Two new resources: SBL Greek NT and Apparatus

I just got a 10 MB download and when I checked to see what was new found two new resources:

an SBL Greek NT and Apparatus. Since I did not see this on pre-pub and never ordered it, I assume it is a nice, free upgrade to my Logos software. Hope I am not revealing any secrets here, but didn't see any announcement of this. I am grateful and will now hope to have time to explore it a bit.

EDIT: Here's the official announcement and more info: http://community.logos.com/forums/t/25258.aspx

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Kaye Anderson

If it's a secret, I'm in on it. I got the same download a bit ago. [Y]

Clifford B. Kvidahl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187049#Comment_187049

I am in on this secret as well. Thanks Logos for the nice gift! [:D]

LaRosa Johnson

I got 'em too [:)] nice highlight to my Wednesday afternoon. Can't wait to check it out later today.

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187053#Comment_187053

A little reading of the Introduction reveals some additional information. This was a joint effort between SBL and Logos. It is a free edition available to all. It was created to allow people without access to a critical text to get one for free.

It is a new critical edition of the text based primarily on Westcott and Hort, but with variances from three other sources taken into account (and in some cases, apparently, beyond that). The apparatus is quite accessible, although it is limited to the four main texts that were used to form the new text. You will not find reference in the apparatus to miniscules, papyri, etc., just to the four compared texts.

Interesting, but for many of us it will not replace the UBS or NA text (and apparatus).

BillS

I assume it is a nice, free upgrade to my Logos software.

didn't see any announcement

I am grateful and will now hope to have time to explore it a bit.

Same here... Platinum+...

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187062#Comment_187062

It is a new critical edition of the text based primarily on Westcott and Hort, but with variances from three other sources taken into account (and in some cases, apparently, beyond that). The apparatus is quite accessible, although it is limited to the four main texts that were used to form the new text. You will not find reference in the apparatus to miniscules, papyri, etc., just to the four compared texts.

Thanks for the detective work, Mark.

Interesting, but for many of us it will not replace the UBS or NA text (and apparatus).

True, yet thanks Logos!

Donnie Hale

I have the Platinum edition, I don't show those resources as being in my library, and the "update now" command says "No updates available". Any idea why I wouldn't be getting these?

Thanks,

Donnie

Donnie Hale

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187073#Comment_187073

I enabled Automatic Updates and stopped / restarted L4. The auto-synchronization saw the updates and proceeded to pull them down.

Looks like maybe I'm supposed to use "sync now" instead of "update now'. Not sure how that distinction squares with Bob P.'s comments to the effect that program and content updates are (or at least can be) tightly coupled...

Donnie

Rick Brannan (Logos)

Hi Everybody.

These are free (yes, free) and are presently available in the Scholar's Library and above (not Original Languages).

We're in the process of rolling them out for both Logos 4 and LDLS3. Keep your eyes on the blog and also on http://sblgnt.com for more information. I'll work through the posts here and answer as many questions as I can before then.

One item, though: If you're on the Logos 4.2 beta, there is a known bug with tables. Scrolling to/through a table (such as those in the introduction to the SBLGNT) will cause a crash. This will be fixed in a later beta; there are no such known issues in 4.1 or in LDLS3.x.

- Rick

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187062#Comment_187062

Hi everyone.

It is a new critical edition of the text based primarily on Westcott and Hort, but with variances from three other sources taken into account (and in some cases, apparently, beyond that). The apparatus is quite accessible, although it is limited to the four main texts that were used to form the new text. You will not find reference in the apparatus to miniscules, papyri, etc., just to the four compared texts.

Actually, that's not quite true. Westcott-Hort is a good starting point, but the result is as much WH as other editions (e.g. NA/UBS) are Westcott-Hort.

