How to best research a complex topic in Logos 8
I am going to write a paper on what the Bible says about salvation for those people who never heard of Jesus or the plan of salvation or the Bible at all. An example of this type of people would be a 16th century Korean or Japanese.
The syllogism is: The Bible says you must believe in Jesus to be saved. It is impossible to believe in something you have never heard of or never knew existed. Therefore everyone who never heard of Jesus or knew of His existence is condemned to hell. Is the true or false. That is what I am trying to research.
I have over 9000 books in my library and would like to use the power of Logos to research this. I am looking for several different view points and the arguments for and against that view point that can be found in my library.
I am unsure where to begin or how to do the research in Logos. If anyone can help, I would be very grateful.I am open to any suggestions but especially search syntax and search types. The bottom line is I really don't know what to search for. Thanks for your help.
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I would start with three "Everything" searches:
- "baptism of desire"
- salvation NEAR "never heard"
- salvation NEAR non-Christian
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Thanks MJ. I'll give it shot. It is nice to know I can always count on you.
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Hi
I was some one who never heard of Jesus or the plan of salvation
I someone was walking with me.
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It is impossible to believe in something you have never heard of or never knew existed. Therefore everyone who never heard of Jesus or knew of His existence is condemned to hell. Is the true or false. That is what I am trying to research.
Search your resources for {Milestone <Rom 2:14-16>} where this passage speaks to your concern.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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This thread illustrates you have to know the search-for concepts. But you also need the alternative search-for. In this specific case, 2nd Temple tried two solutions to the conumdrum: no-believe-access + bad behavior = the abyss. Or saved = elected-from-the-start. The NT and subsequent continued the struggle.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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I would start with three "Everything" searches:
- "baptism of desire"
- salvation NEAR "never heard"
- salvation NEAR non-Christian
Can be combined into one search: (679 resources in my Logos library)
"baptism of desire" OR (("never heard" OR non-Christian) NEAR salvation)
Chapter heading "Finding Jesus" in Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus: A Devout Muslim Encounters Christianity provided a search expansion: (5,844 resources in my Logos library)
Refined search a bit (keep "Finding Jesus" result while reducing number of sermon archive results ... 1,497 resources)
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Thanks Dave. I will give it a shot.
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I am not sure what thread you are referring to. But thanks anyway for your willingness to help
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Thanks so much. This is very helpful and makes a great springboard for other searches. Very thought provoking. I really appreciate it
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Can be combined into one search: (679 resources in my Logos library)
"baptism of desire" OR (("never heard" OR non-Christian) NEAR salvation)
You are absolutely right. However, there is a reason why in this case I would not - because I know that I will want to refine me criteria based on what each finds of interest..
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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In addition to the suggestions above, you'll probably want to (re)search these phrases/topics:
- Fate of the unevangelized / destiny of the unevangelized
- Fate of the Pagans
- Universalism
- Pluralism
- Exclusivism / restrictivism
- Inclusivism
- Theology of religions
- Age of Accountability (broadly related to the concept of culpability and judgment in relationship to knowledge)
- Salvation of infants / infant salvation
- Salvation/fate/destiny of mentally disabled/handicapped
- Divine perseverance
- Anonymous Christian
Factbook is a good place to start for many of these topics.
You may also want to check out some of the following books and articles:
- Four Views on Salvation in a Pluralistic World
- Sanders, John, Gabriel Fackre, and Ronald H. Nash. What about Those Who Have Never Heard?: Three Views on the Destiny of the Unevangelized, ed. John Sanders, Spectrum Multiview Books. Downers Grove, IL: IVP Academic, 1995.
- Erickson, Millard. How Shall They Be Saved? Grand Rapids: Baker, 1996.
- S. Mark Heim, The Depth of the Riches: A Trinitarian Theology of Religious Ends, Sacra Doctrina: Christian Theology for a Postmodern Age. Grand Rapids, MI; Cambridge, U.K.: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company, 2001.
- Sanders, John. No Other Name: An Investigation into the Destiny of the Unevangelized. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1992.
- Sullivan, Francis. Salvation Outside the Church? Tracing the History of the Catholic Response. New York: Paulist, 1992.
- Borland, James. “A Theologian Looks at the Gospel and World Religions.” Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society 33 (March 1990): 3–11.
- Nash, Ronald. Is Jesus the Only Savior? Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1994.
- Anderson, J. N. D. Christianity and World Religions, chap. 5. Downers Grove, Ill.: InterVarsity Press, 1984.
- Kreeft, Peter. Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Heaven, chap. 10. San Francisco: Harper & Row, 1982.
- Pinnock, Clark. A Wideness in God’s Mercy: The Finality of Jesus Christ in a World of Religions. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1992.
- Davis, Stephen. “Universalism, Hell and the Fate of the Ignorant.” Modern Theology 6 (January 1990): 173–86.
- Fackre, Gabriel. The Christian Story, 1:219–41, 2:254–340. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1984–1987.
- ——. “The Scandals of Particularity and Universality.” Midstream 22 (January 1983): 32–52.
- Walls, Jerry. Hell: The Logic of Damnation. Notre Dame, Ind.: University of Notre Dame Press, 1992.
- Clarke, Andrew, and Bruce Winter, eds. One God, One Lord: Christianity in a World of Religious Pluralism. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker Book House, 1992.
