Wordsearch Deluxe equals Logos Basic?

Friends - I just "converted over" to Logos. I went through Quickverse 1 - 10; Wordsearch 10 - 12; and now Logos 8. I have invested quite a large sum, and there seems to be a loss of resources during each change.

I understand copyrights, licensing, etc, however, am I to understand with Wordsearch 12 Deluxe, will I only get Logos Basic - or will Logos be updated to match my former level of Wordsearch at a later date?

I am not new to change, just new to Logos... (and ok, a little lazy wanting some answers without reading through a lot of documents, wink)

If you could reply or just direct me to the proper documents, that would be helpful.

Here we grow again!

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Comments

The Flanary's

I was searching for this very info. for this very reason. And the short answer appears to be "yes". We retained our libraries (eventually, although they may be monographs for some time) but the better upgraded features of Logos appear to be locked. (For example: Canvas requires at least Bronze, which has a rather rich price tag, imo)
But, on the positive, WS12 is supposed to remain active offline for probably the life of its system specs. So the move to Logos is being termed as "complimentary".....

Scott E. Mahle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117561#Comment_1117561

(For example: Canvas requires at least Bronze, which has a rather rich price tag, imo)

Good morning!

As a long time Logos user, I find the full feature upgrade to be well worth the cost of admission. If that cost is a bit much right now, I wanted you to know that you can gain access to these features (not own – just rent) through a Faithlife Connect monthly subscription. Many Logos users go this route and it would serve as a way for you to try them out to see if owning them is worthwhile. Just food for thought . . .

And welcome to the world of Faithlife/Logos!

Andrew Batishko

In Logos, your package "level" actually has little meaning in the long term. In the "now", you purchase a package in order to get access to specific collection of books, datasets, and features. After your purchase, all of those items of handled individually, and which package they came from has no significance.

Instead, Faithlife makes it so that you don't pay twice for something you already own. We use dynamic pricing to lower the price of packages you purchase so that the price does not include the portion of the price contributed by books, datasets, and features you already own.

If you bought a "Silver" package now, there's nothing that obligates you to purchase a "Silver" package down the line when a major update occurs. You could choose to buy a larger or smaller package according to which packages contain the specific collection of books, datasets, and features that you are interested in.

In addition, Faithlife splits the Logos packages into library packages and feature packages. The former provide access to only books, and the latter provide access to datasets and features (sometimes along with access to a couple of books that a very strongly coupled with the datasets or features). This allows you to focus your purchasing on either books or features purely on the basis of which collections give you access to the things that you want. No need to worry about sticking with specific levels of anything.

Check here for a comparison of different packages: https://www.logos.com/compare-packages

Note the tabs near the top to switch between comparing Book packages and Feature packages.

From that chart, you can see that Canvas (for example) is currently sold as part of the Bronze or Full Feature package. Keep in mind, that buying a package gives you ownership of all the things in the package, and that ownership will reduce the price of similar packages in the future.

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117570#Comment_1117570

Its a common thought process for people new to Logos, and I understand how that feels. I was there too once upon a time.

They should have called it something different than L8 Basic for those of you who only had Wordsearch prior to the merge. L8 Wordsearch Crossgrade would have been a better title. Because that is functionally what it is. I've had a foot in both worlds, though more Logos than Wordsearch.

Also, what was said prior to this is all true.

I had L6 collectors, but for L8 I only bought Platinum.

But it was more about new books than anything.

Base packages are a great way to expand the titles in your library. Over the course of the last however many years its been, I've averaged about 1$/book by shopping sales, and base packages.

Tim

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117570#Comment_1117570

I appreciate all the interaction!

It looks like, as I can best conclude , that the Flanary's response holds the most weight (although I hope for them to be wrong...hehe)

Is it true - the changeover from Wordsearch Deluxe will only get me Logos Basic? Not even Logos Starter? I understand version numbers really mean little other than development, but I was hoping for more of an equal feature crossover.

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117601#Comment_1117601

I appreciate all the interaction!

It looks like, as I can best conclude , that the Flanary's response holds the most weight (although I hope for them to be wrong...hehe)

Is it true - the changeover from Wordsearch Deluxe will only get me Logos Basic? Not even Logos Starter? I understand version numbers really mean little other than development, but I was hoping for more of an equal feature crossover.

I suspect where features are duplicated, you'll have those in Logos still. Where Logos doesn't have a feature, you're out of luck at the moment, and likely features of Logos that Wordsearch didn't have you'll need to make a purchase to get them.

I could be mistaken, but thats my current read on the situation.

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117601#Comment_1117601

Is it true - the changeover from Wordsearch Deluxe will only get me Logos Basic?

