search "the"
Comments
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Gerald P. Swetsky said:
This is rather weird. I got better times with 2 gig of RAM than with 3.
Two gig: 0.09, 0.94, 18.50
Three gig: 0.38, 1.31, 19.84
Figure that one out. Resource numbers were the same as were the number of hits. In each case I killed all unnecessary services and programs prior to running the test.
Gerry
You probably lost performance due to the loss of Dual Channel RAM. I'm assuming you added another 1GB module to a system that previously had 2 x 1GB modules. If this is the case, your system's RAM is no longer running in Dual Channel. Going from Dual Channel to Single Channel does not cut performance in half. Typically you lose about 5-10% performance. This is consistent with your numbers (18.50 to 19.84 is a 7% loss). If you had 2 x 2GB modules (4GB) then you would be able to run in Dual Channel and have about the same performance as 2 x 1GB modules. Either way, I wouldn't expect the amount of RAM to affect the performance of this type of search. This type of search is most affected by drive speed, CPU speed, and RAM speed.
If you are using only Logos 4 with nothing else running in the background 2GB is usually sufficient. However, if you have several additional programs open in the background then you might start to see a performance gain with 3-4GB; especially the more you use Logos 4 per session.
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz | 8GB RAM @ 1866MHz | Intel SSD G2
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Running 4.0c Beta Release candidate 4. By the way, Logos is has "4.o". That is the letter o rather than the number "0".
This is when Logs4 first opened.
This is after restarting L4.
This is after starting it a second time.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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Lynden Williams said:
This is after starting it a second time.
Logos 4 is caching the search even after you close the program. If you reboot your computer the search time should revert back to the 35 second time.
Another HUGE difference I have seen from computer to computer is the amount of time it takes to populate the search field after typing in a word such as "the" for the first time. If you reboot your computer; open Logos; open search; type in "the"; it can take as long as 75 seconds to populate the search field. After you have done this once it must be cached in RAM, because it is nearly instantaneous the next time you type something in; even after closing and reopening Logos 4. However, if you reboot your computer it will take a long time the first time you type in any word in the drop down box. This is another place where an SSD can make a big difference. Even the first search will populate in less than 1 second since the index is essentially already in RAM.
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz | 8GB RAM @ 1866MHz | Intel SSD G2
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Phillip said:
Logos 4 is caching the search even after you close the program. If you reboot your computer the search time should revert back to the 35 second time.
This is due to the file system cache built into the OS. If your currently running programs aren't using all your physical memory, Windows will keep recently accessed files in that memory in case the programs you're running access them again. (This is another reason why it's good to have plenty of memory installed; even if your applications can't directly use it all, Windows can use it to speed up all applications and the OS itself.)
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Phillip said:
You probably lost performance due to the loss of Dual Channel RAM. I'm assuming you added another 1GB module to a system that previously had 2 x 1GB modules. If this is the case, your system's RAM is no longer running in Dual Channel. Going from Dual Channel to Single Channel does not cut performance in half. Typically you lose about 5-10% performance. This is consistent with your numbers (18.50 to 19.84 is a 7% loss). If you had 2 x 2GB modules (4GB) then you would be able to run in Dual Channel and have about the same performance as 2 x 1GB modules. Either way, I wouldn't expect the amount of RAM to affect the performance of this type of search. This type of search is most affected by drive speed, CPU speed, and RAM speed.
If you are using only Logos 4 with nothing else running in the background 2GB is usually sufficient. However, if you have several additional programs open in the background then you might start to see a performance gain with 3-4GB; especially the more you use Logos 4 per session.
Philip, it appears you are absolutely correct. Adding a fourth gig of RAM brought the speeds down considerably. Actually, my computer shop took back all the single gig sticks and gave me two twos. I also have to add the search with four gig was done on the newest release of L4.
Here are the figures.........
Two gig: 0.09, 0.94, 18.50
Three gig: 0.38, 1.31, 19.84
Four gig: 0.030, -- , 13.00Color me pleased - Gerry
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45,390,482 results in 1,422,288 articles in 3,3134 resources (33.27 seconds). And yes, a cached search is much faster (17.93 seconds).
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 3770K | 32GB RAM | GTX 750 Ti 2GB | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (system) | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (Logos) | WD Black 1.5 TB (storage) | WD Red 3 TB x 3 (storage) | HP w2408h 24" | First F301GD Live 30"
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Thomas Black said:
Excuse me whilst I go meditate on Exodus 20:17.
Love your humor Thomas. It gave me a lift today.
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Its interesting with my setup-
3.95 million hits per second- and a cached search only knocks off 0.02 seconds.
I think you will not see much speed improvement beyond a storage read speed of 500mb/sec, as my study showed earlier a minimal increase doing a ramdisk with a 2000mb/sec read speed (although I am at a read speed of 750 mb/sec now.)
