- Edwin Markham (1852-1940)
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Only a weak faith will be threatened by reading a book.
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Rosie Perera said:
"Yesterday's heretics are today's saints." (think of all who were burned at the stake or otherwise dispatched for their supposedly heretical views whom we now revere)
He drew a circle that shut me out —
Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout.
But Love and I had the wit to win:
We drew a circle that took him in.-- Edwin Markham (1852-1940)
Thanks for sharing this Rosie [:)]
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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Super Tramp said:
All that being said I do not want Logos making judgemental calls on what resources are trustworthy
True 99% of time, but in some cases like Koran, and future Islamic studies collection I strongly disagree..
I am not saying use it or that anyone should, I am just saying here it is if you chose to, and if you did you could add the reason for adding the label, which may help if it got shared in the future, but as I say is optional
Chris myers said:Only a weak faith will be threatened by reading a book.
true, but we are all at different points in our spiritual journey, I would rather pre-warn, than be responsible for accidentally leading someone into error
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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Chris myers said:
Only a weak faith will be threatened by reading a book.
True, but again, I know a few ex-believers that said the same thing.
Therefore let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall. (1Co 10:12)
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Alain Maashe said:
True, but again, I know a few ex-believers that said the same thing.
Therefore let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall. (1Co 10:12)
I think we should allow plenty of room and time for the Holy Spirit to work. A faith structure that can be so easily destroyed might be better off being torn down and rebuilt on what the individual finds to be a more intellectually honest foundation. The entirety of scripture is filled with cycles of creation, sin, judgment, repentance, and redemption. So are the lives we all lead.
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Chris myers said:
Only a weak faith will be threatened by reading a book.
Just because we can do something does not mean that we should do that very thing, it is all too easy to veer into antinomianism.
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Chris myers said:Alain Maashe said:
True, but again, I know a few ex-believers that said the same thing.
Therefore let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall. (1Co 10:12)
I think we should allow plenty of room and time for the Holy Spirit to work. A faith structure that can be so easily destroyed might be better off being torn down and rebuilt on what the individual finds to be a more intellectually honest foundation. The entirety of scripture is filled with cycles of creation, sin, judgment, repentance, and redemption. So are the lives we all lead.
Agreed. Alain, I wonder whether those ex-believers you know were believing in the real thing?
Graffiti seen on a library carrel: "If you're running away from a false idea of God, are you getting farther from God or closer?" (or something to that effect)
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Tom Rach said:
That is why I a six point Calvinist
want to see this make it into production ASAP. Is that meant to be a joke or did I miss something in my theological education? 6 point?
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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You can be 6 point or 7 point
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George Somsel said:Tom Rach said: That is why I a six point Calvinist want to see this make it into production ASAP.
Is that meant to be a joke or did I miss something in my theological education? 6 point?
A Joke, It may Not a Good One, but it is Still a Joke. [:D]
Got it off of this site: http://www.apuritansmind.com/tulip/the-6-point-calvinist/
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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Alexander Longacre said:
You can be 6 point or 7 point
I thought only bucks could have that many. [:D] OK, what is a 6 point or a 7 point Calvinist? Amend my education.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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Alexander Longacre said:
You can be 6 point or 7 point
Yep, just found that out searching for the source of my 6 point remark.
Search: 6 point Calvinist and you get lots of hits.
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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George here is a web site (blog) that talks about the 6 point view.
http://www.fundamentallyreformed.com/2007/11/14/6-point-calvinism-the-atonement-question/
The seven point view is talked about here: http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/articles/what-does-piper-mean-when-he-says-hes-a-seven-point-calvinist
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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Tom Rach said:
The seven point view is talked about here: http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/articles/what-does-piper-mean-when-he-says-hes-a-seven-point-calvinist
Some rather suspect theology there. Read Lorraine Boettner The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination where he speaks of efficacious grace. It is not a simple desire on God's part but an actual undertaking to perform.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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George Somsel said:
The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination
Do sure what piper said because I don´t have his book. The link shows Matt´s view of what "Piper says".
Would you recommend Boettner´s book?
http://www.logos.com/product/6242/the-reformed-doctrine-of-predestination
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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Tom Rach said:
Would you recommend Boettner´s book?
Yes. Boetner was the book I read before transferring to Calvin.
THE Westminster Confession states the doctrine of Efficacious Grace thus:—"All those whom God has predestinated unto life, and those only, He is pleased, in His appointed and accepted time, effectually to call, by His Word and Spirit, out of that state of death, in which they are by nature, to grace and salvation by Jesus Christ; enlightening their minds spiritually and savingly, to understand the things of God; taking away their heart of stone, and giving them a heart of flesh; renewing their wills, and by His almighty power determining them to that which is good; and effectually drawing them to Jesus Christ, yet so as they come most freely, being made willing by His grace."This effectual call is of God’s free and special grace alone, not from any thing at all foreseen in man, who is altogether passive therein, until, being quickened and renewed by the Holy Spirit, he is thereby enabled to answer this call, and to embrace the grace offered and conveyed by it."
And the Shorter Catechism, in answer to the question "What is effectual calling?" says, "Effectual calling is the work of God’s Spirit, whereby, convincing us of our sin and misery, enlightening our minds in the knowledge of Christ, and renewing our wills, He doth persuade and enable us to embrace Jesus Christ, freely offered to us in the Gospel."