You will get Logos Basic plus all of the books you had in Wordsearch, so you are hardly staring at the Basic level. As Andrew pointed out above, package names mean little in Logos. For you, being at Basic only refers to how many Logos features and datasets you now own, not how many resources you own. It really is a pretty meaningless name, handy for marketing but not for measuring what you really have in your library.

John W Gillis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117601#Comment_1117601

the changeover from Wordsearch Deluxe will only get me Logos Basic?

I'm not sure what you mean by "Wordsearch Deluxe". Since they eliminated the functionally-limited free versions a while back (i.e. Wordsearch Basic, or Bible Explorer before that), there has only been one level of Wordsearch. It cost about $40. You could spend a lot more than that on packages, but the price difference was all about the books that were or were not included. Whatever you have for books in WS either have been or soon will be made available to you in Logos at no cost, and the Logos app is free - both desktop and mobile.

It's true that Faithlife sells enhanced functionality in premium add-ons for the application, as well as selling all kinds of books, courses, etc. It's also true that Wordsearch did some things that Logos doesn't, so Faithlife seems to be looking hard at what new functionality to try to incorporate into future Logos versions, but frankly there's not that much - Logos mostly needs to improve the way it handles user-created data. But that has nothing to do with the various Feature Set differences between Full, Bronze, Starter, etc. Those differences seem to me to be pure Logos differences.

It's hard for me to tell, since I don't use Logos Basic, but the only Logos premium feature I can think of that is comparable to a Wordsearch feature is the Personal Book Builder functionality, which as far as I know still requires purchasing a package to get. Wordsearch allowed users to create User Books within the program, at least since the QuickVerse merger. User Books and PBB is not exactly apples-to-apples, but I do think it is a legitimate functionality loss moving to Logos if you don't get the PBB capability.

I could be wrong, of course - maybe there's more. Are you aware of any other Wordsearch-type functionality that is missing in the basic Logos configuration, but present in premium versions? I'd be interested to know.

SineNomine

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117570#Comment_1117570

WS owners are (for free) getting essentially equivalent (or better) functionality in the Logos ecosystem, not "Logos 8 Basic" as such.

Wordsearch didn't have an equivalent to Canvas, so Wordsearch users aren't getting Canvas (for free).

SineNomine

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117672#Comment_1117672

WS owners are (for free) getting essentially equivalent (or better) functionality in the Logos ecosystem, not "Logos 8 Basic" as such.

Here's the comparison chart: https://files.logoscdn.com/v1/files/45561287/content.pdf?signature=B7M_mhfLktiAHHtsu8A5fek3BDg

Mattillo

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117682#Comment_1117682

WS owners are (for free) getting essentially equivalent (or better) functionality in the Logos ecosystem, not "Logos 8 Basic" as such.

Here's the comparison chart: https://files.logoscdn.com/v1/files/45561287/content.pdf?signature=B7M_mhfLktiAHHtsu8A5fek3BDg

I’m sorry if I missed this somewhere but I was a WS12 user as well as logos. Will the WS features be migrating to logos too? I’m assuming it follows the same timeline for the books? By 2021?

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117684#Comment_1117684

Will the WS features be migrating to logos too?

Logos has not announced any plans to do this, so no timeline, but they are seeking input on which features that are not in Logos are most valued by WS users. That thread is here. It seems from this that they would like to add at least some features from WS.

Tim

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117709#Comment_1117709

Friends - I understand the difference between resources and features. I understand also, the tendencies to take the stance "my software is better than your software"... that being said, I truly appreciate this dialog!

I have used your input and with some additional research, I decided to go with the feature entry level of Logos Starter. I suspect this will give me a good overview.

Soooo... I have been "grafted into" the Logos family.

Thanks again!

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117798#Comment_1117798

Friends - I understand the difference between resources and features. I understand also, the tendencies to take the stance "my software is better than your software"... that being said, I truly appreciate this dialog!

Appreciate that smile on your face, even though your question didn't appear to get answered ... eg features you purchased in WS >> Logos equivalent features?? Basic??

The Logos forum is a bit of humanity and all its foibles. But I'm impressed the WS'ers are proceeding apace ... I'd of had a heart-attack by now!

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117798#Comment_1117798

Soooo... I have been "grafted into" the Logos family.

Welcome to the family. May the new tree bring forth much fruit. [:D]

SineNomine

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117812#Comment_1117812

Friends - I understand the difference between resources and features. I understand also, the tendencies to take the stance "my software is better than your software"... that being said, I truly appreciate this dialog!

Appreciate that smile on your face, even though your question didn't appear to get answered ... eg features you purchased in WS >> Logos equivalent features?? Basic??

