What do these books that faithlife sells on website have to do with Christianity?
Welcome to the forums. Unfortunately, the guidelines forbid the discussion of theology. Therefore, I will simply ask you if there is anything in human experience that is outside Christianity or is Christianity a comprehensive worldview? The eBook site is not limited to Christianity related books but is a generic feed of books that has been automatically scanned for offensive titles.
Or this one? i contacted customer support and they were very little help. this is a serious problem for me being a long standing customer. And there are many more ebooks like this on the website. And I’m sorry for the curse words but the community needs to be aware of what is going on with logos.
this is a serious problem for me being a long standing customer.
For many other long-standing customers, others trying to censor what is available for them to read is a serious problem. In your first case, the books is likely helpful to Christian counselors. In the second case, I would have to read the book to determine it's potential value to those who study Christianity in pop culture. And knowing nothing about the artist or the author, I do not know why provocative language was chosen. My reading list is too long for me to feel like reading it to defend it; but without reading it, no one can legitimately request its removal. Personally, I find so much heresy, I don't have time to worry about the provocative.
... automatically scanned for offensive titles ...
I just lost any confidence in the future of AI based Bible software [:|]
Maybe they should wait to replace humans until they have automation that is proven to work reliably?
I just lost any confidence in the future of AI based Bible software
The software has been used (and updated I suspect) for at least 2017 and complaints about titles on Noet (now defunction) go back to 2016. Every few months a Logos user runs into a title that is profane or refers to what the user considers to be a non-Christian cult. Yes, sometimes a book gets through that truly has no place on the site; Logos removes it quickly when it is brought to their attention. But the tone and spacing of the reports leads me to believe many users go for years without ever running into a book that is offensive to them. Which implies that the screening is effective but not perfect.
Because of the nature of the eBook feed, this process has been automated since it was first initiated. Bob had a forum conversation with the users over the balance of not offering the books at all or offering many books some of which are not relevant. See Do you want every ebook in the world in Logos? - Logos Forums for the 2015 discussion. Then remember this discussion is > 8 years later.
but without reading it, no one can legitimately request its removal.
MJ, I disagree. Anyone can request a book to be removed. Your rule is it needs to be read first, but this particular example I think the cover alone should disqualify it from the Logos library for business reasons alone. The title is offensive and the book has nothing to do with Biblical studies.
I realize you have good reason to oppose those that request books be removed, but sometimes you need to concede that some do not belong. The Samuel Jackson book is one of those in my opinion. There is a difference between censorship and deciding from a business perspective not to include material that is offensive to your customer base. That is how you lose customers. If someone really wants to read most of the books that are complained about they can do so in many other formats other than Logos.
Two possible answers to the question I <think> you are trying to ask (i.e. "Why is Logos selling this book?")
1. When it comes to FLEB titles, the process is semi-automated. Many (most?) books are published by large publishing conglomerates which are not "Christian." The FLEB titles (rather than the "Logos Edition" ones) are auto converted and "pulled" into the FLEB catalog. While this presents some challenges, it allows users to have access to (beneficial) resources we would not otherwise have access to.
2. Some books which appear out of place are utilized as textbooks in schools. For the record: Instructors do not always utilize sources they agree with. Utilizing and interacting with sources from opposing views is an important part of the educational process.
I suspect that at least one of these titles will be pulled when evaluated.
Any movie with Samuel Jackson in it, I try to avoid. I would avoid all books with vulgarity in the title like the one you mention. I would rather fill my mind with better things and thoughts. It is not in keeping with what I think of as being Christian values. I would ban the book if I could.
but sometimes you need to concede that some do not belong.
I have done so recently - I think it was only a book or two ago.
I think the cover alone should disqualify it from the Logos library for business reasons alone.
I assume you are referring to the second book objected to rather than the first. I disagree based on the experience of reading a Christian related title that offended some that was actually a good and relevant book Vulgar title on prepub - Logos Forums I was taught "you can't judge a book by its cover" and I've found it to be true for six decades. Furthermore, a small amount of research shows me why the vulgarity is appropriate in the title: Let Us Count the Many Different Ways That Samuel L. Jackson Uses His Favorite Curse Word - The Ringer, TIL according to Samuel L. Jackson, the words "Bad Motherfucker" are engraved into Mace Windu's lightsaber in the "Star Wars" prequels : r/todayilearned (reddit.com) I'll admit I had know idea who Jackson was and why the phrase was used but it took little effort to go from knee-jerk reaction to understanding of the title.
The title is offensive and the book has nothing to do with Biblical studies.
Only if for the first title, you concede that the whole of Christian counseling has nothing to do with Biblical studies - or would you prefer the Jesus reached out to those in the margins of society argument? For the second title, you would have to concede that Christianity in pop culture is not a valid discipline which provides insights useful for evangelization.
deciding from a business perspective not to include material that is offensive to your customer base. That is how you lose customers.
