Like the Prepositional Use Diagram

I haven't noticed anyone mentioning this so I'm sorry if its a repeat. I really like the Prepositional Use diagram in the Word Study guide. The Translation Ring is nice too. While I'm on the Word study I like that the Greek and English are side by side and highlighted. George S. is probably appalled at this :-) but I applaud it. The only thing I'm not as fond of is that the Philo results are displayed in a separate window after a click. However I could see this becoming something i appreciate over time.

In another post under Beta 1 I mentioned that the thought came to my mind that Logos may be moving more towards library management then Bible Study. some of the reason I think that thought came to my mind was because a lot of the new Bible Study features were not announced "Hey, Check this out" features but more natural feeling features. I find myself saying a lot more "was that in 3.X? and only after looking back at 3.x do I realize it is a brand new feature. I say this as a huge complement to Logos. Right now the Beta bugs may have us overlooking a lot of the great 4.0 enhancements you have made. I have a feeling as things get more refined we are going to say more and more "I didn't even realize how nice that change/upgrade has been!"

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TCBlack

I have a feeling as things get more refined we are going to say more and more "I didn't even realize how nice that change/upgrade has been!"

I completely agree Philip. One of the benefits of having a role in beta is that we not only get to make software better, but we get to be ahead of the curve for release day.

That translates (for me at least) into being prepared to respond on the forums to all of the questions and comments when everyone else gets their first eye-full of Logos 4.

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11506#Comment_11506

That translates (for me at least) into being prepared to respond on the forums to all of the questions and comments when everyone else gets their first eye-full of Logos 4.

I'm sure Morris Proctor is looking and thinking...."I love 4.0...its job security!"

J/K....He's probably thinking "This is really going to help people study Scripture!"

Jason

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11517#Comment_11517

I'm sure Morris Proctor is looking and thinking...."I love 4.0...its job security!"

J/K....He's probably thinking "This is really going to help people study Scripture!"

Philip, in speculation, I would think he's thinking there's a whole lot more videos to do and tips to create! Work, work work!

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11526#Comment_11526

Philip, in speculation, I would think he's thinking there's a whole lot more videos to do and tips to create! Work, work work!

I bet he loves seeing us talk about him :-) And he can't start at least the video work until the beta is done! Maybe he's thinking....I need to extend that training cruise by a week.

Jason

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11528#Comment_11528

I bet he loves seeing us talk about him :-) And he can't start at least the video work until the beta is done! Maybe he's thinking....I need to extend that training cruise by a week.

With luck he could extend it to New Zealand! I would just love the chance to get to know how to run this program more efficiently! Shame Microsoft never did road shows in how to get the most out of their OS's and Office products. [:P]

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11532#Comment_11532

I also think that the "word ring" is a huge visual improvement!

One comment; doesn't the Greek look anemic in the center of the ring? Like it's the wrong font?

For me; it's hard to read....and changing the fonts doesn't change the font inside the ring.

The Hebrew seems ok....its' just the greek that's less than "greeky"

Also, as you can see; there is an issue when clicking on a particular part of the ring; the lables overlap.

Damian McGrath

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11606#Comment_11606

ne comment; doesn't the Greek look anemic in the center of the ring? Like it's the wrong font?

For me; it's hard to read....and changing the fonts doesn't change the font inside the ring.

I actually quite like the individual characters. Anaemic isn't the word that I'd use. I think that the weight of each letter is right for a display font.

The problem appears to be the kerning. The letters are too closely placed to each other.

Bob Pritchett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11606#Comment_11606

Also, as you can see; there is an issue when clicking on a particular part of the ring; the lables overlap.

Just a bit of trivia... "label placement" is a classic computer science problem, and for all intents and purposes it is unsolvable. It's a much bigger problem for maps than pie charts, so I assumed that there'd be a "pretty good" algorithm for pie charts. I did a pretty extensive search of the academic literature, and was amazed to find this area almost completely unexplored. (Microsoft recently patented a cool algorithm for this, which is not yet in Excel -- it generates worse label placement than we do -- but it's patented, non-trivial to implement, and would execute more slowly.)

So we're going to have a few overlaps, and some unlabeled smaller segments; this is as good as it's going to get for a while. :-)

Bob Pritchett

I really like the Prepositional Use diagram

Thank you. We thought it was really cool, too, and wondered why we hadn't seem more comments. (Probaby because it requires the syntax databases, and everyone didn't have them at first...)

What about the "Example Uses" section? Can I fish for a complement? Or a criticism? Or just someone noticing? :-)

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11917#Comment_11917

So we're going to have a few overlaps, and some unlabeled smaller segments; this is as good as it's going to get for a while. :-)

Bob,

Understood...no sweat

What about the "Example Uses" section? Can I fish for a complement? Or a criticism? Or just someone noticing? :-)

I was a little confused about the example uses section; what is the aim of this section?