In brief, and to be clear, with a couple exceptions (things that don't exist in Logos), he gets for free all of the features in Logos that he had in Wordsearch. He also gets a few extra features that weren't in Wordsearch. The collection of features he gets is NOT Logos Basic, but it does include everything in Logos Basic.

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118028#Comment_1118028

Friends - I understand the difference between resources and features. I understand also, the tendencies to take the stance "my software is better than your software"... that being said, I truly appreciate this dialog!

Appreciate that smile on your face, even though your question didn't appear to get answered ... eg features you purchased in WS >> Logos equivalent features?? Basic??

In brief, and to be clear, with a couple exceptions (things that don't exist in Logos), he gets for free all of the features in Logos that he had in Wordsearch. He also gets a few extra features that weren't in Wordsearch. The collection of features he gets is NOT Logos Basic, but it does include everything in Logos Basic.

Logos is famous for brushing right up against almost having good communication. If they had called what they are giving out "Wordsearch crossgrade", I think there wouldn't be any confusion.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118028#Comment_1118028

Friends - I understand the difference between resources and features. I understand also, the tendencies to take the stance "my software is better than your software"... that being said, I truly appreciate this dialog!

Appreciate that smile on your face, even though your question didn't appear to get answered ... eg features you purchased in WS >> Logos equivalent features?? Basic??

In brief, and to be clear, with a couple exceptions (things that don't exist in Logos), he gets for free all of the features in Logos that he had in Wordsearch. He also gets a few extra features that weren't in Wordsearch. The collection of features he gets is NOT Logos Basic, but it does include everything in Logos Basic.

All well and good, but you still didn't deal with the specifics he asked about. You might answer him, not me.

Kathleen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117682#Comment_1117682

I am going to miss the sermon/illustration organizer. That was an extremely valuable resource to me in WordsearchBible!

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118110#Comment_1118110

I am going to miss the sermon/illustration organizer. That was an extremely valuable resource to me in WordsearchBible!

Please elaborate what was valuable, ideally with some screen shot(s) showing content with usage description. Logos Wiki has => Screenshot

Also curious what could be improved about Sermon Illustration Manager ? Would a radial calendar be helpful for organizing sermon illustration usage ?

Thread => Wordsearch-Logos Equivalent Features does not list a Logos equivalent for Sermon Illustration Manager

FYI: personally lack WS experience since choosing Logos to be be my primary Bible software over a decade ago.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118110#Comment_1118110

I am going to miss the sermon/illustration organizer.

Faithlife is interested in the features you most like in Wordsearch. They started a thread for this. You might post your concern/interest there. https://community.logos.com/forums/t/193813.aspx

Wilson Lim

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117684#Comment_1117684

With the comparison chart attach, it does not distinguish which functionality level of Logos is involved. So the starter version - will it have all those features? Otherwise it is hard to compare WS with the different levels of Logos??

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119094#Comment_1119094

With the comparison chart attach, it does not distinguish which functionality level of Logos is involved. So the starter version - will it have all those features? Otherwise it is hard to compare WS with the different levels of Logos??

Hi Wilson, welcome to the Forums. Every WS user will get a set of features and datasets depending on their level of Wordsearch. This group of features is not identical to any group found in a Feature Set or in a base package. It's a hybrid meant to meet the immediate needs of WS users.

If you have them already you can go to the Full Feature Set Chart and it will tell you exactly what you already own and what you lack.

If you go to the comparison view of the three feature sets and check the box "Hide features I own" you can see which new features you'd acquire with all three levels of feature upgrades.

You can also look at any base package, such as Logos Standard Starter and scroll down to the list of features and see which ones you own and which ones you'd get by buying Standard Starter.

Is this the sort of information you are looking for?

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117570#Comment_1117570

Check here for a comparison of different packages: https://www.logos.com/compare-packages

Feature Set Comparison => https://www.logos.com/compare/featuresets lacks subset of Logos 8 Starter Feature Upgrade in Logos 8 Fundamentals

Courses

QuickStart for Logos 8

Lectionaries

Atlases, Maps, and Media

Harmonies and Parallel Passages

Interlinears

General Reference

Glossary of Morpho-Syntactic Database Terminology

Datasets

Biblical Events Dataset
Biblical People Dataset
Biblical People Diagrams
Biblical Places Dataset
Biblical Places Maps
Biblical Referents Dataset
Biblical Things Dataset
Community Tags Dataset
English Audio Pronunciations Dataset
Logos Controlled Vocabulary Dataset
Miracles of the Bible Dataset
Parables of the Bible Dataset
Resource Excerpts Dataset
Speaking to God Dataset

Features

Interactive Media

Workflows

Author Guides

Martin Luther: A Guide to His Life and Writings

Media Collections

Keep Smiling [:)]

Ricky Daugherty

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119101#Comment_1119101

I see a lot of discussion here about what WORDSearch users get in Logos, but the discussing has so many aspects to it, seems a bit confusing.