Boettner, Loraine. The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination. Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932.
To hold otherwise is more of an Arminian or semi-Pelagian view.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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George Somsel said:
[....]
Boettner, Loraine. The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination. Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932.
To hold otherwise is more of an Arminian or semi-Pelagian view.
George, I've heard and read of the 6th and 7th, Basically it is just a play on the first 5. Don't take it too seriously....there are just 5. I have read your reference.....even have a copy, was good reading...
DISCLAIMER: What you do on YOUR computer is your doing.
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George Somsel said:Tom Rach said:
The seven point view is talked about here: http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/articles/what-does-piper-mean-when-he-says-hes-a-seven-point-calvinist
Some rather suspect theology there. Read Lorraine Boettner The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination where he speaks of efficacious grace. It is not a simple desire on God's part but an actual undertaking to perform.
I don't think there's anything suspect about it at all. Points 6 and 7 are derived from the first five points.
We can beg to differ on the theology but it's actually very well defended from Scripture.0 -
Room4more said:George Somsel said:
[....]
Boettner, Loraine. The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination. Phillipsburg, NJ: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company, 1932.
To hold otherwise is more of an Arminian or semi-Pelagian view.
George, I've heard and read of the 6th and 7th, Basically it is just a play on the first 5. Don't take it too seriously....there are just 5. I have read your reference.....even have a copy, was good reading...
[Y][Y][Y]
Better put than I had done
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Mike Pettit said:Chris myers said:
Only a weak faith will be threatened by reading a book.
Just because we can do something does not mean that we should do that very thing, it is all too easy to veer into antinomianism.
[Y]
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George Somsel said:Tom Rach said:
Would you recommend Boettner´s book?
Yes. Boetner was the book I read before transferring to Calvin.
To hold otherwise is more of an Arminian or semi-Pelagian view.
I started a little lighter by reading RC Sproul Books before going to Calvin.
Thanks George [:)]
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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DominicM said:
Have made a warning label, which I put on the first page of the document, which may be useful to some of you
I don't really know what kind of book you are thinking of using this on but after reading this thread here's one of my thoughts: (BTW while I only recognize your name from this forum, I don't know you personally so my comment is not about you, but a general reaction to the idea)
If I came across a book with this label, it would be very unlikely that I would bother reading it for two reasons.
a) It immediately warns me that the author is a poor writer. If he has to slap a label like this on his work then he is likely to be incapable of making his points through a valid persuasive argument and he lacked the effort or ability to present his "heretical" material in a way that makes clear either what he thinks of the material or to teach people how to analyze it critically. I would be highly skeptical that such a book would be worth reading.
b) The label smacks of presumption. Who determines what is heretical? Perhaps you think your label would only apply to let's say the fundamentals of reconciliation with God, (like you might be quoting Buddha or Mohammed) but others might see its use quite differently. The jokes about Calvinism in this thread illustrate my point. What about people who just happen to drop in and read them or don't get the inside references - like me?
All, in all, make your writing persuade people effectively and forget the label. Even if you are just publishing a compendium of thought for reference, at least introduce it effectively and perhaps suggest critical questions people should ask themselves as they read.
BTW did you notice this in the news this week: "Dante’s Divine Comedy has been condemned as racist, homophobic,
anti-Islamist and anti-Semitic. The classic work should be removed from
school curricula, according to Gherush 92, a human rights organisation
which acts as a consultant to UN bodies on racism and discrimination."Have a great day,
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Jim said:
BTW did you notice this in the news this week: "Dante’s Divine Comedy has been condemned as racist, homophobic,
anti-Islamist and anti-Semitic. The classic work should be removed from
school curricula, according to Gherush 92, a human rights organisation
which acts as a consultant to UN bodies on racism and discrimination."Better get your copy before it is banned! [;)] At least they are not calling for a book burning party yet. [:D]
http://www.logos.com/es/producto/9918/the-harvard-classics-vol-20-the-divine-comedy-by-dante
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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Thanks Jim. I have been wanting to reply to this thread, but haven't know how to say anything without being inflammatory. You said exactly what I feel.
Cal H
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I think we are at cross-purposes here:
Am am only using it myself on prepublished public domain stuff, I am not using it on anything I author myself, should I ever be fortunate to do so will not hide behind a label but subject ti to peer review.
Most of the stuff I attach it to concerns cults and other world religions
Re Dante, why should we be surprised.. Thankfully the Lord is coming back... Maranatha!
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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DominicM said:
Am am only using it myself on prepublished public domain stuff, I am not using it on anything I author myself, should I ever be fortunate to do so will not hide behind a label but subject ti to peer review.
Most of the stuff I attach it to concerns cults and other world religions
Getting back to your original post.
Yes your sticker will be useful as we compile our own books made out of PD material.
Books we find on the internet and would like to include in our own PRIVATE personal Lib.
The sticker you produced is fine and will be used by others just as everyone has a right to label and sort any book on their home book shelf into categories.
I got a "Special" place for my copy of the Koran and similar items.
Thanks for making it and I am sorry that we got off track (o hijacked) your thread. [:$]
Tomas
http://hombrereformado.blogspot.com/ Solo a Dios la Gloria Apoyo
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