Where would a new user start?

I am assuming that all of us are beta testing as existing users of 3.

One of the things that I have been wondering is: Would someone buying version 4 with no prior knowledge of Logos know where to begin with the current interface? What do you guys think?

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Comments

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11174#Comment_11174

Saw that Bob picture.

Had to supress a shudder.

My first thought was "Clippy" from Microsft office. (Shudder)

The second thought was Microsoft Bob. (gag)

Ken McGuire

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11155#Comment_11155

The default list of "KeyLink destinations" (as we used to call them in LDLS3) is completely unordered in Logos 4 Beta 2. (It may be alphabetical, it may be in order of internal resource ID, it may be the order in which you discovered the resources; I don't know.) A more sensible default ordering will be established in an upcoming beta.

We'll also be correcting resource metadata to stop Latin dictionaries and Greek lexicons being used as destinations for English words.

For the first, YIPPEE!! For the 2nd, while there is certainly clean up work required, I wouldn't at all mind if, say, Jerusalem, were looked up in Greek or Hebrew Resources. If this does not happen, I would at least ask that the BWS report somehow allow us to go between languages to do this.

Ken McGuire

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11194#Comment_11194

Saw that Bob picture.

Had to supress a shudder.

My first thought was "Clippy" from Microsft office. (Shudder)

The second thought was Microsoft Bob. (gag)

TCB,
that' was the idea...just a bit of a joke....

But I am serious about the "new user" help thing....make it so you can turn it off but if someone cannot be "walked through" the most common set ups and common tasks right from the start....they are gonna go back to E-Sword and wonder what all of the fuss is about with Logos.

There HAS to be a thing right off the bat to tell them what to do...it's not apparent...

When someone does their first search and get's all this crazy stuff and none of it is from the bibles or references that they wanted...they are going to become disillusioned very quickly.

J.R. Miller

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11174#Comment_11174

great graphic Robert, I hope Bob will consider using it :-)

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11155#Comment_11155

The default list of "KeyLink destinations" (as we used to call them in LDLS3) is completely unordered in Logos 4 Beta 2. (It may be alphabetical, it may be in order of internal resource ID, it may be the order in which you discovered the resources; I don't know.) A more sensible default ordering will be established in an upcoming beta.

We'll also be correcting resource metadata to stop Latin dictionaries and Greek lexicons being used as destinations for English words.

Sounds good. I think that will help the new user and anyone else not proficient in changing hidden settings.

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11106#Comment_11106

even though you were addressing Tom, I'd like to chime in if I may.

So the one thing that really needs to be implemented is what Damian suggested: the "first time user dialogue box" thing....a person like my wife WOULD NEVER figure out what we've been figuring out about setting priorities!

When a first time user fires the app up, he/she should see something like the following to make the setup painless...first impressions are important! If the software isn't set up right...the results will be wrong, and the user will become disenchanted, and tell his /her friends that E-sword was better...not realizing any of the nuances that power users know...

this whole thing should take 10 minutes or less and set all the important things; preferred resources, home page yes or no, whatever...

I like your suggestion Robert but it needs to be something that can be re-initiated because if my wife is going to use it she will come along and inherit the way I have set it up. Thus it will not include her favourite Bibles, etc. My wife prefers the older versions of E-Sword because the format is so simple. There are three panes on a divided screen: Bible, dictionary, commentary. If you want another Bible translation you just click on its abbreviation at the top and you can toggle between every translation you have. If you type in a word in the dictionary it will show you every dictionary that has an entry for that word and then you just click on the abbreviation to read it. Ironically she likes it because it's so visual - visual in a way that anyone can come along and understand it in 10 seconds. If Logos is trying to be like an iPhone I think the old E-Sword set up is the way to go. The iPhone is powerful at what it does, but it does little. You can't run PhotoShop on an iPhone. If it was possible to have a basic three panel screen for new users and yet have the option to be what it is for us that would be great. With all the tagging Logos has done I don't see why that wouldn't be possible to have more than one "face."

Tom

Robert Pavich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11277#Comment_11277

tom,

I guess that's what I was suggesting...that the default be the "easy" version and people like us could "turn that off" for our needs.

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11066#Comment_11066

The WINNER for confusion was clicking on "sexual" in 1 Cor 7:2 in the LEB. It took me to "diaspora" in the Dictionary of the Later NT and Its Developments.

You really did take the program out for a whirl!

Speaking of "whirl" it opens up the Enhanced BDB!

Tom

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/11278#Comment_11278

tom,

I guess that's what I was suggesting...that the default be the "easy" version and people like us could "turn that off" for our needs.

OK, Sound good!

Michael Hite

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/8970#Comment_8970

Our thought was the 4.0 would offer a lot of "places to start" to new users right away, and that the simple three button interface in the upper left -- home, library, search -- would be easy to understand quickly.

Bob - I too am trying very hard to bring fresh eyes to Logos 4. I am a Power User of L3 and I am struggling. While I agree that the three buttons for home, library and search are easy to find their functionality is not so easy. The Home Page offers a great box that says "Enter passage or topic" but a single word entered here doesn't do a topic search it just locates the word. I tried "marriage" and it isn't searching topically. In L3 the same search gave a list of dozens of resources that had been "topically" searched. In L4 I only get three and then a list of dozens of resources that use the word "marriage" not the topic. That is confusing for a new user for sure. The Home Page functionality of Study Passage, Study Word, or Study Topic was a very easy entrance point for new users. Much easier than Logos 4.

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/18207#Comment_18207

The Home Page offers a great box that says "Enter passage or topic" but a single word entered here doesn't do a topic search

This is a known issue. See Beta Release notes here:

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/2237.aspx

They are hoping to get this fixed soon.

Michael Hite

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/18211#Comment_18211

sorry again - it has been hard for me to find the known issues in here.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/18212#Comment_18212

Hi Michael,

I'm following this thread with great interest because I hope to get my husband to sit down with v. 4; he's never used v. 3.

Perhaps, Rich meant this: Under Start Up on known issues Beta 5 Release notes (his link)

"The startup screens have not been finalized (in terms of both workflow and art."

But, Rich can jump in here and clear it up if I am wrong.

Michael, I agree with you about the home page in v. 3 being easier to use. FWIW

Rich DeRuiter

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/18216#Comment_18216

But, Rich can jump in here and clear it up if I am wrong.

Boing.

I was responding to the observation that the topic search doesn't work, even though the home page invites us to input a passage or topic.

But there's a lot of stuff that explains what we can expect to find, or not, in the betas. The list is updated each time a new beta is released.