I see mention one can view the Full Feature Set Chart to see what the have there and what they do not, but for me that would not be helpful.

What I would like to know is not the resources we received with Logos, but which feature level we received. Did we only receive the Logos 8 Basic Features or did we get more?

I recently about a month ago went on a payment plan for the Logos 8 Full Features upgrade, so if I went to that chart now, because I am currently paying for that it would have everything checked. So I was wondering how much of the Features Upgrade I am making payments on was granted free with the migration from WORDSearch to Logos, or if all we received was the Basic Features and none of what I am making payments on in the Full Features upgrade was included with our Migration.

Hoping a Logos staff can clarify that aspect concerning the Features Upgrade and what was included in our Merger?

Thanks for any help to understand this.

Wilson Lim

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119366#Comment_1119366

Ricky, Mark Smith's reply to me above where he provided a link to the Full Feature Set Chart has the answers. If you look acrefully it has BOTH resources and features sets.

Hope this helps.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119366#Comment_1119366

Hoping a Logos staff can clarify that aspect concerning the Features Upgrade and what was included in our Merger?

Suggestion is contacting Customer Service to inquire if Logos 8 Full Feature upgrade would have dynamic pricing discount from Wordsearch acquisition => https://www.logos.com/contact Also Wordsearch FAQ => https://www.logos.com/wordsearch-faq has Customer Service phone number and email near top of the page.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Ricky Daugherty

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119430#Comment_1119430

I already explained above that a link to the Full Features Upgrade will not work for me because I am already on a Payment Plan for that so it says I have that all, and not because it came from WORDSearch Merger, but because I am paying for it. If my payment plan says I now have all those features, it does not inform me which if any came from that Merger. That being said, dynamic pricing will not work, since I am already on a payment plan for that from just before the Merger, and not heard that any dynamic pricing is retroactive, since the plan started about a month ago.

I read Mark Smith saying, "Every WS user will get a set of features and datasets depending on their level of Wordsearch." But his answer does not say which ones I might receive since they are dynamic, an to discover which ones were added required going to that link which was dependent on not already having that all and then you could see the difference before purchasing that upgrade, which will not work for me since I am paying for that plan now.

I already have way over 8,000 resources in Logos from earlier versions right now, but just wanted to know about which features came with the WORDSearch to Logos merger that said we would get Logos free, and since Logos Basic was already free, and I already had Logos, just asking about those features that came with the Merger, if any, of if the original post title above is correct that WORDSearch Users only received Logos 8 Basic. Not yet heard a clear answer on that here, and all posts seems to be side stepping that actual question (Logos 8 Basic or something more). If as Mark Smith said it was a hybrid upgrade, sounds like something more, but what is not clear, especially in my case.

My question to Logos staff was if any of that Features Upgrade I am paying for was already included in that WORDSearch Merger, and wondering if I am paying for any of the Features that were granted free with the WORDSearch Merger into Logos? I do not yet see that answer here.

But thanks for being willing to help, even though it was the wrong help, as explained in my original post.

Kristine Lewis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119448#Comment_1119448

In another thread https://community.logos.com/forums/p/194015/1119071.aspx#1119071 corncerning features received with coming in as Wordsearch users, I got this link and answer. I already owned all the specific Logos features in the first column except Theology Guide, which is a part of the Full Feature set. Now I own the Theology Guide since my WS resource licenses were imported. I noticed that this new ownership of the Theology Guide reduced my Dynamic Price for the Full Feature Upgrade by a small amount. I hope this is helpful.

SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:47 AM

Kristine Lewis:

I am curious if I will own the Logos exclusive features with green checkmarks in the first column once my Wordsearch titles are unlocked, or if Logos features equivalent to my Wordsearch 12 are simply being pointed out in case I wanted to purchase them. For instance, the Theology Guide is part of the Full Feature Set, which I do not own.

https://files.logoscdn.com/v1/files/45561287/content.pdf?signature=B7M_mhfLktiAHHtsu8A5fek3BDg

Once your licensing stuff is done, you'll receive all the features in the appropriate column.

Credo quidquid dixit Dei Filius / Nil hoc verbo Veritatis verius.

Suggest Books & New Features

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119448#Comment_1119448

I read Mark Smith saying, "Every WS user will get a set of features and datasets depending on their level of Wordsearch." But his answer does not say which ones I might receive since they are dynamic, an to discover which ones were added required going to that link which was dependent on not already having that all and then you could see the difference before purchasing that upgrade, which will not work for me since I am paying for that plan now.