At this point, its all system speed- RAM & cpu. I got significant speed increases going from ddr3-1600 to ddr3-1900 in BIOS settings. Also, cpu speed.
I am temperature stable at 4.5GHZ- I will try next to see if i can get stable at 5ghz, and see what kind of reading I get for Logos.
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Up to 5 million hits per second:
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz | 8GB RAM @ 1866MHz | Intel SSD G2
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Mathew Haferkamp said:
I have 32,048,479 in 28.55 sec, what's your's???
So, what have you proven? I'm more interested in what it will do on a practical situation. I don't very often (NEVER) search for "the." A morph search with one lemma (perhaps in a particular case in Greek) in proximity to another lemma (again, possibly in a particular case in Greek) is far more significant than searching for a term such as "the" which I will never use.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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George Somsel said:
So, what have you proven?
George,
I don't think that he was trying to PROVE anything....just having fun...
By the way....where is the OTHER grumpy old man from the balcony of the muppets show?
Robert Pavich
For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__
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Robert Pavich said:George Somsel said:
So, what have you proven?
George,
I don't think that he was trying to PROVE anything....just having fun...
By the way....where is the OTHER grumpy old man from the balcony of the muppets show?
I don't know any grumpy old men, do you?
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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George Somsel said:Robert Pavich said:George Somsel said:
So, what have you proven?
George,
I don't think that he was trying to PROVE anything....just having fun...
By the way....where is the OTHER grumpy old man from the balcony of the muppets show?
I don't know any grumpy old men, do you?
Everybody knows that George is not old! [:D]
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Boy, I love the creative ways people find to waste time! [:D] Well I'm in...
Woohoo!
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Isn't it absurd that it's much faster to search for "the" in the entire library, than to search for "*" in a tiny little book like Philemon?
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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fgh said:
Isn't it absurd that it's much faster to search for "the" in the entire library, than to search for "*" in a tiny little book like Philemon?
No, because "the" is an indexed word, and therefore "pre-counted" by the indexer. (So in a way, it's not faster. The work was just done earlier--when you indexed.)
To find a wildcard ("*"), Logos has to search for every matching entry in the entire index (all of them in the case of "*"), and then check to see if each matching entry has a hit in the search range.
(Apologies, if that was just a rhetorical question.)
MacBook Pro (2019), ThinkPad E540
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47,908,168 results in 1,588,092 articles in 3839 resources in 18.53 seconds = 2.5 M/sec
Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org0 -
Very cool. Now back to work!
Windows PC - Android Phone - Surface Pro 4
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I have been looking at everyone's numbers, and I am wondering what type of computer everyone is using. My laptop is only a couple of years old, it has twice the amount of memory and twice the amount of processing speak that L4 needs, and my numbers (Num of resources and the amount of time it took) are not even close to anyones.
The only other program that I had open was MS Word.
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Hi Tom
Interesting....
I got 23M hits in 1,303 resources in 34.77 sec and my laptop is about 15-18 months old with a low NovaBench score - 268 as per http://community.logos.com/forums/p/24555/182723.aspx#182723
Have you run this benchmark - if so, what results did you get?
What version of Logos are you running? There were some enhancements to the search engine in the current beta of 4.2a which could be a factor here (although I'm not sure they would affect single word searches like this).
Graham
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tom collinge said:
I have been looking at everyone's numbers, and I am wondering what type of computer everyone is using. My laptop is only a couple of years old, it has twice the amount of memory and twice the amount of processing speak that L4 needs, and my numbers (Num of resources and the amount of time it took) are not even close to anyones.
The CPU speed seems to be the biggest factor* in this search. Below is a general guide of what to expect:
CPU Speed: 4.6GHz -- Hits per Second: 5.1 million
CPU Speed: 3.8Ghz -- Hits per Second: 3.6 million
CPU Speed: 3.4GHz -- Hits per Second: 3.0 million
CPU Speed: 2.6GHz -- Hits per Second: 2.2 million
CPU Speed: 2.2GHz -- Hits per Second: 1.7 million
CPU Speed: 1.6GHz -- Hits per Second: 200,000??
*A Solid State Drive (SSD) also provides a bit of speed increase in this search.
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz | 8GB RAM @ 1866MHz | Intel SSD G2
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Thanks Philip and Graham,
I do not know what these numbers mean, but here is the result from NovaBench.
NovaBench
Score: 332
2/9/2011 5:37:21 PM
Microsoft Windows Vista Home
Premium
Intel Core2 Duo T6400 2.00GHz @ 2000 MHz
Graphics Card: Windows
Live Display Driver
4054 MB System RAM (Score: 108)
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RAM Speed: 2934 MB/s
CPU Tests (Score: 185)
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Floating Point Operations/Second: 48688960
- Integer Operations/Second:
104102936
- MD5 Hashes Generated/Second: 604740
Graphics Tests
(Score: 15)
- 3D Frames Per Second: 54
Hardware Tests
(Score: 24)
- Primary Partition Capacity: 298 GB
- Drive Write
Speed: 66 MB/sI have several complaints about L4, and one of them is that it is slow. Almost every time I click on something, I get a blank screen for a couple of seconds with it saying that Logos Bible Software 4 is not responding. If I type something into notes, I can write a whole paragraph before anything shows.