Essentially, we used four well known editions of the Greek New Testament, accounted for orthographic differences, and used the variation units pointed out by the differences as the starting point for creating the new text. Where the texts agreed the text remained (unless the editor, Michael W. Holmes, had reason to change it, this happened in over 50 instances); where the texts were different, Michael Holmes consulted other manuscript evidence, discussion in technical commentary, known articles, other apparatuses, etc. to review the areas and make a text-critical determination.

So the apparatus gives the edition evidence for the variation unit; it gives the reason why the unit was examined. The examination and determination is from the editor.

Because the apparatus cites editions, most variations that end up in most modern translations are accounted for. If you're preaching the passage, the apparatus is likely to have whatever variation folks in the pew will see in other printed modern translations.

Also, the SBLGNT gives a good comparison point to the standard edition of NA/UBS. Many folks think that if it is in NA/UBS, it must be the best we can do, so just go with it. Not necessarily the case. There are 500+ differences between NA/UBS and the SBLGNT; this can help one (even with the NA/UBS apparatus) weigh the apparatus information differently and more critically.

Steve Adams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187079#Comment_187079

you'll see an update for 10MB and then click on the logos emblem on the bottom right screen and click to restart and the new FREE resources are there.

This is what I love about Logos. They are willing to give us free resources so its not ALL about money. I do realize they need to make a profit, but this is very kind of them.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187082#Comment_187082

One item, though: If you're on the Logos 4.2 beta, there is a known bug with tables. Scrolling to/through a table (such as those in the introduction to the SBLGNT) will cause a crash.

Wish I'd known about this a few minutes ago. :-)

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187088#Comment_187088

This is what I love about Logos. They are willing to give us free resources so its not ALL about money. I do realize they need to make a profit, but this is very kind of them.

I agree Nancy, this is entirely ministry motivated. And made possible because I've purchased so many resources over the years. [;)]

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187087#Comment_187087

Actually, that's not quite true. Westcott-Hort is a good starting point, but the result is as much WH as other editions (e.g. NA/UBS) are Westcott-Hort.

Thanks for the clarification and for the effort behind this edition.

For those who never read a book's preface, Rick is cited in there:

"SBL and Logos would like to express special gratitude to two individuals for their careful, painstaking, and thoughtful work: Michael W. Holmes, who edited the SBLGNT and wrote the introduction to it; and Rick Brannan of Logos Bible Software, who developed the technical infrastructure for the project. Without the scholarship and expertise of Mike and Rick, we would not have been able to advance this significant dimension of critical New Testament research and teaching."

Holmes, M. W. (2010; 2010). The Greek New Testament: SBL Edition. Logos Bible Software.

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187082#Comment_187082

Hi folks.

One clarification. I wrote:

These are free (yes, free) and are presently available in the Scholar's Library and above (not Original Languages).

Once http://SBLGNT.com is live, anybody will be able to do a free unlock of the SBL Greek New Testament and its apparatus if you do not already have the text. We just need to do some work to verify everything is working before we make it live.

Thanks for your patience while we roll this out.

Suzy

Thank You Logos [:)][*]

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187095#Comment_187095

For those who never read a book's preface, Rick is cited in there:

"SBL and Logos would like to express special gratitude to two individuals for their careful, painstaking, and thoughtful work: Michael W. Holmes, who edited the SBLGNT and wrote the introduction to it; and Rick Brannan of Logos Bible Software, who developed the technical infrastructure for the project. Without the scholarship and expertise of Mike and Rick, we would not have been able to advance this significant dimension of critical New Testament research and teaching."

Holmes, M. W. (2010; 2010). The Greek New Testament: SBL Edition. Logos Bible Software.

It was a privilege to be involved, and very, very fun to boot. And, I might add, that Michael W. Holmes is a gentleman and a scholar, in that order. And he's a mighty fine scholar.

Now I get to take "Make edition and apparatus of Greek New Testament" off of my bucket list!

Todd Phillips

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187082#Comment_187082

These are free (yes, free) and are presently available in the Scholar's Library and above (not Original Languages).