Mark Smith and myself are Forum MVP's (Many Volunteer Posts) with rusty stars under our avatars, who do not have access to customer information. Hence my earlier suggestion to contact Faithlife customer service about Full Feature Upgrade price question, which may reduce amount owed on payment plan by not paying for feature(s) that would have been included with WordSearch migration.

Earlier in this thread is a reply by Andrew Batishko (Faithlife) who is a Faithlife employee with green logo under his avatar.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Ricky Daugherty

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119560#Comment_1119560

While I do appreciate the advice to call Customer Service and they might be able to reduce the Features Upgrade I am paying for, it still does not answer my question.

I also appreciate the fact that you may not have access to individual customer information to address my specific cercumstance, and the fact that the included features would vary to match which ever package we had in WORDSearch, but that still does not answer the question that not only I but others might wish to know. In other words a generic reply that can fit multiple users with different WORDSearch packages to start with.

To refer me to Customer Service, sounds like they need the software that can analyze what we had to determine what we get, so that a real person is unable to answer that here.

Rather than a specific answer for an individual person, how about a generic breakdown of which WORDSearch packages equated to which features which would be granted in Logos, a table that if you had this you get that, or if you had the other you get this, etc. so we can figure out our self what we should get, rather than waiting for some software algorithm to tell us what we get. If a software algorithm determines what we received based on what we had, a programmer/analyst had to apply that algorithm to to software so that it will compute what we received based on what we had, therefore that formula could be shared here so we can get an idea our self what to expect. When I say algorithm I mean what rules determines who gets what in the conversion. Like that table I suggested above.

In other words, please make it simple for us to understand. Meanwhile, Monday I will do as suggested and contact Customer Service, but others I have talked to would like to know the same information even if their package varies from mine, ergo my question here so others can read the results and why a generic answer that can apply to all the groups interested.

Andrew Batishko

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119566#Comment_1119566

In other words, please make it simple for us to understand

It's not entirely clear to me whether or not this answers your question, but I hope this helps.

The Wordsearch FAQ ( https://www.logos.com/wordsearch-faq ) has a link to a PDF that shows which Logos features will be unlocked for various Wordsearch owners. https://files.logoscdn.com/v1/files/45561287/content.pdf?signature=B7M_mhfLktiAHHtsu8A5fek3BDg

This information in conjunction with the feature comparison table will show whether or not there is any overlap with the feature set that you have already purchased (Make sure that "Hide features I own" is not checked). https://www.logos.com/compare/featuresets

Depending on how long it's been since you purchased your feature set, it might be worth taking advantage our the 30 day money-back guarantee to return your feature set and then repurchase it again to take advantage of the features you received for free. Check out "What is Faithlife’s return policy?" here: https://www.logos.com/faq

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117682#Comment_1117682

The Wordsearch FAQ ( https://www.logos.com/wordsearch-faq ) has a link to a PDF that shows which Logos features will be unlocked for various Wordsearch owners. https://files.logoscdn.com/v1/files/45561287/content.pdf?signature=B7M_mhfLktiAHHtsu8A5fek3BDg

Logos Exclusive Features looks like a subset of Logos 8 Fundamentals plus Bible Outline Browser (Bronze) and Theology Guide (Full)

Apologies for me lacking Wordsearch experience so lack confidence about feature equivalence. Appears to be Logos 8 Basic plus some more: Multiview Resources (Fundamentals), Morphology Charts (Bronze), Sermon Editor (Full for WS 12 Enhanced Sermon Building)

Keep Smiling [:)]

Ricky Daugherty

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1119579#Comment_1119579

O.K. Talked to Customer Service as I said I would. I also previously had the comparison chart posted above, which was not much help, because when it got to the Logos Exclusive Features listed at the bottom of that chart above, it failed to compare those Features to the Full Features Upgrade set to see what if any of those were included in that Full Features Set.

I do have WORDSearch 12, so the left column applied to me. However, when I read that list of 12 Logos Exclusive Features to the Customer Service Representative, she informed me that all 12 of those features are part of the Logos Basic which everyone gets for free, so their is nothing to dynamic price with the Full Features Upgrade set. I am not paying for any of that, because I had that with my Free Logos 8 Basic already.

Who ever made that chart, while still minimally helpful, it would have been more helpful as a real comparison when placed side by side with the Full Features Upgrade Set to make it clear those features are the Free Logos Basic Features (according to Logos customer service).