Is it a quick snap shot of the various uses?

Is that same info available in the grammatical relationships section?

I think I get it now....yes...it seems valuable.

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11918#Comment_11918

I really like the Prepositional Use diagram

Thank you. We thought it was really cool, too, and wondered why we hadn't seem more comments. (Probaby because it requires the syntax databases, and everyone didn't have them at first...)

I can't speak for others but the reason I have not mentioned much on the syntactical elements is because I didn't use them much under 3, so I didn't look for them under 4. 3 was extremely slow pulling in this information so over time I got in the habit of overlooking it. When I did start to notice it in 4, I thought, I wonder how they did that in 3.

I just played around with it more and I'm not sure if I hadn't noticed, it didn't register, or what but at the least I realized when I hovered over a definition it gives me a ring for that English word. It seems like a long time ago since I used it but I can remember in 3 having to start a new English word study to find other synonymous Greek words. Very handy feature. Is there a way to do a statistical comparison or Greek word translational uses to say these words have 4 common translational uses, these 2, etc.? Or you can pull in the Webster Thesaurus to say "here are some English synonyms that you might want to consider a chart for as well. I'm talking 4.9 here :-) my creative juices got away from me. Maybe we can do this now and don't know it.

What about the "Example Uses" section? Can I fish for a complement? Or a criticism? Or just someone noticing? :-)

I had noticed and it did elicit a "That's cool" response. how are the examples chosen out of all the possibilities?

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11990#Comment_11990

What about the "Example Uses" section? Can I fish for a complement? Or a criticism? Or just someone noticing? :-)

I had noticed and it did elicit a "That's cool" response. how are the examples chosen out of all the possibilities?

I forgot to mention, I do love the way the verse fades in and out...very nice visual touch. :-)

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11990#Comment_11990

Regarding "Example Uses" in the Bible Word Study:

how are the examples chosen out of all the possibilities?

The examples are the first four (I think) unique English translations for an item.

Also, did you notice that for the "Grammatical Relationships" section, you can shift views between "by related word" (currently default) and "verses"? Hover the bar near the right side, click when you see "Settings", then select your option. Here's an example for επιθυμεω:

"by related word"

"verses"

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12013#Comment_12013

Rick,

Nice!!

thanks for the tips!

It must be nice to have "all knowledge"... [:O]

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12013#Comment_12013

The examples are the first four (I think) unique English translations for an item.

ahh...where i see this being very useful is if you want a quick snapshot rather then waiting for the grammatical section to "draw up" the results.

I did notice the settings thing. A part of me likes that its hidden...keeps things clean and un-distracted. If your wishing for the feature you will probably find it. The other part of me is undecided :-)

Bob Pritchett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12013#Comment_12013

The examples are the first four (I think) unique English translations for an item.

I'm pretty sure they're the four most-frequent.

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12347#Comment_12347

Bob and Rick,

thanks for clarifying.

Richard Lyall

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12358#Comment_12358

Yes the BWS is definitely one of the stars of the show.

Chris Elford

I haven't noticed anyone mentioning this so I'm sorry if its a repeat. I really like the Prepositional Use diagram in the Word Study guide. The Translation Ring is nice too. While I'm on the Word study I like that the Greek and English are side by side and highlighted. George S. is probably appalled at this :-) but I applaud it. The only thing I'm not as fond of is that the Philo results are displayed in a separate window after a click. However I could see this becoming something i appreciate over time.

Where is this? When I do a Bible Word Study all I get is Definition, Hebrew words, Greek words and Textual Searches. I've tried with justification, through, love, etc.

I tried creating a custom template: clicked on "This guide works with" Bible Words. See all these individual options. Selected them all. But all it produces is the same four sections.

Here are screen shots:

Chris

Chris Elford

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11918#Comment_11918

I really like the Prepositional Use diagram

Thank you. We thought it was really cool, too, and wondered why we hadn't seem more comments. (Probaby because it requires the syntax databases, and everyone didn't have them at first...)

What about the "Example Uses" section? Can I fish for a complement? Or a criticism? Or just someone noticing? :-)

What are the "syntax databases" that Bob is talking about? I have Gold and Biblical Languages and Lexham, do I have these?

Chris

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12404#Comment_12404

What are the "syntax databases" that Bob is talking about? I have Gold and Biblical Languages and Lexham, do I have these?

I believe you should. It means you can do a search like find where XXX is the direct object of YYYY...that sort of stuff. Before the syntax databases you had to search for XXX within N Words of YYYY and filter through everything for where it is a direct object relationship. Its pretty subjective to creator of the database, but so is morphological tagging, only to a lesser degree.

Chris Elford

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/12403#Comment_12403

Okay, I think I answered my own question with respect to the prepositional use - it is only with a greek word.

Chris