We're in the process of rolling them out for both Logos 4 and LDLS3. Keep your eyes on the blog and also on http://sblgnt.com for more information. I'll work through the posts here and answer as many questions as I can before then.

One item, though: If you're on the Logos 4.2 beta, there is a known bug with tables. Scrolling to/through a table (such as those in the introduction to the SBLGNT) will cause a crash. This will be fixed in a later beta; there are no such known issues in 4.1 or in LDLS3.x.

Thanks Rick!

I noticed that the verse numbers in the SBLGNTAPP aren't Bible links (as they are in other apparatuses I own in Logos). Any reason for this?

I keep wanting to hover over the verse numbers to see the whole verse.

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187116#Comment_187116

Hi Todd

I noticed that the verse numbers in the SBLGNTAPP aren't Bible links (as they are in other apparatuses I own in Logos). Any reason for this?

I keep wanting to hover over the verse numbers to see the whole verse.

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll see about making this happen.

Alan Macgregor

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187116#Comment_187116

Thanks, Logos.

Interesting observation in the Preface.

The new text may have other benefits as well. The standard text is viewed by some of those who use it as a “final” text to be passively accepted rather than a “working” text subject to verification and improvement.

See what they've done to Mark 1:1 Ἀρχὴ τοῦ εὐαγγελίου Ἰησοῦ ⸀χριστοῦ.

BTW the Copy Bible Verses tool doesn't work with SBLGNT. See my screenshots

Entering a reference results in the version changing. Changing version to SBLGNT blanks out the verse already chosen. [:(]

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187123#Comment_187123

Hi Alan.

See what they've done to Mark 1:1 Ἀρχὴ τοῦ εὐαγγελίου Ἰησοῦ ⸀χριστοῦ.

And I'm sure Michael Holmes' judgment here is based on his read of the text-critical evidence (I think the Anchor Yale commentary on Mark addresses some of the issues here), it is not driven by any doctrinal/theological agenda.

Entering a reference results in the version changing. Changing version to SBLGNT blanks out the verse already chosen.

This seems to work on the Windows side. I'll point David Mitchell here and see if he has any ideas. Thanks for the report.

Rick Brannan (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187127#Comment_187127

Hi Folks.

Wanted to note that we have a thread with a better title to use to discuss the SBLGNT.

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/25258.aspx

If you could direct discussion there, I'm sure everyone would appreciate it. Thanks!

Peggy McAulay

I saw the received the downloads also but didn't know how to go about checking to see what was new so went to this blog and found me answer. BUT How Do you check for what has been added on my own?

Milford Charles Murray

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187136#Comment_187136

Peace to you, Peggy! *smile*

In your Library under one "view" panel there is a column for "recently added"

Try clicking on that once for ascending order - or again for descending order of your last updates.. If your "find" box is empty, that is!

*smile*

If you want to see when a particular resource was updated, then put that in the find box and go to the end of the one "view" section.

Blessings

George Somsel

I just got a 10 MB download and when I checked to see what was new found two new resources:

An SBL Greek NT and Apparatus. Since I did not see this on pre-pub and never ordered it, I assume it is a nice, free upgrade to my Logos software. Hope I am not revealing any secrets here, but didn't see any announcement of this. I am grateful and will now hope to have time to explore it a bit.

It would be nice if we were informed of such additions (as well as changes in the program) when they occur. Had it not been for the notice in this forum I don't know how long it would have been before I noticed it.

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187088#Comment_187088

This is what I love about Logos. They are willing to give us free resources so its not ALL about money. I do realize they need to make a profit, but this is very kind of them.

[Y] +1 [^]

DAL

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187192#Comment_187192

Sweet! I got them too. These 2 are helping me to get to the 2000 resource mark. I'm so looking forward to 12 Days of Logos sale this coming December!

Milford Charles Murray

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187197#Comment_187197

Sweet! I got them too. These 2 are helping me to get to the 2000 resource mark. I'm so looking forward to 12 Days of Logos sale this coming December!