When Mark Smith suggested looking at the Full Features Upgrade Set to see what the software says was included via dynamic pricing, that was a good suggestion for those who had not already purchased that as I recently did, so for me the suggested information was no longer available. But for those who had not yet upgraded, that was the best answer I saw, but could not help me.

I was an Information Systems Programmer/Analyst Specialist (CIS-3) for 18 years, so I understand what meaningful information would be, and I recommend that chart be upgraded as suggested above to be more meaningful and more useful to those who are still uninformed, but do admit that was a very good start, but there is room for improvement--if anyone is listening and able to pass that information to those who were authorized to upgrade that chart.

I realize features (data sets) are different than book resources which my Full Features Upgrade also included some of, but I was asking about Features, so with regard to simply Features, the original Question that started this post is Yes, we only get Logos Basic Features, but that may not be true concerning any book Resources we might have received from Logos that was not in WORDSearch, and not read that answer above. But for features we get Logos Basic!

Thanks for all the feedback to my inquiry above, and hope this helps for others with the same question.

Robert Paul McCloud

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1117611#Comment_1117611

Just an observation. I was a WS owner for many years (back to version 5), and also had QuickVerse. A number of years ago, I purchased Logos 7 Basic because I wanted a number of theology books not available in WS. I am a bit confused over the statement that "levels" don't really mean anything in Logos, and I'm not sure I agree. As far as I understand it (and have been told), Logos' strength is its datasets, which can be very expensive to add to your existing package (in our case, Basic). That's why for years I couldn't sink money into Logos. Logos is not really geared for laypersons who have limited funds, and for many years WordSearch WAS (although in later years things got more expensive). Levels - Starter, Bronze, Silver, etc - don't just add books, they add datasets that in reality add functionality. Currently, I am running Logos 8 Basic with my Logos 7 Basic library and datasets, plus the added WS books I had, thanks to the switchover. If I want to, I can purchase some datasets (not cheap), or I can "upgrade" to Logos 8 Starter for about 91 dollars. Starter really doesn't add much to the overall package to make it worthwhile. It didn't before the acquisition of WS, and it doesn't now. I'm not even sure Bronze would, and it costs more. Yes, I can do a lot of Bible study and research with what I have, but in order to really "fly" with Logos, it's going to take a lot, lot more then Starter of Bronze. And lets be honest, the website does encourage us to upgrade with it's "this is the best upgrade for you", which generally tends to be Silver or higher with a significant price tag.

Now understand, I don't want to take away the generosity of Logos in allowing us WordSEARCH users to switch over to Logos 8, but, Logos, you got something out of it too. WordSEARCH books that you previously didn't have a license for, and a slew of new customers who are finding that Logos is now the only game in town. And for those WS users who did far more then just personal Bible study - who were prepping for sermons for example - Basic with its limited datasets is probably not going to be enough for them, because the Basic package does not have the sermon and language helps. Hence, they're going to have to decide if the need to spend more money on it. And as far as giving WS customers Logos 8 Basic and their library books, I would ask did WordSearch require Logos to do that as part of the deal?

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1122789#Comment_1122789

the Basic package does not have the sermon and language helps. Hence, they're going to have to decide if the need to spend more money on it.

Not disagreeing; just chatting. Our church abides by the Biblical prohibition of metalic displays ...silver, gold, and platinum (also bronze, but not pearls). And so, my Logos has the full 'power' of features, but no metallic collections (joking about the reason).

But looking back, and looking at actual usage (almost totally OL), I think I've rarely used much beyond 'Basic'. Never needed/wanted the RIs, tools, etc. Did absolutely need the CitedBys, Text Compares, right-click morphs, multiviews, etc ... I think all Basic? Now, true, I have a large OL library that cost more than our Electric Wonder car. Worth ever (copper) penney.

I guess, depends.

Mike Binks

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1122789#Comment_1122789

Yes, I can do a lot of Bible study and research with what I have, but in order to really "fly" with Logos, it's going to take a lot, lot more then Starter of Bronze. And lets be honest, the website does encourage us to upgrade with it's "this is the best upgrade for you", which generally tends to be Silver or higher with a significant price tag.

I find that Faithlife Connect works for me.

Brad Jerry

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118290#Comment_1118290

Logos supports several different ways to take notes. The easiest is to highlight the text you want to take a note about, then select the note icon in the selection menu that appears. You can access the Notes Tool directly by clicking Tools > Notes.

xnman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1118110#Comment_1118110

I think WS users should get Sermon Builder at least.

Just my opinion...

Mike Binks

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142426#Comment_1142426

I think WS users should get Sermon Builder at least.

Just my opinion...

Interesting use of 'should'.