Do you realize how much of the Logos catalog I find offensive? There is one book that years ago Amazon sent me a review copy of that I couldn't make it to page 20 of it was so insulting and demeaning. Logos is as apt to lose customers by catering to the biases of one set of customers as it is to lose customers by a broad selection appealing to a broad range of interpretations of Christianity.
You have to understand that Vic was a former product leader at Amazon. So maybe this is his way of helping Logos stay in business by introducing other types of books for the general public. This will allow exposure to the Logos platform and maybe generate sales. But yeah, I agree, some books shouldn’t even be in the Logos catalog.
DAL
PS. Even the Logos App is now a product Amazon gives away: https://www.amazon.com/Faithlife-Corporation-Bible/dp/B0062RM1VQ
MJ, all my references were to the second book since it was the one that had the profane title.
Sorry MJ, disagreeing with certain theological positions or arguments and using profane language in the title of the book are two different things. The second book has NOTHING to do with the study of the bible AND it offends much of the customer base. It is bad business.
I have not opined on the many other posts about certain books because I could see some research value in them. Not the second book.Sorry. And I don't need to read it to come to my conclusion. It is like having to take home a Hustler Magazine before judging if it is appropriate for me to read for research. Don't have to. The person posting about the second book is right and your response was what I was trying to offer some comment on.
As to your points regarding Christian counseling, a narrow focus library etc. well, they are misdirected as I was not referring to those, but I did give you an opportunity to continue your passionate arguments.
Happy 2024!
Any movie with Samuel Jackson in it, I try to avoid.
Did you know his character Jules in Pulp Fiction quoted from Ezekiel every time he was getting ready to kill somebody? But the quote was a completely made up misquotation. The director of the film apparently knew his audience would never check the reference and just wanted to trash and discredit the Bible.
Alternative explanation
[quote]
Perhaps the most famous line of dialogue from this apartment sequence would be the bible verse recited by Jules as an intimidation tactic, almost like a calling card before shooting his target dead. But of course, this version Ezekiel 25:17 isn’t taken verbatim from the bible. In fact, Tarantino actually took the exchange from the opening scrawl of a Japanese martial-arts film called Karate Kiba (1973), starring Sonny Chiba in the titular role.
Sure, he changed a few words and intonations from the original narration in Kiba.
I am more inclined to believe it is a nod to Karate Kiba that the director expected some in his audience to recognize - the movie equivalent to a software easter egg.
(I regret posting here, since that is keeping this thread alive - I wish it buried and forgotten)
You have to understand that Vic was a former product leader at Amazon. So maybe this is his way of helping Logos stay in business by introducing other types of books for the general public. (...) Even the Logos App is now a product Amazon gives away
Sorry DAL, but this is absolute bonkers and an unbelievably weird conspiracy theory. Some facts
Any movie with Samuel Jackson in it, I try to avoid. Did you know his character Jules in Pulp Fiction quoted from Ezekiel every time he was getting ready to kill somebody? But the quote was a completely made up misquotation. The director of the film apparently knew his audience would never check the reference and just wanted to trash and discredit the Bible.
No. But then I didn't watch Pulp Fiction.... Seems like I remember Satan himself quoting verses to Eve and then later to Jesus....
I wonder how far "into" evil one has to go before they are considered to be a "worker for evil"? Like I said, there are better things to watch....
(I regret posting here, since that is keeping this thread alive - I wish it buried and forgotten) You have to understand that Vic was a former product leader at Amazon. So maybe this is his way of helping Logos stay in business by introducing other types of books for the general public. (...) Even the Logos App is now a product Amazon gives away Sorry DAL, but this is absolute bonkers and an unbelievably weird conspiracy theory. Some facts That a few weird eBooks exist in the Logos environment is much older than the transition from Bob to Vic, the situation has not changed in this regard. The general eBook store is filled by obscure publishers who dump all of their content into it in a fully automated process - some nice classics and some interesting stuff hidden in a large number of books I'd never consider buying. Whether those books are in the shop or not won't make the slightest difference for Logos staying in business or not. The margins are slim, and even if they were near 100% of the price: those eBooks don't sell many copies. I doubt if they would even sell a handful of copies each, unless there's a forum thread highlighting them. I've no idea how old the product page for the Logos App is you are pointing to, but this page is a part of the app store for kindle fire tablets - just like the Google play store and whatever this thing is called for in the Apple ecosystem. Not Amazon is giving the Logos app away for free, Logos does. For years. When I opened the page (German version of it to cater to the geo restrictions) it told me I already own that app, since it is running on my Kindle Fire - probably for about 10 years now.
Conspiracy theory? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
You’re so funny 😆😂😂😂😂😂
Have a nice day man!
website have to do with Christianity?