Peace to you, Douglas! And Joy!

I'm pleased also with these also! Am a big Logos fan! *smile*

However, I'm wondering ............. isn't it a bit presumptuous of us if we expect Logos to come up with a 12 Days of Logos sale this Christmas. Or to expect them to even have a Christmas Special. Now, it is true, that in the many years I've been a Logos follower, they always do something special. I remember many discussions on this point on the old Logos Newsgroups, may they rest in peace! *smile*

However, I feel very humble about that, and I will put any decision about Christmas specials right back into their hands. *smile*

Kindest personal greetings!

Jerry M

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187141#Comment_187141

In your Library under one "view" panel there is a column for "recently added"

You must be a beta tester to have this feature in your library. The newest resources you have added are listed in your Logos account. Go to your order history and look at the dates. If you have all your software is currently updated, those resources should be in your library.

Milford Charles Murray

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187204#Comment_187204

Jerry is absolutely correct, of course! *smile*

I must apologise that I forgot that I was a Beta Tester. Totally slipped my old mind!

Thank you, Jerry. Much appreciated!

Peace to you!

nicky crane

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187207#Comment_187207

Thank you for giving us these new resources. Can someone explain in words of one syllable for an idiot how we use them?? [*-)]

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187314#Comment_187314

Thank you for giving us these new resources. Can someone explain in words of one syllable for an idiot how we use them??

You would use it in the same fashion you would use your NA27 print edition with the exception that the apparatus doesn't refer to the manuscript tradition but to the edited print editions such as W & H, Tregelles and the Byz Maj text edited by Robinson & Pierpont. I would suggest you should have Metzger's Textual Commentary and Tischendorf's Novum Testamentum Graece: Apparaticus Criticus handy as well so you can get the readings of the manuscripts.

Jerry M

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187207#Comment_187207

Totally slipped my old mind!

I just turned 58 yrs old (Happy Birthday) , so I can certainly identify! I do appreciate your insights and kind words to various Logos users. You inspire me to yield to the Lord in developing Christ-Like attitudes and words.

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187321#Comment_187321

Totally slipped my old mind!

I just turned 58 yrs old (Happy Birthday) , so I can certainly identify! I do appreciate your insights and kind words to various Logos users. You inspire me to yield to the Lord in developing Christ-Like attitudes and words.

Hah, hah ! I'll be 39 on my next birthday (want to buy a bridge ?). [6]

Bohuslav Wojnar

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187127#Comment_187127

Rick, thank you very much for making that resources available to us. It's great to see a new critical Greek text of the NT and the reasoning behind it. I am very happy to have it. Thank you and thanks to Logos. [Y]

Bohuslav Wojnar

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187326#Comment_187326

Hah, hah ! I'll be 39 on my next birthday (want to buy a bridge ?).

Greetings to you George, I like your 39 years number [:D]. I noticed by the way you just changed the avatar picture. My old eyes [:)] are not able to see what is the picture about... [:(]

George Somsel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187331#Comment_187331

Hah, hah ! I'll be 39 on my next birthday (want to buy a bridge ?).

Greetings to you George, I like your 39 years number . I noticed by the way you just changed the avatar picture. My old eyes are not able to see what is the picture about...

It's supposed to be my granddaughter, the love of my life; but since I'm not too skilled in photo manipulation, I don't seem to be able to crop it properly to fit in the space allotted. Anyone who could help me if I send the pic?

Bohuslav Wojnar

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/187345#Comment_187345

Anyone who could help me if I send the pic?

Now I see her a little bit, as you said it. I can help you to crop the picture, or you should be able to do it easily in a free programs like faststone. You can send the picture to my email ( you should have my address already) with the information how much of the original picture you would like to show.

P.S. After my wife and me being happy grandparents with our 3 year old grandson, we just got granddaughter a few months ago. Great feeling [Y].