I bought biscuits from 'Morrisions'. Tescos have a 'buy one get one free' offer on biscuits, therefore Tesco should give me a free packet of biscuits.

I think Tescos would argue that I should have bought my biscuits from them in the first place.

Just my opinion...

Ted Hans

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142480#Comment_1142480

I bought biscuits from 'Morrisions'. Tescos have a 'buy one get one free' offer on biscuits, therefore Tesco should give me a free packet of biscuits.

I think Tescos would argue that I should have bought my biscuits from them in the first place.

Just my opinion...

Well said.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142426#Comment_1142426

I think WS users should get Sermon Builder at least.

Looking at Wordsearch page => https://www.logos.com/wordsearch noticed:

Wordsearch">
See How Logos Compares to Wordsearch

All Wordsearch customers have received a comparable version of Logos at no charge. But how does it compare to Wordsearch? Check out this chart to learn more.

Compare Logos & Wordsearch

Comparison chart shows Wordsearch 12 owners received "Enhanced Sermon Building"

Logos 9 (& Verbum 9) New Features => https://support.logos.com/hc/en-us/articles/360018922551 include Sermon Manager & Sermon Builder. Announcement of Wordsearch migration to Logos happened on 21 Sep 2020 => https://blog.faithlife.com/blog/2020/09/wordsearch-bible-is-transitioning-to-logos/ that was followed later by Logos 9 announcement on 26 Oct 2020 => https://blog.faithlife.com/blog/2020/10/logos-9-is-here-see-whats-new/ (so existing Logos & Verbum users needed to purchase Silver feature upgrade OR Academic feature upgrade OR above to unlock the new Sermon Manager & Sermon Builder for their use)

Noticed the red X's in comparison chart are Wordsearch capabilities that Faithlife Apps do not have an equivalent. Thankful for Faithlife starting thread => Favorite Wordsearch Features

New Feedback site shows:

Sermon/Illustration Organizer => Add Function to Notes for organizing illustrations, etc. has 7 votes (no status)

Instant Verse Study currently has two feedback items with 1 vote each => Instant Verse Study & => Instant Verse Study

OneDrive integration has a Proclaim feedback item with 1 vote => Import from Cloud Drive

LessonMaker => Adult Questions for LESSONMaker has status of Planned with 4 votes (more votes may help plan happen sooner)

Keep Smiling [:)]

xnman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142503#Comment_1142503

Maybe you guys don't understand... The reason I think WS users should get Sermon Builders is because they had such capability in WS... I don't care what other companies do (i.e. Tesco, etc).... that's not the point.... but if WS users had that capability in WS then they should get it in Logos.... and they did have the capability in WS...

And to give WS users a lesser package (one that does not have capability to build sermons ) means Logos is taking away capabilities that WS users had....

But people that don't know WS don't know the difference. They seem to think that WS users is encroaching or "getting something they should not have" ... Such is not the case. It was not WS users fault that this merger happened and I am sure that LifeWay and Faithlife wanted it to be fair for the WS user... But the L9 Base and Starter packages that most of WS users was put in does not have the capability for WS user to create sermons in Logos. They had this capability in WS....

I'm not angry, not upset. After spending time going through the "learning curve" (and still going through it) of Logos... I like it. It's a great program.

But I do think... WS users did loose capability of being able to have their sermons in Logos.. as the did have them in WS.... I was one of them.

Now.... I am a man... I do make mistakes... and I fully understand that I may have missed something.... so.... lay it on me! I can take it. I think.... [:|]

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142514#Comment_1142514

And to give WS users a lesser package (one that does not have capability to build sermons ) means Logos is taking away capabilities that WS users had....

As per Mr Bink's 'should', I think the question is what FL committed to? A full one-for-one (maybe in their purchase agreement?) or just an approximate match (some missing WS, but some added FL).

I agree, if a one-for-one, your point is well taken. They've been careful describing what their actual duties were. I suspect it was approximate equivalence (selected features plus books).

xnman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142518#Comment_1142518

Denise ---

I understand... but think about this.... many WS users were preachers, pastors, etc. And now to take away their capability to put their sermons and such in the program (WS) they paid very good money for and then because of the merger.... those preachers and pastors, etc. now have to pay more good money for something they already had.... well, that just don't make sense to me.... no matter how you cut that cake.

After reading what I wrote... I realize my words may sound terse... believe me, such is not meant. I am not upset or mean or angry or any of those things. Just saying...