I only have this problem with L4. (I am running 4.2a Beta 6 [4.21.4.9928])
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tom collinge said:
I have several complaints about L4, and one of them is that it is slow.
My old 2.0 GHz Core 2 Duo laptop posted a similar NovaBench score to yours with Win XP and 2 GB RAM. Yet a search for "the" was done in 19.5s with slightly more hits in 860 resources. So your machine is slow running L4, and i did not experience "hangs" or slow responses. But my 1 Note file does not come close to the volume of Notes that you have.
If you have the space, create a new User Account and install L4. Do not let it sync Notes (Use Internet = No) and delete any that do sync, and see how L4 performs.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Carmen Gauvin-O'Donnell said:
Boy, I love the creative ways people find to waste time!
Well I'm in...NOT a waste of time but a TEST to see if indexing (and merge index) are done
[and after running this needed test of the index program looking at the numbers is OK]
The missing resources are in Greek or Hebrew or other with no English
[and we need a 'word' to to add to the search string to test all the other languages so that ALL resources get listed]
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tom collinge said:
Intel Core2 Duo T6400 2.00GHz @ 2000 MHz
Your CPU @ 2.00GHz is somewhat slow by today's standards. Also, this processor only has a 2MB cache. However, your speeds are still slower than what they should be.
Your hard drive is probably bringing your performance down even more. I would recommend rebooting your computer at least once a day, and running defrag once a week. If your hard drive is more than 50% full you will have a significant performance loss. The closer your drive gets to capacity, the slower it becomes at an exponential rate.
Lastly, I would recommend removing as many programs from automatically loading in the background. See links below:
http://www.vista4beginners.com/System-Configuration-Utility
http://www.techspot.com/tweaks/startup/
Win 7 x64 | Core i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz | 8GB RAM @ 1866MHz | Intel SSD G2
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Phillip said:tom collinge said:
Intel Core2 Duo T6400 2.00GHz @ 2000 MHz
Your CPU @ 2.00GHz is somewhat slow by today's standards. Also, this processor only has a 2MB cache. However, your speeds are still slower than what they should be.
Your hard drive is probably bringing your performance down even more. I would recommend rebooting your computer at least once a day, and running defrag once a week. If your hard drive is more than 50% full you will have a significant performance loss. The closer your drive gets to capacity, the slower it becomes at an exponential rate.
Lastly, I would recommend removing as many programs from automatically loading in the background. See links below:
Phillip,
You are talking to someone who reformats his hard drive once a year. I do not have a lot of items running in the background (I am too lazy to install them), and my hard drive has over 122 Gig of free space.
This being said, your posting got me thinking. I decided to turn off sync, and here are my new numbers:
So I would say that L4 is the cause of my slowness, not my computer.
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tom collinge said:
This being said, your posting got me thinking. I decided to turn off sync, and here are my new numbers:
That was certainly more effective than my suggestion ie. you changed Use Internet to No? The question now is did you also have logging enabled? ie. with Use Internet = Yes and logging disabled do you get the same improvement? I'm assuming that Notes sync has an impact, but we know that logging has an impact during import of Notes. Were you importing Notes when you got the slow search time?
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Phillip said:
If your hard drive is more than 50% full you will have a significant performance loss. The closer your drive gets to capacity, the slower it becomes at an exponential rate.
I didn't know that..I'm going to check into cleaning my out a bit..
Robert Pavich
For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__
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Robert Pavich said:
I didn't know that..I'm going to check into cleaning my out a bit..
The degree of slow down is a surprise but that's why you always need a drive at least 1/3 (33.3%) bigger than the data you want to store on it (or take steps to ensure you have at least 25% spare capacity).
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave Hooton said:tom collinge said:
This being said, your posting got me thinking. I decided to turn off sync, and here are my new numbers:
That was certainly more effective than my suggestion ie. you changed Use Internet to No? The question now is did you also have logging enabled? ie. with Use Internet = Yes and logging disabled do you get the same improvement? I'm assuming that Notes sync has an impact, but we know that logging has an impact during import of Notes. Were you importing Notes when you got the slow search time?
I tend to keep logging off because I import my notes from L3 routinely, and logging has a HUGE impact on importing notes from L3. For the second set of numbers, I turned off the internet setting.
FYI...I imported notes between the two searches so that I can use them for the prep of my next sermon.
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Then it might be instructive to see a log with no Notes being imported and Use Internet = Yes. Also confirm that the search time is impacted.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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