- Crockett, William, and James Sigountos, eds. Through No Fault of Their Own? The Fate of Those Who Have Never Heard. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker Book House, 1991.
- Richard, Ramesh. The Population of Heaven: A Biblical Response to the Inclusivist Position on Who Will Be Saved. Chicago: Moody Press, 1994.
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In addition to the suggestions above, you'll probably want to (re)search these phrases/topics:
- Fate of the unevangelized
- Fate of the Pagans
- Pluralism
- Exclusivism
- Inclusivism
- Age of Accountability (broadly related to the concept of culpability and judgment in relationship to knowledge)
- Salvation of infants / infant salvation
- Salvation/fate of mentally disabled/handicapped
Factbook is a good place to start for many of these topics.
I'd also check out Four Views on Salvation in a Pluralistic World.
Thanks Phil. This will be very helpful.
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Can be combined into one search: (679 resources in my Logos library)
"baptism of desire" OR (("never heard" OR non-Christian) NEAR salvation)
You are absolutely right. However, there is a reason why in this case I would not - because I know that I will want to refine me criteria based on what each finds of interest..
Thanks again MJ. That is a good strategy I had not thought of.
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It is impossible to believe in something you have never heard of or never knew existed. Therefore everyone who never heard of Jesus or knew of His existence is condemned to hell. Is the true or false. That is what I am trying to research.
Search your resources for {Milestone <Rom 2:14-16>} where this passage speaks to your concern.
Hi Dave,
I thought I knew what you were saying and I did get some interesting hits with this but it turns out that your search criteria is more sophisticated than I am.
Can you explain this search criteria and tell me exactly how and why it works?
Thanks again!
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Can you explain this search criteria and tell me exactly how and why it works?
Rom 2:14-16 is the passage that deals with salvation outside of the Law and a knowledge of Jesus.
A Search for <Rom 2:14-16> will only find references that match it in resource text.
But a Search for {Milestone <Rom 2:14-16>} will find articles that discuss the text of that bible reference e.g. in a Bible Commentary, Study Bible, or other resource where you can enter a bible Reference to get to its articles.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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You may also want to check out some of the following books and articles:
OFF-TOPIC @Phil Gons: May I ask how you created the links in the lower part of your suggested list (from Sanders onward)?
They come up in a strange format, including a biblio.au part like https://ref.ly/logosref/biblio.au$3DKreeft,$2520Peter$7Cbt$3DEverything$2520You$2520Ever$2520Wanted$2520to$2520Know$2520About$2520Heaven$7Clbid$3D2102087$7Cpl$3DSan$2520Francisco$7Cpr$3DHarper$2520$26$2520Row$7Cyr$3D1982
and will not really work in my Chrome browser on Windows 10. They open the Logos Web app (which the ref.ly format nicely provides for) and then ask me whether I want to open Logos. Regardless of whether I allow that (the opening the Logos desktop application) or cancel it, the resource won't be opened in either the web app or Logos desktop for me.
The standard ref.ly links that are generated from the kebap menu as "copy location as URL" (like https://ref.ly/logosres/vrythngyvrwntdk?ref=Page.p+3&off=13&ctx=PETER+KREEFT%0a~Everything+You+Ever+Wanted+ ) will work fine - they won't ask for opening Logos but just do it.
Have joy in the Lord!
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What about the Lexham Survey of Theology? I'll be honest and say I haven't used it much but I would think a good poking around the salvation topic might generate some reads.
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What about the Lexham Survey of Theology? I'll be honest and say I haven't used it much but I would think a good poking around the salvation topic might generate some reads.
My link above for the Fate of the unevangelized opens the Theology Guide, which is powered by the Lexham Survey of Theology.
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@Phil, let's take the off-topic discussion about the non-working "biblio.au" links to a separate thread where MJ Smith reported a non-working "biblio.at" link (which I can recreate)
Have joy in the Lord!
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Hello MJ. I saw your answer and I think you might help me. I have a broader and more simple question. I am in Dr Heiser's Awakening School. I am trying to find all instances of (singular) God/YHWH/Elohim coupled with any creation type words, form, fashion, make, made, create, breath life into. I have a full version of Logos 8 plus lots of references, plus content in general. I am looking to learn how to do such a study? What videos would be best? I understand just some basics. I appreciate any help you may have. I am essentially wondering where I start to build up prowess in Logos from videos.
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Greetings CharlesJ.
If you see there is only 1 follower to this thread.
I am interested in your search, why don't you try to to post the request in a new dedicated post to see how others would go about it?
Peace and grace.
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I am trying to find all instances of (singular) God/YHWH/Elohim coupled with any creation type words, form, fashion, make, made, create, breath life into.
I am interested in your search
Plural God search
Singular God search
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Thank you KS4J.
Peace and grace.
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Any reason you have not upgraded to the free Logos 9 Engine?
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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Any reason you have not upgraded to the free Logos 9 Engine?
It appears that you are replying to the original post in this thread (March 2020), and Logos 9 was not released until October.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Any reason you have not upgraded to the free Logos 9 Engine?
It appears that you are replying to the original post in this thread (March 2020), and Logos 9 was not released until October.
Thanks Dave. I missed that.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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