Request: More information in the information tab.

Greg Gray
Greg Gray Member Posts: 136 ✭✭
edited November 20 in English Forum

Would it be possible to add a strong's number search to the contents of the information tab?

 

This would make it so when you mouse over a word in a bible with interlinear, you would get the definition of the word, the tense mood etc. and every time  that Greek/Hebrew word  is used in the Bible.

 

One thing I like about the information window is how functional it is.  It is very easy to copy the info to my word processor - or just drag a section to expand it into a new tab, etc.  Being able to ctr click on the verses that contain the same Greek/Hebrew word and copy all info (Definition, tense mood, etc.) all at one time would be very very convenient.

 

Also, if each verse listed had the English word that corresponds to the strong's number highlighted and this highlighting was retained when pasting - IMHO this would be a real benefit for making notes. 

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Comments

  • Dave Hooton
    Dave Hooton MVP Posts: 35,674

    Would it be possible to add a strong's number search to the contents of the information tab?

    NO! Sacre bleu ...

    Dave
    ===

    Windows 11 & Android 13

  • Robert Pavich
    Robert Pavich Member Posts: 5,685 ✭✭✭
  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    Robert, that's perfect.  I've found my new desktop wallpaper.

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Greg Gray
    Greg Gray Member Posts: 136 ✭✭

    I obviously stepped into something here:-)

     

    As a user that never has been a part of this forum until logos 4 beta - I am oblivious to any previous discussion about negatives of using strong's numbers.  Feel free to educate me[:)]

     

    My concern is that although there are practical ways to find all the times a specific word is used, and in which verses - it is not as easy as Logos 3 and definitely not as easy as it could/should be (in my opinion)

    A greater frustration is that there is no practical way, once the verses are found, to then copy them into my notes.

    I know I can click on each reference in the search results - open it in a bible tab - verse copy it - go to my notes and paste, and repeat 10 times (or more or less).   

    My thought was it would be helpful for users when they look for information on a word, they would get the definition, lexicon usage, Tense voice mood, and then all the different times that word is used.

     

     

    I guess as well from the responses, I am unsure if the feelings expressed are against the idea itself, or that Strong's numbers would be used as the source of the search information.   

     

     

     

     

     

  • James Thompson
    James Thompson Member Posts: 296 ✭✭

     

    I obviously stepped into something here:-)

    Yeah! And apparently it smells!   [:D]

  • Robert Pavich
    Robert Pavich Member Posts: 5,685 ✭✭✭

    As a user that never has been a part of this forum until logos 4 beta - I am oblivious to any previous discussion about negatives of using strong's numbers.  Feel free to educate meSmile

     

    Greg,

    Strongs doesn't have the best reputation as far as current scholarship on Greek.It's a bit outdated and there are more resources that are much better; BDAG/HALOT or BDB or whatever.

    I'm sure George will chime in but here is a quote from the web that sums it up:

    • The lexical entries are lacking.
      It is really more of a
      thesaurus than it is a lexicon. There is a lack of explanation
      regarding the USAGE/BACKGROUND of terms and is simply a list of
      meanings. A real lexicon provides a more full/accurate understanding.

     

    • Context issues.
      The Strong's Concordance ONLY
      identifies a Hebrew/Greek term, it does not give meanings across
      contexts. This is where close attention is required. There is a fallacy
      called "illegitimate totality transfer" and those who use the Strong's
      Concordance need to be aware of this fallacy.

     

    • Failure to identify all Hebrew/Greek words.
      Even though the
      impression is given that Strongs gives ALL of the words, it especially
      lacks when it comes to Hebrew and Greek. There are Hebrew constructs
      and Greek prefixes that Strongs does not identify. As you know, if you
      are missing a part of a word, then coming up with the meaning for that
      word is absurd.

     

    Robert Pavich

    For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    Yeah, what Robert said. 

    Plus there's a bit of an inside "joke" in that George, being a lovable little fuzzball is also fairly ... ah... vocal[;)] about the things he's passionate about.  This is one of those things I believe.