Robert Paul McCloud

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142518#Comment_1142518

Unfortunately, Mr. Binks' example is a poor scenario in comparison to what has occurred. His scenario depicts a one time purchase that is gone once it is consumed. That's not the case between Wordsearch and their customers: theirs was a continual association, So than, Mr. Binks' example just doesn't fit. I also get the impression that Mr. Binks thinks Wordsearch owners are moving from a very inferior product to a much higher grade product, and we should just be happy with what we have (Wordsearch was NOT inferior, just a different approach). That would be fine, IF THIS WAS A SECULAR TRANSACTION BETWEEN COMPANIES AND NOT A CHIRST CENTERED ONES. Secular reasoning should not enter into this.

There are unanswered questions that pertain to what is meant by "equivalent" (as Denise has pointed out). Did Wordsearch's parent company look for a buyer? Or did Logos approach them with an offer to buy Wordsearch? What kind of agreement's were made in the back rooms? Those agreements would depend on who initiated the sale. The appropriate, Biblical response to this buyout is to ensure that those loyal customers who owned Wordsearch have as close to their Wordsearch package as possible within Biblical reason (not secular reason. 1 Corinthians 6 might apply here). Neither company should carry the transition with any attitude of "short changing" the loyal customers of the Wordsearch packages, because to do so would not be Christ like. I myself feel that FL has attempted to do so, but then, I didn't own one of the more powerful packages of Wordsearch.

Ken McGuire

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142514#Comment_1142514

Five years ago I bought a lifetime membership in a brewery's mug club, A bit over a year the brewery closed down. If I were to take advantage of another brewery's special sale offer to members of the old brewery's mug club, would I have the right to complain that their mug club doesn't have some of the features of where I had been a member?

I don't think so. And you can continue to use Wordsearch as long as you want to - or until Microsoft breaks it. So what is the problem?

Mike Binks

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142514#Comment_1142514

I don't care what other companies do (i.e. Tesco, etc).... that's not the point.... but if WS users had that capability in WS then they should get it in Logos.... and they did have the capability in WS...

Ok let's ditch the analogy!

As I am a mean spirited individual who was bidding for the failing Wordsearch company had I been successful I would have frozen development of the Wordsearch program and, over a period run down the book store. I would have raided the Wordsearch licences and converted the gems to my software and ditched the rest. I might have given those who wanted to move over to my platform an introductory offer or two as an inducement.

This would have been fair, Wordsearch users have the program they paid for and the resources they paid for. It is not my concern if they want to wreck the (now frozen) program by updating their OS, breaking their computer or wearing it out.

Mr Prichett is a much nicer man and I think that he has been much kinder than I.

Of course my mate Andy Capp has been a loyal customer of Mr Prichett's for some years. He had noted that in order for the company to prosper they need to sell resources. So he had been buying on a regular basis some things that he has only a passing interest in because his main aim has been to support the development of the platform and ensure the viability of the company. He wonders if the acquisition of another company has been of any advantage to him as a customer. He sees a lot of demanding folk soaking up the development time and money.

Andy is asking where the customers would have gone if Wordsearch had just been allowed to fail or even fallen into my cruel clutches.

As I said I am interested in the use of the word 'should' and how it applies in this context.

Bradley Grainger (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142426#Comment_1142426

I think WS users should get Sermon Builder at least.

As shown in the comparison chart other users have posted, WS12 owners did get the Logos 8 Sermon Builder feature for free.

Were you not aware we had given that feature away, or are you asking about/for something different?

xnman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1142528#Comment_1142528

Mr Ken McGuire....

Simple that WS is doomed to go away....changes and updates to Microsoft will see to that.

Mr. Mike Binks....

I didn't see you as being mean spirited... but I did see you speak as a true businessman. And I am glad you didn't get to purchase WS.... for that reason.

But... Logos appears to me to be a great company... and one that works with people.. and from what I can tell... seems to have a reputation for doing that. And I am thankful for Logos being like that.

My use of the word "should" goes along these lines... L9 Base and Starter packages does not have the Sermon Builder in them. But such capability was in WS... I used it regularly with sermons and such. Logos did not give the preachers and pastors, etc. this capability. I was pointing this out. I think this was an honest mistake or something that was overseen....imho. But this fact somewhat "hinders" preachers and pastor, etc. in Logos as they do not have the capability that they did have.

Now.... Yes they can still use WS... until someone like you buys it or Microsoft changes the OS.... and in any case that is inevitable to happen. Then where will the WS preachers and pastors, etc be? Simply out in the cold unless they pay more money for something they already had...

And by the way, most preachers and pastors, etc. don't make a lot of money, some do, but those are in the .005 percent of most preachers etc. So here is a man of God that paid good money for a program to help him with his work of preaching God's Word, now has to pay double... just because someone decided to arbitrally put him in a package that cut down on his capability of using the program.

So, my reasoning... of Logos "should" have given Sermon Builder to WS users is valid....

IMHO.