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Greg Gray
    Greg Gray Member Posts: 136 ✭✭
    [quote]
    1. The lexical entries are lacking.
    It is really more of a thesaurus than it is a lexicon. There is a lack of explanation regarding the USAGE/BACKGROUND of terms and is simply a list of meanings. A real lexicon provides a more full/accurate understanding.


    2. Context issues.
    The Strong's Concordance ONLY identifies a Hebrew/Greek term, it does not give meanings across contexts. This is where close attention is required. There is a fallacy called "illegitimate totality transfer" and those who use the Strong's Concordance need to be aware of this fallacy.


    3. Failure to identify all Hebrew/Greek words.
    Even though the impression is given that Strongs gives ALL of the words, it especially lacks when it comes to Hebrew and Greek. There are Hebrew constructs and Greek prefixes that Strongs does not identify. As you know, if you are missing a part of a word, then coming up with the meaning for that word is absurd.


    Points 1 and 2 I have been aware of for years, and is the reason that I do not use strong's "lexicon" as a primary resource for getting information. I was not in anyway implying that Strong's "lexicon" was to be the source of information.


    Point 3, I have become more aware of the last few years.


    Sorry if my request was misleading - It has nothing to do with strong's numbers or Lexicon. It is about expanding the information that is displayed for each word.

    Currently the information shows your preferred dictionary and lexicon (which on my setup is not strong's:-) Tense, etc. and cross-references to the verse the word is found in. I would just like the option to expand that to include every verse that contains that particular word. Whether the search is based on Strong's numbers or Lemma, etc . is not what I was getting at.

    Thank you all for filling me in on the past discussions on Strong's.
  • Ted Hans
    Ted Hans MVP Posts: 3,170

    Ha Robert, you crack me up with this![:)] Very funny. Ted

    Helllpp...George

    image


    Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    As a user that never has been a part of this forum until logos 4 beta ...
    OH, and welcome to the Forum's Greg.  We're really all rather nice.  ... well, usually.

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Bob Pritchett
    Bob Pritchett Member, Logos Employee Posts: 2,280

    My concern is that although there are practical ways to find all the times a specific word is used, and in which verses

    We're trying to encourage use of the reverse interlinear -- where you can see the underlying Greek or Hebrew word -- instead of Strong's Numbers. Strong's numbers were really just proxies for the Greek and Hebrew words, and now that you don't have to know Greek alphabetical order to look something up in a lexicon, there's no reason not to just use theGreek  lemma.

    Right click in a text with a rev int, then select the Greek (or Hebrew) lemma, and search on that. It's like searching on the Strong's number.

  • Robert Pavich
    Robert Pavich Member Posts: 5,685 ✭✭✭

    [quote]George, being a lovable little fuzzball

     

    Speechless.... [:S]

    Robert Pavich

    For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    [quote]George, being a lovable little fuzzball

    Speechless.... Tongue Tied

     

    LOL, well it was George's own appellation.  (http://community.logos.com/forums/p/211/1975.aspx#1975)

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Dave Hooton
    Dave Hooton MVP Posts: 35,674

    As a user that never has been a part of this forum until logos 4 beta - I am oblivious to any previous discussion about negatives of using strong's numbers.  Feel free to educate me

    Welcome Greg. It was an unfortunate baptism for you, but I trust you are now educated[:)]

    A practical objection is to doing so much work, with a potentially large output, when hovering as opposed to right-clicking and performing a search on the lemma. v3 provides number of occurrences / number of verses for lemmas in its Information window, so you could ask for that.

    Dave
    ===

    Windows 11 & Android 13

  • Dave Hooton
    Dave Hooton MVP Posts: 35,674

    Ha Robert, you crack me up with this!Smile Very funny. Ted

    Yes, very funny.

    Dave
    ===

    Windows 11 & Android 13

  • Robert Pavich
    Robert Pavich Member Posts: 5,685 ✭✭✭

    What's that parked out in front of my house at 2:00am...it's a black car....the plate is..."Somselmobile"....Oh no!

    Robert Pavich

    For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    Your evil plot backfired Robert, he's coming for you.

    image

    Should this be the new Somsel Avatar?

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you.